Trump pulls US out of Syria; GOP Senators object (1 Viewer)

superchuck500

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The move comes on the supposed premise that we have "defeated" ISIS - contrary to recent comments made by administration and military officials. Others worry that the US leaving Syria only emboldens al-Assad and Iran in the region. This evening, it appears that GOP Senators, including Lindsey Graham, Tom Cotton, and Marco Rubio have joined in a letter to the president objecting to the move.

President Donald Trump is finally getting his way in Syria. Vehemently opposed to the extended presence of American troops in the war-ravaged country, he had been forced to keep them there longer than he wanted. Not, it seems, anymore.

“We have defeated isis in Syria, my only reason for being there during the Trump Presidency,” Trump said Wednesday on Twitter.

The tweet appeared to confirm news reports that the United States would withdraw the roughly 2,000 American troops stationed in Syria who are fighting the Islamic State group. The U.S.-led anti-isiscoalition has made significant territorial gains against the militant group, but has struggled to completely eliminate isis from a few pockets in Syria.

But if it is carried out, a U.S. pullout leaves open a question of the militants’ resurgence, and would delight at least two of Syria’s neighbors: Iran and Turkey. American soldiers might have been in Syria to fight isis, but they also served as a deterrent to the Islamic Republic, which supports Syrian President Bashar al-Assad with troops and militia fighters.
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2018/12/trump-signals-us-troops-will-withdraw-syria/578569/


 

mjcouvi

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As I've been reading your comments in this thread, I've been in complete agreement with you, until this. If it were thought out in advance and notice was given at the last possible minute for a swift and orderly withdrawal, it would not have been a surprise to his advisors and the military brass.
Don't take what I say too seriously. I don't know what I'm talking about. Much love.
 

mjcouvi

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As I've been reading your comments in this thread, I've been in complete agreement with you, until this. If it were thought out in advance and notice was given at the last possible minute for a swift and orderly withdrawal, it would not have been a surprise to his advisors and the military brass.
eh, well, there's going to inevitably be disagreement.
 

dtc

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Don't take what I say too seriously. I don't know what I'm talking about. Much love.
Becoming self aware may make you dangerous or it might give your posts a little meat to drape from their bones.

Had Trump exercised forethought or given some level of thought to his 'plan' it wouldn't be being met by objection from all those who agree with you that we ought not be in Syria. It's only in your scenario that he did.
 

mjcouvi

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Becoming self aware may make you dangerous or it might give your posts a little meat to drape from their bones.

Had Trump exercised forethought or given some level of thought to his 'plan' it wouldn't be being met by objection from all those who agree with you that we ought not be in Syria. It's only in your scenario that he did.
You made me think of probably my favorite quote regarding foresight, or "forethought" as you put it.

This explains the fatally grievous condition of mankind. Ignorance surrounds its cradle: then its actions are determined by their first consequences, the only ones which, in its first stage, it can see. It is only in the long run that it learns to take account of the others. It has to learn this lesson from two very different masters — experience and foresight. Experience teaches effectually, but brutally. It makes us acquainted with all the effects of an action, by causing us to feel them; and we cannot fail to finish by knowing that fire burns, if we have burned ourselves. For this rough teacher, I should like, if possible, to substitute a more gentle one. I mean Foresight.
- Bastiat
 
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No so fast...

https://www.npr.org/2019/01/06/682651066/trump-bolton-say-u-s-withdrawal-from-syria-is-conditional-on-defeat-of-isis

Speaking from the White House, President Trump also said on Sunday that the withdrawal would be contingent on the defeat of remaining Islamic State forces.

"We won't be finally pulled out until ISIS is gone," Trump said before departing for Camp David.

The remarks represent a departure from the president's earlier statements about the timeline for U.S. involvement in Syria.
 

mt15

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Whiplash from the changing winds. I swear it’s whoever talks to him last. Erdogan thought he had the win, lol, after that phone call, but someone else has now changed his mind.
 

dtc

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You made me think of probably my favorite quote regarding foresight, or "forethought" as you put it.



- Bastiat
I didn't call foresight forethought. They're two different words with different meanings.
 

mjcouvi

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I didn't call foresight forethought. They're two different words with different meanings.
Can't see without thought. Forethought comes before foresight. Or is it the other way around? I don't know, but the two are definitely closely related. They're two different words with a lot of similarity regarding meaning.

One always resorts to an explanation of a word by using other words, which have still different meanings themselves. It's inescapable.

