Too Little, Too Late (1 Viewer)

Joined
Jul 19, 2001
Messages
25,595
Reaction score
66,659
Age
51
Location
GBTR
Offline
https://theringer.com/2016-election-late-night-comedy-donald-trump-3ab5a838c447#.kgksu4n6u

The story of the election is the story of failing institutions. Cable news is so incapable of covering national politics as anything other than a two-man horse race it elevated a xenophobic monster into a legitimate competitor. Traditional reporting is so wedded to the language of impartiality that it took until the very end of a 17-month campaign for our most revered newspaper to call an unrepentant falsehood a lie. Donald Trump has an almost preternatural gift for exposing — and manipulating — the blind spots of media orthodoxy.
Pretty good read on some of the issues with media that have been spoken about in the various presidential threads. In the end, it does offer some hope that we'll eventually figure out how to "extreme vet" our candidates instead of just nodding as they lie to us.
 

Saint_Ward

Don't be a Jerk.
Staff member
Administrator
Gold VIP Contributor
Joined
Mar 1, 2007
Messages
46,731
Reaction score
40,441
Location
Fort Lauderdale, FL
Offline
Well, the main point of the article was late night TV talk shows and how really only Oliver and Samantha Bee (and to a lesser extent Seth Meyers) are free to be truly critical.

They’ve simply given up on countering bad-faith partisanship with even-tempered civility and given a voice to a niche of their own. Besides, the narrower you aim, the more lethally sharp you can be.
Heck, that bout sums up political discourse as a whole.
 

Kin Korn Karn

All-Pro
Joined
Mar 21, 2007
Messages
1,286
Reaction score
89
Location
Unknown ?
Offline
Well, we are the ones that are consuming and pressing the like button on this stuff. If we demanded better sources they would be there or at least more of them. Alot of people don't have the time or will to get into the primaries and can't or won't focus on actual issues when we get it paired down to the candidates. It's a real problem and it doesn't seem like we have many alternatives for responsible fact based reporting or the attention span to consume them.
 

JimEverett

More than 15K posts served!
Joined
Mar 18, 2001
Messages
24,979
Reaction score
7,835
Offline
What is more troubling to me is the apparent collusion between media giants and the Clinton campaign.
 

Kin Korn Karn

All-Pro
Joined
Mar 21, 2007
Messages
1,286
Reaction score
89
Location
Unknown ?
Offline
Speaking of debates. How are we ever going to get more than sound bytes when they are only given two minutes to make a point or rebuttal?
 

MLU

Please respect my decision!
Joined
Apr 28, 1999
Messages
54,960
Reaction score
20,680
Location
Mesa, AZ
Offline
Speaking of debates. How are we ever going to get more than sound bytes when they are only given two minutes to make a point or rebuttal?
The time limit has less to do with it. Everytime I hear Hillary bring up an actual legit topic to talk about, Trump responds with childish nonsense. The Democratic Debates were great. People took turns, they remained civil when they disagreed and they didn't make it personal, all in the two-minute format. You simply cannot debate a child as they are ill-prepared to wield the tools of logic and reason with any intelligence.
 

Kin Korn Karn

All-Pro
Joined
Mar 21, 2007
Messages
1,286
Reaction score
89
Location
Unknown ?
Offline
The time limit has less to do with it. Everytime I hear Hillary bring up an actual legit topic to talk about, Trump responds with childish nonsense. The Democratic Debates were great. People took turns, they remained civil when they disagreed and they didn't make it personal, all in the two-minute format. You simply cannot debate a child as they are ill-prepared to wield the tools of logic and reason with any intelligence.
I hear ya. I just wish it was more informative and less simplified.
 

VaeVictus

All-Pro
Joined
Oct 6, 2004
Messages
1,023
Reaction score
864
Offline
The time limit has less to do with it. Everytime I hear Hillary bring up an actual legit topic to talk about, Trump responds with childish nonsense. The Democratic Debates were great. People took turns, they remained civil when they disagreed and they didn't make it personal, all in the two-minute format. You simply cannot debate a child as they are ill-prepared to wield the tools of logic and reason with any intelligence.
Kind of easy to be more civil when the fix was already in.

