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David Robbins

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I miss your instruction. I have never really played much football so I get confused on some terms. What is 21 personnel and other personnel concepts. Routes. What is a rub route and a dig route and so forth. On defense you have 2 lb's compared to 3. Can you please clear these things up for me. Give me the football lessons I never got. Thanks bro.
 

TribuneUK

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Damn, if I'd known I could just get Dan's football wisdom on demand, I'd have asked this question years ago!

21 personnel - first number is backs in the backfield, second number is TEs.

So 10 is 1 back, no TE.

You work out the no. of WR by exception. So in 21, it's two WR, in 10 it's 4 WR.

Dan, hope you don't mind I took the easy question for you 😎
 

VPCajun

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Damn, if I'd known I could just get Dan's football wisdom on demand, I'd have asked this question years ago!

21 personnel - first number is backs in the backfield, second number is TEs.

So 10 is 1 back, no TE.

You work out the no. of WR by exception. So in 21, it's two WR, in 10 it's 4 WR.

Dan, hope you don't mind I took the easy question for you 😎

And... a rub route is when the receiver gives a nice little gentle rub on the LB's arm as he goes by, and a dig route is when the receiver pokes fun at the LB as he runs by.

Right????

:hihi:
 
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I miss your instruction. I have never really played much football so I get confused on some terms. What is 21 personnel and other personnel concepts. Routes. What is a rub route and a dig route and so forth. On defense you have 2 lb's compared to 3. Can you please clear these things up for me. Give me the football lessons I never got. Thanks bro.
I’m obviously not Dan, but I’m not sure how active he’s been on here lately so I’ll also give it a shot at explaining a few things to the best of my knowledge.

A dig route is a route where the WR runs a few yards downfield (about 5 to 10 yards or so depending on what the play design calls for) and then cuts 90° towards the middle of the field and runs parallel to the line of scrimmage. It’s also commonly referred to as a “drag” or an “in” which is as its name infers, an inward breaking route (towards the middle part of the field, i.e. the hash marks) as opposed to an “out” route, where it’s breaking to the sideline.

Here’s a nice little diagram of the “route tree” to give a visual description if needed...


A “rub” route isn’t specifically a route but an offensive concept. It’s a combination of multiple routes run by more than one eligible receiver that are designed to gain separation from the defender in man coverage; essentially a “pick play” like in basketball. For example, with the defense in man coverage, you line up two WR’s on the same side of the field and the outside WR runs a slant (a short, inward breaking route), while the inside WR runs a flat (a short, outward breaking route) where the two players’ paths will cross. The inside WR would run his route where his path after he cuts outward will impede the CB (even just slightly) that’s trying to cover the outside WR and freeing him to make a catch and run, hence “rubbing off” the CB. It doesn’t have to consist of only a combination of a slant and a flat route, many different routes can be used in a rub concept, just that as long as the routes are runin close enough proximity where one of the offensive players can affect the defenders coverage of the other WR, or even better, if the offensive players can make the defenders run into each other.

As for the 3 LB vs. 2 LB’s, typically when there are 3 LB’s on the field for a 4-3 defense, the defense is in its “base personnel” (4 DL, 3 LB, and 4 DB). Sometimes they’ll sub out a LB (usually the SAM, or strong side LB) for an additional defensive back which is referred to as a “nickel” defense since you now have 5 defensive backs on the field. There are two main forms of nickel defense: “regular nickel” (where they’ll bring in a 3rd CB to play the slot) and “big nickel” (where they’ll bring in a 3rd safety instead of a CB, like we do with Gardner-Johnson).

I saw TribuneUK knocked out the personnel question pretty well, so I’ll only further add on to his post.

