The Main Reason Mark Ingram Will NOT Be Successful This Season. (1 Viewer)

[Saints 4 life]

As I said before, we do not KNOW. All I want is to be able to properly evaluate him. I am not saying that he deserves to start and lets cut Ivory, Cadet and relegate Pierre to a back-up role. What I am saying is that he will never be successful getting 7 carries per game. And on top of that, we will never know what we have until he gets the proper amount of carries.

I hear ya. I want nothing more than to have him succeed for us, but I've grown tired of what I have seen thus far. Just being honest.

 

[MrEMann83]

Then answer mine. Why take the ball out of Brees' hands? You know PT is going to get his carries because he's our Best RB. He's getting his carries. Why give Ingram more carries and Brees less throws? I've read what you've wrote previously, and I don't see how it can happen without taking snaps away from Brees. And that won't happen.

Ok. For the same reason you take the ball out of Kobe's hands to pass to Shaquille O' Neal. Because you have to have balance. You don't have to be successful all the time, but at least commit to balance. Now, in the end, you will need to be successful but you'll never know unless you try.

2nd answer: Ask Brees if he would rather take 10 more of his throws and give them to Ingram. See what he says. He has begged for balance just like the fan base, just like the analysts, just like Payton. If you want Brees to last more than 2-3 more years, stop making him throw the ball 600 times per year. A persons arm can only last so long.

3rd answer: BECAUSE we signed Brees to a 100 million dollar contract, and with that is an expectation of winning. If you want to keep Brees upright, run the ball. If you want him to be play-action successful, run the ball. If you want our Defense to be better, run the ball. If you want our leads to be maintained in the 4th quarter, which we have led in 5 games this season in the 4th, then run the ball.

Running the ball early and often wears the DL down in the 4th. This leads to less pressure on the QB from the tired pass-rushers, and more success running in the 4th, due to the tired defense, which helps preserve the lead.

Thats why.

 

[J-bud]

our running problem is not our backs, its line play, blocking, i am hoping with Krom back coaching the line things will get better

 

[PTisCruisin]

Ok. For the same reason you take the ball out of Kobe's hands to pass to Shaquille O' Neal. Because you have to have balance. You don't have to be successful all the time, but at least commit to balance. Now, in the end, you will need to be successful but you'll never know unless you try.

I already talked about balance and agreed that you need it. But when you say take the ball out of Kobe's hands and give it to Shaq, that is just absurd because after Brees, Ingram certainly wouldn't be a "Shaq." The drop from Kobe to Shaq wasn't that great, but from Brees to Ingram, oh, it's pretty big.

2nd answer: Ask Brees if he would rather take 10 more of his throws and give them to Ingram. See what he says. He has begged for balance just like the fan base, just like the analysts, just like Payton. If you want Brees to last more than 2-3 more years, stop making him throw the ball 600 times per year. A persons arm can only last so long.

I bet you he does want balance, but I would also bet he wants the best chance for balance, and THIS YEAR, the answer isn't Ingram, it's Pierre Thomas.

3rd answer: BECAUSE we signed Brees to a 100 million dollar contract, and with that is an expectation of winning. If you want to keep Brees upright, run the ball. If you want him to be play-action successful, run the ball. If you want our Defense to be better, run the ball. If you want our leads to be maintained in the 4th quarter, which we have led in 5 games this season in the 4th, then run the ball.

Of course you want to run the ball, but what's the point if you're only getting 3 yards a carry? Again, this goes back to the balance thing, and like I already said," You run the ball to keep the defense honest and if you're having success you go further." Is there something you disagree with about that? It doesn't really seem like it.

Running the ball early and often wears the DL down in the 4th. This leads to less pressure on the QB from the tired pass-rushers, and more success running in the 4th, due to the tired defense, which helps preserve the lead.

Well, of course. But you still really haven't answered my question. If we aren't having success running the ball, and we really haven't all year, then why take the ball out of Drew Brees' hands?

I agree with you that Ingram won't have success this year, but I don't think giving him more carries is going to change anything. Since we aren't having much success at all in the run game, we shouldn't be taking the ball out of Brees' hands too often. We wouldn't have much shot at all of winning if we did. Not with the defense allowing Freeman to throw for over 400 yards. WE need every score we can get and that will come this year mostly by the hands of Drew Brees.

 

[SaintJ]

Honestly, at this point he looks like a slightly better Mike Bell.

When he just hits the hole pretty hard, he can drag some guys, but he doesn't have a ton of vision, can't really bounce anything outside, and doesn't have much missability.

They knew we were running when Mike Bell came into the game, too.

Why is it killing so many people to admit we just whiffed big on a draft pick, and got just another guy? What on earth has he ever done during a game to warrant more than the carries he gets?

I know a guy who's a successful high school basketball coach. His philosophy is, players in tryouts, their job isn't to prove they deserve a chance -- it's to prove to the coach that it's a mistake not to have them in all the time.

And Mark Ingram's failed to do that so far in his career.

 

[TDDV]

It's time to activate Ivory. He deserves a chance at this point.

If Ingram weren't playing so bad I'd think otherwise but we are 2-4. We have nothing to lose. Deactivate Cadet and activate Ivory if you want to keep Ingram in uniform.

