Talk about Will Smith for a second (1 Viewer)

pennstater

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Will Smith his first 4 seasons:
33.5 sacks (Just over 8 per season) 215 Tackles (over 53 per season)

Charles Grant his first 4 seasons
30 sacks (7.5 per season) 234 tackles(over 58 tackles per season)

But After 38 starts in the league Charles Grant's sack number declined imensily.

Will Smith has now started 43 games, and Last season was his lowest sack total in his 4 year career. Grant's sack total was also his lowest during his 4th year as well.

What I eventually want to talk about is the Contract situation. I think Will Smith is an above average player in this league. On the defense that lacks above average players.

Here are some contract figures for Defensive Ends the past few seasons:
Dwight Freeney: 6 years 72 million
Charles Grant: 7 year 63 million
Justin Smith: 6 years 45 million
Justin Tuck: 5 year 30 million
Antwaan Odom: 5 year 29.5 million

Will Smith because of his relative youth and his nack for sacks and FF's I think he would fit right in the Charles Grant type of money. .

I think we have a chance to buy low on Will Smith right now however. He if gets 10 or more sacks this year he might even want more Money that Charles Grant, because of price inflation. And if that is the case, he would be the highest paid saint in Franchise history.

Because we have a new defensive line coach, and the fact we may draft a premier defensive tackle. I think Will Smith's numbers will start to go on the upswing again. And if it happens as I stated earlier he might just price himself out of town.

IMO, if we wait until next year either 2 things will happen. One..he plays good and we will not be able to afford him, or 2 his sack numbers continue like Dwight Freeney and Charles Grant and he continues to lose production year after year and then we won't retain him.

So what in the heck do you think we will do with him?
 

Super Dad

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Make him EARN IT this season. The bottom line is hat this coaching staff and our new D Line coach will know if he is worth the money after this season and IMO he would be if he lost some weight. It is still a wait and see process for Will although I love his upside.
 

guillermo

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I would not trade any player for the risk of him having a good season. If he plays great, we have a good problem, we can always franchise him.

If he plays bad, then we should think on replacing him.
 

SaintsJunkie

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I would not trade any player for the risk of him having a good season. If he plays great, we have a good problem, we can always franchise him.

If he plays bad, then we should think on replacing him.

I agree, but we should replace them anyway and keep it deep at this position, along with cb. these are expensive positions in free agency.
 

iwitnesskr

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Pay him now, will is an elite pass rusher on a poor defense, talent wise and scheme wise. We don't have the athletes at LB to blitz effectively, so our scheme isn't that of an aggressive defense. When we get the athletes to play agressively on the defensive side of the ball, Smith will dominate.

I mean for real, if Morgan and Vilma remain healthy, and we upgrade at corner or DT through the draft, and Gibbs increases his efforts to put pressure on the QB, Smith could easily get 15 sacks.


For real, is it just me, or does will smith get held more than any DE in the league. I mean, I almost want to cry for the guy. Will has the ability to take over games. IMHO, if we let him go it will be a big mistake. Pay him now, I don't need to see more film of Will to deteremine if he is worht the money.
 

dapperdan

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Smith is a tough call. Personally, I don't see him as an elite pass rusher. Above average pass rusher, yes. Potential to be an outstanding, or who knows, maybe an elite pass rusher, ok. But potential does not equal reality. In the real world of the NFL, he really hasn't lived up to his potential.

Smith has not maintained his quickness with the extra weight, imo, and it has negatively affected his pass rushing capabilities.

The difficulty is that Smith, no doubt, seeing Grant's contract, will want to be paid like Grant, or more. On the one hand, you don't build great teams in the salary cap era by continually over-paying for average production. On the other hand, you don't build great teams by releasing quality NFL talent, and there's no doubt that Smith is a quality talent.

If the team plans on keeping Smith, they would be best off signing him to an extension this offseason, rolling the dice that Smith's production catches up to his potential. Negotiating during the season can be a huge distraction. And if the Saints don't plan on resigning Smith, then I would say trade him before the draft to maximize his trade value. There is a dearth of pass-rushing talent in this draft, and now would be the time to get maximum value for Will Smith.
 

Saint Spud

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If he really blows up this year, we can franchise him. No biggie.
 

Saintsfans27

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I think if we HAD to pay one of the two guys that kind of money, it should have been Smith. With that being said, I really like CG and think he deserves to be paid too. IF we have a good year this year on defense, then I say pay him what he deserves. BUT, if we have a year like we did last year on defense, and neithe of the guys improves on their sack totals, one of them should go. There is NO reason to pay two guys, no matter how "good" they are to contiune to NOT get it done.

I don't care what the reasons are, we probaly kept Joe Horn around longer than we should have, and look how that ended. We can't keep holding onto guys becuase of whatever reason if we aren't making it to the playoffs Indianapolis style.

