This defense scares me (1 Viewer)

[rsmith2783]

Our LB’s didn’t play very well.

I agree as well.

 

[japan]

I'm sure Bill Belichick is nervous following their poor showing Thursday...

 

[blackadder]

Before I begin, I will point out the obvious and also the most common quoted phrases around this time of year:

• It's just preseason
• We didn't gameplan
• Most of our starters didn't play
• We were vanilla (which I suppose the opposing team decided to go with whip cream & sprinkles)
• Quit overreacting

While some of these phrases can be true, it does not mean to totally ignore what you saw. There were some positives from the game, but mostly from individuals instead of the entire unit.
What concerns me the most about this defense is that it appears that we have went away from our Man scheme to a more Zone heavy scheme. If something is working, then why switch it? Also if it was working well, then why change?

After watching this past game, I immediately went back to last year's 1st preseason game against the Browns. We lost, but if you remember, it was the 3rd team defense and the wonder play of Damian Swann that helped the Browns get the win. However our 1st team defense played well(as a unit) and left fans for a reason to be optimistic concerning the defense.

After watching the recent game twice, I honestly cannot say that I feel the same.
Last preseason the Saints' defense took the league by storm. We were very aggressive, we played a lot of Press-Man defense and we finished 2nd in total yards surrendered (preseason) and 3rd in least points given up.
Last year the preseason set the tone and gave us a preview as to how the regular season would play out: strong defense, low scoring/ball control offense.

As we all remember, the Saints started out 0-2 after getting demolished by the Pats & Vikings. It was rumored that Kenny Vaccaro had a players only meeting, and then suggested to the coaches that the team goes back to the defense that was played during the preseason. I'm not sure, how true that is, but after that meeting, the defense dramatically improved and the Saints went on an 8 game winning streak. In my opinion, the 2017 defense was the real MVP of the season.
We allowed Kenny to walk and it has been stated that we want to play a more traditional safety set. Did we make a mistake? Are we still trying to implement the same defense that we saw during the 1st two games of last season?

Why I dislike Zone
It's not that I hate Zone, I actually love a team that plays a good zone defense. However, it's just that whenever we went to a Zone heavy Scheme under Sean Payton, the defense has never played well. For some odd reason, we have always been a team that plays well with an aggressive scheme and playing man coverage with a single high safety. Even under Steve Spagnuolo, the defense looked totally different when we played the Eagles vs many of the other games that we played that year.

When the Saints have played Zone, we have seen blown coverages, players getting to the ball too late, players looking confused before the snap, etc.
If Lattimore & Crawley are better fit for a Man scheme, then why are we implementing something that is not to their strength? During the game I saw pre-snap looks that resemble Cover 4, and we were getting picked apart against a QB who did not scheme against us.

Time will tell
I hope that I am wrong and that maybe we were just trying out certain concepts that will change with each preseason game that passes by. I hope I am wrong, and I would love to be wrong. Feel free to bump this thread during the regular season and I will gladly eat crow.

It's just preseason.

But on zone, I agree.

It's never been a strong suit and always leaky when deployed by the Saints. Hope we see it just situationally.

 

[rail]

Pfffft

 

[Madmarsha]

Come on, it's a little too early for this .....

 

[State Of Affairs]

Before I begin, I will point out the obvious and also the most common quoted phrases around this time of year:

• It's just preseason
• We didn't gameplan
• Most of our starters didn't play
• We were vanilla (which I suppose the opposing team decided to go with whip cream & sprinkles)
• Quit overreacting

While some of these phrases can be true, it does not mean to totally ignore what you saw. There were some positives from the game, but mostly from individuals instead of the entire unit.
What concerns me the most about this defense is that it appears that we have went away from our Man scheme to a more Zone heavy scheme. If something is working, then why switch it? Also if it was working well, then why change?

After watching this past game, I immediately went back to last year's 1st preseason game against the Browns. We lost, but if you remember, it was the 3rd team defense and the wonder play of Damian Swann that helped the Browns get the win. However our 1st team defense played well(as a unit) and left fans for a reason to be optimistic concerning the defense.

After watching the recent game twice, I honestly cannot say that I feel the same.
Last preseason the Saints' defense took the league by storm. We were very aggressive, we played a lot of Press-Man defense and we finished 2nd in total yards surrendered (preseason) and 3rd in least points given up.
Last year the preseason set the tone and gave us a preview as to how the regular season would play out: strong defense, low scoring/ball control offense.

As we all remember, the Saints started out 0-2 after getting demolished by the Pats & Vikings. It was rumored that Kenny Vaccaro had a players only meeting, and then suggested to the coaches that the team goes back to the defense that was played during the preseason. I'm not sure, how true that is, but after that meeting, the defense dramatically improved and the Saints went on an 8 game winning streak. In my opinion, the 2017 defense was the real MVP of the season.
We allowed Kenny to walk and it has been stated that we want to play a more traditional safety set. Did we make a mistake? Are we still trying to implement the same defense that we saw during the 1st two games of last season?

Why I dislike Zone
It's not that I hate Zone, I actually love a team that plays a good zone defense. However, it's just that whenever we went to a Zone heavy Scheme under Sean Payton, the defense has never played well. For some odd reason, we have always been a team that plays well with an aggressive scheme and playing man coverage with a single high safety. Even under Steve Spagnuolo, the defense looked totally different when we played the Eagles vs many of the other games that we played that year.