As he said, essentially the personnel numbers tell you how many RB’s and how many TE’s are on the field at any given time. And since there are only 5 eligible receivers on the field at any given time (excluding the QB), you can deduce how many WR’s are also on the field with the personnel number...
  • 10 personnel: 1 RB, 0 TE, 4 WR
  • 11 personnel: 1 RB, 1 TE, 3 WR
  • 12 personnel: 1 RB, 2 TE, 2 WR
  • 13 personnel: 1 RB, 3 TE, 1 WR
  • 20 personnel: 2 RB, 0 TE, 3 WR
  • 21 personnel: 2 RB, 1 TE, 2 WR
  • 22 personnel: 2 RB, 2 TE, 1 WR
  • 23 personnel: 2 RB, 3 TE, 0 WR
And so on and so forth, some of those are more commonly seen than others. But essentially the lower those 2 numbers are, the more WR’s on the field, such as “00 personnel” which is 5 WR’s on the field.
 
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David Robbins

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I’m obviously not Dan, but I’m not sure how active he’s been on here lately so I’ll also give it a shot at explaining a few things to the best of my knowledge.

A dig route is a route where the WR runs a few yards downfield (about 5 to 10 yards or so depending on what the play design calls for) and then cuts 90° towards the middle of the field and runs parallel to the line of scrimmage. It’s also commonly referred to as a “drag” or an “in” which is as its name infers, an inward breaking route (towards the middle part of the field, i.e. the hash marks) as opposed to an “out” route, where it’s breaking to the sideline.

Here’s a nice little diagram of the “route tree” to give a visual description if needed...


A “rub” route isn’t specifically a route but an offensive concept. It’s a combination of multiple routes run by more than one eligible receiver that are designed to gain separation from the defender in man coverage; essentially a “pick play” like in basketball. For example, with the defense in man coverage, you line up two WR’s on the same side of the field and the outside WR runs a slant (a short, inward breaking route), while the inside WR runs a flat (a short, outward breaking route) where the two players’ paths will cross. The inside WR would run his route where his path after he cuts outward will impede the CB (even just slightly) that’s trying to cover the outside WR and freeing him to make a catch and run, hence “rubbing off” the CB. It doesn’t have to consist of only a combination of a slant and a flat route, many different routes can be used in a rub concept, just that as long as the routes are runin close enough proximity where one of the offensive players can affect the defenders coverage of the other WR, or even better, if the offensive players can make the defenders run into each other.

As for the 3 LB vs. 2 LB’s, typically when there are 3 LB’s on the field for a 4-3 defense, the defense is in its “base personnel” (4 DL, 3 LB, and 4 DB). Sometimes they’ll sub out a LB (usually the SAM, or strong side LB) for an additional defensive back which is referred to as a “nickel” defense since you now have 5 defensive backs on the field. There are two main forms of nickel defense: “regular nickel” (where they’ll bring in a 3rd CB to play the slot) and “big nickel” (where they’ll bring in a 3rd safety instead of a CB, like we do with Gardner-Johnson).

I saw TribuneUK knocked out the personnel question pretty well, so I’ll only further add on to his post.

As he said, essentially the personnel numbers tell you how many RB’s and how many TE’s are on the field at any given time. And since there are only 5 eligible receivers on the field at any given time (excluding the QB), you can deduce how many WR’s are also on the field with the personnel number...
  • 10 personnel: 1 RB, 0 TE, 4 WR
  • 11 personnel: 1 RB, 1 TE, 3 WR
  • 12 personnel: 1 RB, 2 TE, 2 WR
  • 13 personnel: 1 RB, 3 TE, 1 WR
  • 20 personnel: 2 RB, 0 TE, 3 WR
  • 21 personnel: 2 RB, 1 TE, 2 WR
  • 22 personnel: 2 RB, 2 TE, 1 WR
  • 23 personnel: 2 RB, 3 TE, 0 WR
And so on and so forth, some of those are more commonly seen than others. But essentially the lower those 2 numbers are, the more WR’s on the field, such as “00 personnel” which is 5 WR’s on the field.
Wow. Thanks. That is so helpful.
 

RadsRock

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I'd love to know how they get the personnel groupings in, and on time.

How many must there be? And every player knows which of all those he is/is not a part of... And be within earshot of CSP or whomever is making the call (for instance if the WR coach gets it from Sean and passes it along).