This final pairing of candidates is truly awful and humiliating.
 
OP
Joined
Jul 19, 2001
Messages
25,595
Reaction score
66,659
Age
51
Location
GBTR
Offline
What is more troubling to me is the apparent collusion between media giants and the Clinton campaign.
I'm not sure if it's by design or not, but there's much truth in your statement. True investigative journalism is difficult to find anymore it seems in some instances.

The old Boston Legal show made an excellent point about how revenue is driving what's on TV, radio and print. If you run a big takedown story on how GM killed people and were fined like 15 mins of profit, then GM decides they don't want to advertise with you anymore and you lose millions.

Maybe move people subscribing to news services would work better for having a watchdog media. But who's going to prioritize news on their needs list?
 

MLU

Please respect my decision!
Joined
Apr 28, 1999
Messages
54,960
Reaction score
20,680
Location
Mesa, AZ
Offline
Kind of easy to be more civil when the fix was already in.

This final pairing of candidates is truly awful and humiliating.
If that's what you believe, then how do you explain Hillary's temperament in past elections that mirror her temperament in this election? I know people are afraid of giving her credit for being an intelligent, thoughtful and successful politician, but if you look at the evidence and not the internet memes you see that to be true. Even if Trump wasn't running, she is still the obvious choice versus the entire GOP field. Now that he is running, the GOP are going to get a helluva lot more cooperation from her than you will Trump.

Even if Hillary almost certainly will get us into another war...
 

James Spader

Veteran Starter
Joined
Jan 25, 2010
Messages
2,443
Reaction score
2,295
Offline
What is more troubling to me is the apparent collusion between media giants and the Clinton campaign.
This shouldn't surprise you considering Operation Mockingbird.

Snippet from Wiki:

Operation Mockingbird is a secret campaign by the United States Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) to influence media. Begun in the 1950s, it was initially organized by Cord Meyer and Allen W. Dulles, and was later led by Frank Wisner after Dulles became the head of the CIA. The organization recruited leading American journalists into a propaganda network to help present the CIA's views. It funded some student and cultural organizations and magazines as fronts. As it developed, it also worked to influence foreign media and political campaigns, in addition to activities by other operating units of the CIA.
 

VaeVictus

All-Pro
Joined
Oct 6, 2004
Messages
1,023
Reaction score
864
Offline
If that's what you believe, then how do you explain Hillary's temperament in past elections that mirror her temperament in this election? I know people are afraid of giving her credit for being an intelligent, thoughtful and successful politician, but if you look at the evidence and not the internet memes you see that to be true. Even if Trump wasn't running, she is still the obvious choice versus the entire GOP field. Now that he is running, the GOP are going to get a helluva lot more cooperation from her than you will Trump.

Even if Hillary almost certainly will get us into another war...
I don't know where in my previous post I suggested otherwise.
Regardless, she is an awful, awful candidate. It is frustrating when people are so enamored with her...for reasons I do not understand, that they cannot at least admit she has very serious flaws.

The fix was in. There was no way she'd lose the nomination. There was no stress for her, hence she was able to peacefully navigate the debates with Sanders who was a sacrificial cow at best. So giving her credit when she knew she was going to win is like giving Hulk Hogan credit for being clutch when he pinned his 'opponent' in the wrasslin ring.

INBEFOREDEMSDOWNVOTEME36TIMES
 

MLU

Please respect my decision!
Joined
Apr 28, 1999
Messages
54,960
Reaction score
20,680
Location
Mesa, AZ
Offline
I don't know where in my previous post I suggested otherwise.
Regardless, she is an awful, awful candidate. It is frustrating when people are so enamored with her...for reasons I do not understand, that they cannot at least admit she has very serious flaws.

The fix was in. There was no way she'd lose the nomination. There was no stress for her, hence she was able to peacefully navigate the debates with Sanders who was a sacrificial cow at best. So giving her credit when she knew she was going to win is like giving Hulk Hogan credit for being clutch when he pinned his 'opponent' in the wrasslin ring.

