The Electric Vehicle (EV) discussion thread (Merged) (4 Viewers)

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Dago

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Yes, but I think you get credits from the energy company until you sell and move. At least that was the case when I looked into it.

ETA looks like they basically killed it...

On the surface, this looks mean and evil, but if he is correct that 3 cents per kilowatt hour is approximately an industry standard AND that the cap was preventing people from getting the benefits of the 10 cents per kilowatt hour, then this may not be that bad.
Would take some number crunching to figure out

IMO, a fair compromise would have been to reinstate the state credits so you still have an upfront incentive
 
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On the surface, this looks mean and evil, but if he is correct that 3 cents per kilowatt hour is approximately an industry standard AND that the cap was preventing people from getting the benefits of the 10 cents per kilowatt hour, then this may not be that bad.
Would take some number crunching to figure out

IMO, a fair compromise would have been to reinstate the state credits so you still have an upfront incentive
I just have a problem with home owners having to sell at wholesale and then buy back at full cost. IMHO it should be consistent. If you force them to sell at wholesale then you shouldn't be allowed to turn around and get retail back from them.
 

Dago

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I just have a problem with home owners having to sell at wholesale and then buy back at full cost. IMHO it should be consistent. If you force them to sell at wholesale then you shouldn't be allowed to turn around and get retail back from them.
Why should the electric company act as a free battery for the customer?
 
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Why should the electric company act as a free battery for the customer?
Why should the electric company be able to buy that power at the lower price during peak periods when the sun is out and sell it to another customer for triple what they paid as well as sell it back to the original customer later at that same mark up?
 

Dago

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Why shouldn't they?
Because it isn't their responsibility

Do you force Walmart to store food for farmers for free? If we were talking about any other commodity, the idea would be ludicrous

The electric company didn't sign on to subsidize solar power and shouldn't lose money providing energy to people who have it. One source of electricity is no different to them than any other so why should they be forced to pay more? Any other provider gets to choose who they purchase from

You all are saying that we should legislate that the power company lose money providing electricity to people who have solar.

So now are you going to answer my question or is the answer "because I like solar and I think they should"?
 

Dago

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Why should the electric company be able to buy that power at the lower price during peak periods when the sun is out and sell it to another customer for triple what they paid as well as sell it back to the original customer later at that same mark up?
Again, I did stipulate IF that price is accurate

A person who has solar panels is just another vendor to the power company. Why should they be forced to pay triple the market rate from them? (Again, assuming the numbers stated are accurate)
 
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Again, I did stipulate IF that price is accurate

A person who has solar panels is just another vendor to the power company. Why should they be forced to pay triple the market rate from them? (Again, assuming the numbers stated are accurate)
The article I linked broke down the pricing. The electric can buy surplus from a home solar installation at .03$ per KWh and then sell it for .10$ per KWh.

You seem to be fixated only on the business side and them making money. Have you considered your own statement that there isn't enough power on the grid to support EVs? That's not the consumer problem that is the business not building out supply. This is a way to offset CO2 by letting homeowners supplement peak times and save the electric company money in building out supply. We shouldn't be accepting crappy service at high cost and then subsidizing them even more by letting them make more money off of enterprising home owners who are actually providing a service to their neighbors and the environment IMHO.
 
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Whatever happened to our research into Hydrogen powered vehicles? I did some research and found that it is still going on, but why isn't that making the news? Wouldn't it be better than battery powered? I mean, I know they still use batteries to store energy, like the energy lost when braking, but they refuel faster, emit water vapor, etc. What's the deal?
The source to wheel efficiency of hydrogen is crap. Second is that most hydrogen generation is done by cracking hydrocarbons, which worsens the greenhouse effect. Finally, hydrogen is a throwback to the centralized distribution and transportation of fuel along the lines of gasoline. And let's not even talk about the unsubsidized price of hydrogen and the cost of hydrogen fueling stations.

Comparative efficiencies:

efficiency-compared-battery-electric-73-hydrogen-22-ice-13.jpg

SFIAH
 
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Can you sell electricity to Entergy in Louisiana if you produce extra juice from solar?
Here you go:
  • During each billing month, customers will pay the applicable retail rate for all electricity (in kWh) purchased from the utility and will receive the full retail value for all electricity that they produce and use behind the meter at their home or business. Any surplus energy not used by the customer and sent back to the grid will be credited on the customer's bill at the current Avoided Cost rate of approximately $0.0208 beginning April 1, 2021.
from: https://www.entergy-louisiana.com/net_metering/

2 cents a kwh is a crap rate especially when incoming electricity is purchased at the retail rate. All utilities are going end up doing is forcing folks off grid using larger solar installations coupled with larger battery banks since many energy companies seem disinterested in buying solar at a competitive rate.

SFIAH
 

Taurus

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Because it isn't their responsibility

Do you force Walmart to store food for farmers for free? If we were talking about any other commodity, the idea would be ludicrous

The electric company didn't sign on to subsidize solar power and shouldn't lose money providing energy to people who have it. One source of electricity is no different to them than any other so why should they be forced to pay more? Any other provider gets to choose who they purchase from

You all are saying that we should legislate that the power company lose money providing electricity to people who have solar.

So now are you going to answer my question or is the answer "because I like solar and I think they should"?

No.

I'll answer with 'Because the electric company is a publicly-allowed monopoly with a set of restrictions on how they operate.'
A slight markup to ensure they don't lose money is fine. Buying at wholesale and selling at retail is simply profiteering.
 

DaveXA

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No.

I'll answer with 'Because the electric company is a publicly-allowed monopoly with a set of restrictions on how they operate.'
A slight markup to ensure they don't lose money is fine. Buying at wholesale and selling at retail is simply profiteering.
Sure, but are they making that much money selling retail? Why shouldn't they sell at retail like any other business?
 

Taurus

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Sure, but are they making that much money selling retail? Why shouldn't they sell at retail like any other business?

Because they're selling it right back to the producer. Also, because they're a public utility.
See, we can make public utilities act in our best interests instead of their own. I have no idea why we'd do anything else.
 

Dago

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The article I linked broke down the pricing. The electric can buy surplus from a home solar installation at .03$ per KWh and then sell it for .10$ per KWh.

You seem to be fixated only on the business side and them making money. Have you considered your own statement that there isn't enough power on the grid to support EVs? That's not the consumer problem that is the business not building out supply. This is a way to offset CO2 by letting homeowners supplement peak times and save the electric company money in building out supply. We shouldn't be accepting crappy service at high cost and then subsidizing them even more by letting them make more money off of enterprising home owners who are actually providing a service to their neighbors and the environment IMHO.
Except that you are advocating that the company should lose money dealing with people who use solar. In effect, you don't want them to pay for electricity at all since you want the power company to "store" their surplus for free

So that means everyone else gets to subsidize the cost of labor and materials in getting power to that residence since that residence won't be paying anything towards upkeep of the grid. Do you think it's cheap to get a bucket truck and a crew out to fix a blown transformer or downed lines? What about all the other employees?

You are advocating a business model that has an end result of putting the company out of business and destroying the grid.

And you still haven't answered why the company should be forced to pay 3.3x more for power from one source when it can get it far cheaper elsewhere. Electricity is a commodity just like any other product.

Now I could see something more than 3 cents, but anybody who has ever managed or owned a business can see that forcing a business to pay exactly what they charge for a product is a quick way to go out of business
 

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