And they manage to do that in time to huddle, and get it right 99.9% if the time.

It boggles my mind.
 
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David Robbins

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I'd love to know how they get the personnel groupings in, and on time.

How many must there be? And every player knows which of all those he is/is not a part of... And be within earshot of CSP or whomever is making the call (for instance if the WR coach gets it from Sean and passes it along).

And they manage to do that in time to huddle, and get it right 99.9% if the time.

It boggles my mind.
I have wondered about that myself.
 

TribuneUK

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I’m obviously not Dan, but I’m not sure how active he’s been on here lately so I’ll also give it a shot at explaining a few things to the best of my knowledge.

A dig route is a route where the WR runs a few yards downfield (about 5 to 10 yards or so depending on what the play design calls for) and then cuts 90° towards the middle of the field and runs parallel to the line of scrimmage. It’s also commonly referred to as a “drag” or an “in” which is as its name infers, an inward breaking route (towards the middle part of the field, i.e. the hash marks) as opposed to an “out” route, where it’s breaking to the sideline.

Here’s a nice little diagram of the “route tree” to give a visual description if needed...


A “rub” route isn’t specifically a route but an offensive concept. It’s a combination of multiple routes run by more than one eligible receiver that are designed to gain separation from the defender in man coverage; essentially a “pick play” like in basketball. For example, with the defense in man coverage, you line up two WR’s on the same side of the field and the outside WR runs a slant (a short, inward breaking route), while the inside WR runs a flat (a short, outward breaking route) where the two players’ paths will cross. The inside WR would run his route where his path after he cuts outward will impede the CB (even just slightly) that’s trying to cover the outside WR and freeing him to make a catch and run, hence “rubbing off” the CB. It doesn’t have to consist of only a combination of a slant and a flat route, many different routes can be used in a rub concept, just that as long as the routes are runin close enough proximity where one of the offensive players can affect the defenders coverage of the other WR, or even better, if the offensive players can make the defenders run into each other.

As for the 3 LB vs. 2 LB’s, typically when there are 3 LB’s on the field for a 4-3 defense, the defense is in its “base personnel” (4 DL, 3 LB, and 4 DB). Sometimes they’ll sub out a LB (usually the SAM, or strong side LB) for an additional defensive back which is referred to as a “nickel” defense since you now have 5 defensive backs on the field. There are two main forms of nickel defense: “regular nickel” (where they’ll bring in a 3rd CB to play the slot) and “big nickel” (where they’ll bring in a 3rd safety instead of a CB, like we do with Gardner-Johnson).

I saw TribuneUK knocked out the personnel question pretty well, so I’ll only further add on to his post.

As he said, essentially the personnel numbers tell you how many RB’s and how many TE’s are on the field at any given time. And since there are only 5 eligible receivers on the field at any given time (excluding the QB), you can deduce how many WR’s are also on the field with the personnel number...
  • 10 personnel: 1 RB, 0 TE, 4 WR
  • 11 personnel: 1 RB, 1 TE, 3 WR
  • 12 personnel: 1 RB, 2 TE, 2 WR
  • 13 personnel: 1 RB, 3 TE, 1 WR
  • 20 personnel: 2 RB, 0 TE, 3 WR
  • 21 personnel: 2 RB, 1 TE, 2 WR
  • 22 personnel: 2 RB, 2 TE, 1 WR
  • 23 personnel: 2 RB, 3 TE, 0 WR
And so on and so forth, some of those are more commonly seen than others. But essentially the lower those 2 numbers are, the more WR’s on the field, such as “00 personnel” which is 5 WR’s on the field.
Building on the route tree (and there are different ones for TE and RB, as well as the WR one shared by Alan), there are also numerous passing concepts that are constructed from combinations of two or more routes being run on the field on a given play. Each concept is designed to create a mismatch and/or conflict within the pass defense.

Rub routes are actually an example of creating a passing concept, as they create problems for man to man defenses. Mesh is probably the best known of these.