INBEFOREDEMSDOWNVOTEME36TIMES
I seriously hope you're not suggesting I'm "enamored" with her. She has flaws, as does any candidate. To suggest that she is an awful candidate is evidence enough that you're falling for the smoke being blown by Republicans. I have changed my position on her as I have taken more time to learn about her and as some of her policies have evolved. She easily has the best resume for the job since Nixon.

If "the fix was in" as you suggest, then she wouldn't have modified policy to incorporate several of Bernie Sanders' positions. Bernie Sanders was a great idea, but he would never be a successful President. His views and policies are too extreme, even if he's right thanks to an overcorrection in politics by the most vocal Republicans. A more centrist candidate like Hillary has a better chance of success and people know that, which is why she won the nomination. To suggest there was a conspiracy to ensure she was the candidate reflects poorly on your intellectual laziness. That is not sufficient proof that it exists.
 

dtc

VIP Subscribing Member
VIP Contributor
Joined
Dec 26, 2006
Messages
29,340
Reaction score
28,408
Location
Redneck Riviera
Offline
I hear ya. I just wish it was more informative and less simplified.
That's not a function of the debates themselves, rather a function of the candidate nominated by Republicans.

Had Christie or Kasich, Ryan, or even Cruz been nominated there would have been substantial dialog over policy. In this case, we get nothing.

As an aside, last night I watched almost 15 minutes of video from a Trump rally and noticed there were far, far fewer people in attendance and the venue was the opposite of YUUUUGE. I don't know if that was happenstance, but I also noted Trump did not brag about polls or the number of attendees. In fact, all he did discuss was himself, how great he is, how great his business is, how great his family is, how great his followers are, how great the sacrifice he's making on their behalf is and then a rambling flow of semi-lucid nonsense about conspiracy, rigged elections and crap.

The entire phenomenon was extraordinary to watch. It was as if a Turret's victim took a hit of acid, mixed it with 9 red bulls and then had a paranoid delusion while giving a political speech.

The fact there was anyone there and that some were applauding was unbelievable. Anyone who at this time is still supporting Trump is beyond my comprehension.
 

dtc

VIP Subscribing Member
VIP Contributor
Joined
Dec 26, 2006
Messages
29,340
Reaction score
28,408
Location
Redneck Riviera
Offline
I don't know where in my previous post I suggested otherwise.
Regardless, she is an awful, awful candidate. It is frustrating when people are so enamored with her...for reasons I do not understand, that they cannot at least admit she has very serious flaws.

The fix was in. There was no way she'd lose the nomination. There was no stress for her, hence she was able to peacefully navigate the debates with Sanders who was a sacrificial cow at best. So giving her credit when she knew she was going to win is like giving Hulk Hogan credit for being clutch when he pinned his 'opponent' in the wrasslin ring.

INBEFOREDEMSDOWNVOTEME36TIMES
I have never met anyone enamored of Hillary Clinton except, maybe, Bill.

But she is not an awful candidate unless you're buying into a whole lot of nonsense that's been flung at her as if she were a wall for the past 30 years.

She is nothing more than a politician who used to be the wife of a politician. She's guarded, jaded and duplicitous just like every other politician on the face of the earth not named Obama it seems.

Saying the nomination process was rigged is ridiculous and ignorant. Millions voted. They expressed their opinions. For you or anyone to believe That Bernie ever had a real chance to win is stupid. He's a socialist running in a capitalist country. He's 100 years old, not photogenic, not particularly well spoken, incapable of pablum-puking sound bites and far too left of center for even most left leaning Democrats.

The only reason Bernie was as close as he is is due to the success of the Rs in painting Hillary as The Beast for 30 years and an overall dislike of anything establishment as borne out by the absurdity of the rise of Trump.
 

Create an account or login to comment

You must be a member in order to leave a comment

Create account

Create an account on our community. It's easy!

Log in

Already have an account? Log in here.

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 1)



Headlines

Top Bottom