When the Saints have played Zone, we have seen blown coverages, players getting to the ball too late, players looking confused before the snap, etc.
If Lattimore & Crawley are better fit for a Man scheme, then why are we implementing something that is not to their strength? During the game I saw pre-snap looks that resemble Cover 4, and we were getting picked apart against a QB who did not scheme against us.

Time will tell
I hope that I am wrong and that maybe we were just trying out certain concepts that will change with each preseason game that passes by. I hope I am wrong, and I would love to be wrong. Feel free to bump this thread during the regular season and I will gladly eat crow.

I can’t see how people will just completely disregard and entire season (2017) and replace opinions with a preseason game where many starters aren’t playing, defenses aren’t gameplanning and are simplified.

Barring injury, the floor for the defense is 2017

 

[Igordão]

It's funny how every time we play bad on defense people will say we are playing zone and when we play well it's because we are playing man.

The reality is, every team plays a mix of zone and man or they would be destroyed by today offenses. Last year I would say we played almost as much zone as we played man coverage, although I don't have the numbers.

 

[rsmith2783]

I can’t see how people will just completely disregard and entire season (2017) and replace opinions with a preseason game where many starters aren’t playing, defenses aren’t gameplanning and are simplified.

Barring injury, the floor for the defense is 2017

The 2013 Saints finished with the 4th ranked defense, while the 2014 team finished 31st. They both kept the same coach, same front 7, but only had a few changes on the back end. The two teams finished with different results. As we learned years later that most of it was due to a schematic change. What's to say that the samething couldn't possibly happen today?

 

[bclemms]

No matter what, we have a strong defensive line and secondary with depth at all positions and at least 2 LB's that can play at an average level. I'm not concerned at all. This defense is going to be really good and when the offense can go get us a lead they have the chance to be absolutely dominant.

Will we be perfect? Nope. We are young and will have some soft spots and we may struggle to match up against some teams but I don't think this defense is outside the top 10 in scoring defense, turnovers and sacks. That is a championship combination with our offense.

 

[State Of Affairs]

The 2013 Saints finished with the 4th ranked defense, while the 2014 team finished 31st. They both kept the same coach, same front 7, but only had a few changes on the back end. The two teams finished with different results. As we learned years later that most of it was due to a schematic change. What's to say that the samething couldn't possibly happen today?

I get what your saying and your argument is more factual then mine... my post was more based on belief then facts...

I just think this defense is so much more talanted then the units in the past and because I beieve this, it makes me think that it won’t be AS effected by scheme changes/adjustments, schedule or even injury.

So who needs facts, I got opinions! Lol

 

[Bloop]

I understand that the op is saying. This coaching staff goes full retard sometimes remember when they start Devante Harris? Or when they were ranked #2 in the preseason and they completely changed the scheme? Or the players had to tell the coaches that the defense isn't working by game 2 (lol)?
They have all the depth at DL this year and I bet they will still refuse to rotate players to keep them fresh

 

[St.Fury]

Before I begin, I will point out the obvious and also the most common quoted phrases around this time of year:

• It's just preseason
• We didn't gameplan
• Most of our starters didn't play
• We were vanilla (which I suppose the opposing team decided to go with whip cream & sprinkles)
• Quit overreacting

You should’ve just stopped right there.

 

[Cougar 1]

It's just preseason.

But on zone, I agree.

It's never been a strong suit and always leaky when deployed by the Saints. Hope we see it just situationally.

It's funny how every time we play bad on defense people will say we are playing zone and when we play well it's because we are playing man.

The reality is, every team plays a mix of zone and man or they would be destroyed by today offenses. Last year I would say we played almost as much zone as we played man coverage, although I don't have the numbers.

I found this article that could shed some light on that:

How the Saints salvaged their secondary and became a legitimate NFC threat

And You’re absolutely right in saying u gotta mix things up. I read an article where DA said he wanted his defense to be as complicated as his players athleticism and intelligence would allow him to be. The idea is to be able to disguise coverages; to give a certain look pre snap, let the QB make his calls based on what he sees, then change things up at the snap.

It worked pretty well last year, and with the additions we’ve made, things should be even better this year.

 

[Goatman Saint]

It’s preseson. Which means nothing at all. Key guys were not playing or had such limited snaps it was pointless to see. There is no game planning, no stunting just line up across the guy on the defense and win your one on one battle. At LB it’s been said Anzalone was calling plays for the first time at MLB and others were not in their usual positions. It was a cross training situation, and while it’s been publicly stated numerous times that Allen wants his LBs to be able to play any position, everyone has different strengths. Only way to improve is to get out of where your strengths are and work on your weaknesses. That’s how they approach preseason.

A better indication has always been when they get into practice and have offense and defense go at each other. In this situation the defense has held its own against the offense, no easy task against Brees, Thomas and Kamara along with trying to go against that line.

 

[sammymvpknight]

I’m not concerned. I’m really not. But I’m not going to ignore that the thing holding the 2017 defense back was the ability to stop the run consistently primarily due to a mediocre LB Corp. im still skeptical that our greatest weakness last year was improved much.