We need Drew for the whole season. Ivory can't protect the QB.

 

[Elvis]

If Ingram needs to get a ton of carries to get more than 1 yard, then we should just get rid of him. What other position would we allow that excuse? Would we say Brees needs at least 20 attempts to make a completion over 1 yard?

I'm tired of the excuses. When he gets the ball he needs to do his job. Period.

 

[CantonLegend]

If Ingram needs to get a ton of carries to get more than 1 yard, then we should just get rid of him. What other position would we allow that excuse? Would we say Brees needs at least 20 attempts to make a completion over 1 yard?

I'm tired of the excuses. When he gets the ball he needs to do his job. Period.

i dont think anyone has made that excuse once

any running back in the league needs more than a few carries to have a good game.

ingram is no different. what do you honestly expect out of a guy that gets less than 10 touches per game?

 

[bobad]

Yes it is because they run the ball 95% of the time straight up the middle with him that why everyone bites on it and why he gets stopped everytime. Try a screen or pitch once and awhile jesus please we are sitting this guy up for failure and no one is realizing it

I agree.

I still think Ivory is the stronger runner, getting more yards with poor blocking.

 

[Poppy]

He had a long of 8 or 9, and a good 3rd and short. I'd like to see him in space before I write him off, but he did his job today.

He doesnt even know where space is.

 

[jt21]

Unlike Thomas and Sproles, Ingram isn't elusive and doesn't have the same lateral agility that you need to avoid tackles in close areas. He's a guy who can excel as a downfield runner through massive holes, but if the offensive line isn't doing much in terms of run blocking (and they aren't), he's not going to run well.

IMO one area that really stands out compared to someone like Pierre is his pad level, he runs really upright which makes it harder for him to bounce off of tacklers. For a college comparison, look at Marcus Lattimore of South Carolina - like Ingram, doesn't have amazing speed but Lattimore clearly knows how to run, he's shifty and consistently runs with a low pad level and is a great player despite being behind one of the worst run-blocking lines in all of college football.

I think Ingram could be really good if he's not forced to elude or break tackles, but otherwise he's more or less Shonne Green.

 

[MrEMann83]

If Ingram needs to get a ton of carries to get more than 1 yard, then we should just get rid of him. What other position would we allow that excuse? Would we say Brees needs at least 20 attempts to make a completion over 1 yard?

I'm tired of the excuses. When he gets the ball he needs to do his job. Period.

It isn't about that 1 yard. Its about that 20+ yarder in a crucial moment because the defense is tired and because he has found his groove.

 

[mither_rome]

Ok. For the same reason you take the ball out of Kobe's hands to pass to Shaquille O' Neal. Because you have to have balance. You don't have to be successful all the time, but at least commit to balance. Now, in the end, you will need to be successful but you'll never know unless you try.

2nd answer: Ask Brees if he would rather take 10 more of his throws and give them to Ingram. See what he says. He has begged for balance just like the fan base, just like the analysts, just like Payton. If you want Brees to last more than 2-3 more years, stop making him throw the ball 600 times per year. A persons arm can only last so long.

3rd answer: BECAUSE we signed Brees to a 100 million dollar contract, and with that is an expectation of winning. If you want to keep Brees upright, run the ball. If you want him to be play-action successful, run the ball. If you want our Defense to be better, run the ball. If you want our leads to be maintained in the 4th quarter, which we have led in 5 games this season in the 4th, then run the ball.

Running the ball early and often wears the DL down in the 4th. This leads to less pressure on the QB from the tired pass-rushers, and more success running in the 4th, due to the tired defense, which helps preserve the lead.

Thats why.

Shaquille O'Neal is 6th all time in scoring in the history of the NBA, with multiple championships and all star appearances. Mark Ingram has played 2 years in the NFL, and has averaged slightly less than 3 yards a carry in that time. Your comparison is absolutely delusional. Defend Ingram all you want - but that's just silly.

 

[mc4saints]

I still think Ivory is the stronger runner, getting more yards with poor blocking.

When he just hits the hole pretty hard, he can drag some guys, but he doesn't have a ton of vision, can't really bounce anything outside, and doesn't have much missability.

I agree that we are not great at run blocking but like BoBad said, Ivory seemed to do better with poor blocking and as SaintJ said, he doesn't seem to see the tiny holes that elite backs that cost 2 1st rounders usually see at this point in there career. Mark doesn't always have to just follow bad blocks and bury his head for 2 yards. I expected more creativity out of him based on what I saw of him in college.

 

[Saint_Ward]

Just like last time, no one really ran well today. I did think Ingram ran with more authority and had a few nice plays. He was actually our most effective runner overall.

We really just used the run to set up Play Action passing, and let Drew do his thing. Until Ingram, or PT for that matter are in for 3-6 snaps in a row, it's hard to judge them.

Also, notice none of our backs really got the ball much or made many plays, other than Sproles. Is that teams taking them out of the play or is it that we're not setting up our plays properly? It's not about just callling or designing a good play, Payton was also pretty good at calling a play just to set up the next one.

Also, bringing up Ivory is unfair. He hasn't played a single real game with this current team. So, using past performance doesn't mean anything. PT had one great game, but hasn't been able to duplicate it. This issue is far beyond our backs.