But more classic examples of a concept are smash, snag, stick and sail. And many more. Smart Football is pretty good at going through these e.g. http://smartfootball.com/passing/sn...gles-in-the-passing-game#sthash.hAWs0ZRo.dpbs
 

Pocket Hercules

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I’m obviously not Dan, but I’m not sure how active he’s been on here lately so I’ll also give it a shot at explaining a few things to the best of my knowledge.

A dig route is a route where the WR runs a few yards downfield (about 5 to 10 yards or so depending on what the play design calls for) and then cuts 90° towards the middle of the field and runs parallel to the line of scrimmage. It’s also commonly referred to as a “drag” or an “in” which is as its name infers, an inward breaking route (towards the middle part of the field, i.e. the hash marks) as opposed to an “out” route, where it’s breaking to the sideline.

Here’s a nice little diagram of the “route tree” to give a visual description if needed...


A “rub” route isn’t specifically a route but an offensive concept. It’s a combination of multiple routes run by more than one eligible receiver that are designed to gain separation from the defender in man coverage; essentially a “pick play” like in basketball. For example, with the defense in man coverage, you line up two WR’s on the same side of the field and the outside WR runs a slant (a short, inward breaking route), while the inside WR runs a flat (a short, outward breaking route) where the two players’ paths will cross. The inside WR would run his route where his path after he cuts outward will impede the CB (even just slightly) that’s trying to cover the outside WR and freeing him to make a catch and run, hence “rubbing off” the CB. It doesn’t have to consist of only a combination of a slant and a flat route, many different routes can be used in a rub concept, just that as long as the routes are runin close enough proximity where one of the offensive players can affect the defenders coverage of the other WR, or even better, if the offensive players can make the defenders run into each other.

As for the 3 LB vs. 2 LB’s, typically when there are 3 LB’s on the field for a 4-3 defense, the defense is in its “base personnel” (4 DL, 3 LB, and 4 DB). Sometimes they’ll sub out a LB (usually the SAM, or strong side LB) for an additional defensive back which is referred to as a “nickel” defense since you now have 5 defensive backs on the field. There are two main forms of nickel defense: “regular nickel” (where they’ll bring in a 3rd CB to play the slot) and “big nickel” (where they’ll bring in a 3rd safety instead of a CB, like we do with Gardner-Johnson).

I saw TribuneUK knocked out the personnel question pretty well, so I’ll only further add on to his post.

As he said, essentially the personnel numbers tell you how many RB’s and how many TE’s are on the field at any given time. And since there are only 5 eligible receivers on the field at any given time (excluding the QB), you can deduce how many WR’s are also on the field with the personnel number...
  • 10 personnel: 1 RB, 0 TE, 4 WR
  • 11 personnel: 1 RB, 1 TE, 3 WR
  • 12 personnel: 1 RB, 2 TE, 2 WR
  • 13 personnel: 1 RB, 3 TE, 1 WR
  • 20 personnel: 2 RB, 0 TE, 3 WR
  • 21 personnel: 2 RB, 1 TE, 2 WR
  • 22 personnel: 2 RB, 2 TE, 1 WR
  • 23 personnel: 2 RB, 3 TE, 0 WR
And so on and so forth, some of those are more commonly seen than others. But essentially the lower those 2 numbers are, the more WR’s on the field, such as “00 personnel” which is 5 WR’s on the field.
Good stuff, thanks for putting in the work on this post. I would only add that a "drag" route is, by design, a route that starts on one side of the formation and crosses all the way to the other side of the field, usually at the LB level. A "shallow drag" is run behind the DL and in front of the LB's.
 

Dan in Lafayette

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TCUDan has been coaching internationally for many years now. I have tried to keep up with his career. The latest I have on him is he was signed as the head coach for Firenze Guelfi in Italy.

Below is a link to an article from October of last year with an interview with Dan. He has quite the resume'. I don't know if the league was active this year or not. Maybe our European members can help out on that.

1605724158091.png

 

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