I wear a Will Smith jersey to games all the time. I don't own a Grant jersey, yet. My point is, we need to either change to a cover two defense, or go out and SPEND SOME MONEY on a corner that fits our style of cover defense. The fact we didn't get Samuel is just dumb to me. I'm not mad at our pickups this year, but if we don't get pressure on the QB this year and continue to let people bomb it over our heads, it is going to show me that our coaching staff needs to change their perscriptions.

Bottom line, Smith and Grant need to ste it up, or we need to trade one of them and get something for him (whomever) so that we CAN get the pieces to make something work on defense. I'd love to keep both and pay them both, but not if we can't put some QBs on their backs this year, and in crucial situations that are of value.
 

willbill

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I am more worried about Marcus Colston and Jahri Evans Contracts to be honest. We can replace Will Smith In the draft. We can't have more than one of these guys not under contract after next season or we will surely lose one. And of the 3 players Will Smith is the one we can do without the most. Extend Colston and Evans now. And if you can afford Smith franchise him after next season. If you can't then let him test his value on the open market and maybe we will get a last look at matching the contract.
 

David Robbins

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I will never understand for the life of me why it is that whenever the Saints get a very good player, fans begin to want to trade them off. Wassup with that?
 

meily

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Make him EARN IT this season. The bottom line is hat this coaching staff and our new D Line coach will know if he is worth the money after this season and IMO he would be if he lost some weight. It is still a wait and see process for Will although I love his upside.




I dont get this weight thing everybody is hung up over...after he chased down Josh McCown for that Safety against the Bucs that right there shows you what kinda shape he is in..he had 7 sacks last year, he 'earned" those sacks, there are no other pass rush threats on that defense aside from Grant, so i'm sure he and Smith were the players keyed on when it came to pass rushing..we keep looking to point fingers at individuals and some are warranted, but we dont think how overall bad play affects the 'stars" on our offense and defense.

not bashing or questioning your opinion, thats just my opinion on the weight issue...Payton always gives these guys a weight to play at, and I havent heard anything about Payton being unhappy with Grant or Smiths weight, just Thomas...but maybe the new D-Line coach thinks they both needs to be in the high 270's, who knows.
 
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I will never understand for the life of me why it is that whenever the Saints get a very good player, fans begin to want to trade them off. Wassup with that?

Smith hasn't lived up to his potiential. He is not an elite player. He produces like an average pass rusher. Not an elite player. He does not bring 12-15 sacks a season for us. That would be an elite player, which is not Will smith
 

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Signing McCray will have a lot to do with what we do with Smith next year. Will Smith knows he has to show up this year if he wants the kind of money Grant got last year.

This is what I see happening.
Smith has an above average year (10+sacks) and McCray has good year (8+sacks)
Smith then gets the Franchise tag. (This way we can pay him top 5 money for a year or get 2 first round picks for compensation if he is dealt.) This would give us one more year of evaluating our three high paid DE's and then we make the decision on Smith, Grant, and McCray as a whole the next offseason.
 

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Not to be too negative, but I am way down on Smith.

Based on his numbers he is not an elite pass rusher (8 sacks a season avg.?). He gets the same amount of pressure our OTHER fat DE gets.

1) He is over hyped on this board
2) He has gained way too much weight
3)He is not a difference maker (does not get that big sack ala Joe Johnson)
4) Other teams do not have to game plan around him.
5) He rarely wins the one on one battles.

Sure he has talent, but he is not keeping himself in shape. You do not overpay an underachiever. Everyone was scared when we let Howard walk and we haven't missed a beat. The Saints can upgrade Smith.
 

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IMO Will Smith was worth the 1st rounder and he is in the top half of the REs in the NFL.
His issue seems to be that he tends to dissapear for quarters at a time (so does Grant) and sometimes gets overpowered by NFL LTs.
What I do like is that the guy is a playmaker. He gets his sacks, sure he doesnt log 15 a season, but he causes fumbles! He steps up on 3rd down. He knocked THREE QBs out of games last year. He is fiery and emotional. He gives his best effort.
I was a fan of him in his Ohio State days and I'm telling you, the #s may not say it, but this guy is possibly our best defender.
 

Rugger

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IMO Will Smith was worth the 1st rounder and he is in the top half of the REs in the NFL.
His issue seems to be that he tends to dissapear for quarters at a time (so does Grant) and sometimes gets overpowered by NFL LTs.
What I do like is that the guy is a playmaker. He gets his sacks, sure he doesnt log 15 a season, but he causes fumbles! He steps up on 3rd down. He knocked THREE QBs out of games last year. He is fiery and emotional. He gives his best effort.
I was a fan of him in his Ohio State days and I'm telling you, the #s may not say it, but this guy is possibly our best defender.

Being the best defender on a bad defense does not necessarily say a lot. You can argue , stat wise, that Brooks was our best QB...yea. Not only does he get overwhelmed by stronger OTs, but he gained too much weight and can't beat them to the outside.

I can not remember the last time Will blindsided a QB off the snap. Most of his sacks (off the top of my head) come when the pocket breaks down. Seriously when was the last time he beat an OT off the edge?
 

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