If you think Trump didn't have some level of forethought or foresight before he announced his plan, then I don't know what to tell ya. That seems pretty outrageous to think he didn't consider it prior to feeling/saying/doing. You think he just draws straws?

But it doesn't really matter now because the Syria withdrawal has been made another politically tepid thing. Trump is showing his weakness, yet again, by not really following through.
 

dtc

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Can't see without thought. Forethought comes before foresight. Or is it the other way around? I don't know, but the two are definitely closely related. They're two different words with a lot of similarity regarding meaning.

One always resorts to an explanation of a word by using other words, which have still different meanings themselves. It's inescapable.

If you think Trump didn't have some level of forethought or foresight before he announced his plan, then I don't know what to tell ya. That seems pretty outrageous to think he didn't consider it prior to feeling/saying/doing. You think he just draws straws?

But it doesn't really matter now because the Syria withdrawal has been made another politically tepid thing. Trump is showing his weakness, yet again, by not really following through.
Forethought is advanced consideration, planning and evaluation.

Foresight is fortune telling.

There isn't really any similarity in my mind other than the first four letters. Sight is not thought. They are not related except the prefix and, again, I didn't accidentally choose one over the other. You can't just make it so with those first two incoherent sentences.
 

mjcouvi

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Forethought is advanced consideration, planning and evaluation.

Foresight is fortune telling.

There isn't really any similarity in my mind other than the first four letters. Sight is not thought. They are not related except the prefix and, again, I didn't accidentally choose one over the other. You can't just make it so with those first two incoherent sentences.
Do I need to give you the definitions man? Look up synonyms of either and the other will show up, so if you only see similarity in the first four letters, that's a result of your misunderstanding. You can make up stuff, or you could look up stuff. There's several authoritative references. Need help finding them? Thesauruses or dictionaries will do.
 

Taurus

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Meanwhile, the entire government shuts down and these spineless fart-particles don't say a damn thing.

Makes it pretty obvious that the war machine is more important than us citizens.
 

WhoDatPhan78

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I wish aliens would attack.

Humans need a common goal. Global warming isn’t working out.

We could still serve as the means of production for the .0000001% all callaborating for the greater good, it’s just easier for them to put us against each other.

That’s probably our fault.
 

Saint_Ward

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https://www.cnn.com/2019/02/05/politics/votel-trump-syria-withdrawal/index.html

Washington (CNN)The commander of US Central Command, which oversees military operations in the Middle East, said Tuesday he "was not consulted" prior to President Donald Trump's December announcement that the US would withdraw its troops from Syria.

And despite Trump's claims that ISIS has been defeated, Gen. Joseph Votel said the fight against the terror group is "not over" and warned ISIS could regroup after US troops leave.

"I was not aware of the specific announcement. Certainly we are aware that he had expressed a desire and intent in the past to depart Iraq, depart Syria," Votel said during a Tuesday hearing held by the Senate Armed Services Committee.

"So you weren't consulted before that decision was announced?" Sen. Angus King, I-Maine, asked.
"We were not, I was not consulted," Votel responded.
 

nolaspe

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https://www.cnn.com/interactive/2019/02/middleeast/yemen-lost-us-arms/?utm_term=link&utm_source=fbCNN&utm_content=2019-02-05T00:00:24&utm_medium=social&fbclid=IwAR2__WtHQFjKsP9JMBD0p_PUzg4-tL4hD2U67VuYWwNgfnMm2MAsfsh3-Bo&fbclid=IwAR0SK5eJ66VZeSoxZpVLr0_tZ0rop_rQ4aB9BLEbfzz7LcM07WzuHEFmc00&fbclid=IwAR0F0mv73gJoDOzLFSg_dWYr9tFDsj0fxIrep3ENlA7qJhtiwu_B0ijoA18

Hodeidah, Yemen (CNN) – Saudi Arabia and its coalition partners have transferred American-made weapons to al Qaeda-linked fighters, hardline Salafi militias, and other factions waging war in Yemen, in violation of their agreements with the United States, a CNN investigation has found.


At a graveyard of discarded US-made military hardware near the flashpoint port city of Hodeidah, it becomes clear that the Alwiyat al Amalqa -- the Giants Brigade, a predominantly Salafi, or ultra-conservative Sunni, militia -- is a favored faction.

Nearly half a dozen Mine-Resistant Ambush Protected (MRAP) vehicles sit side by side, most bearing stickers with the insignia of the Giants Brigade.

One even has the export label on it showing it was sent from Beaumont, Texas to Abu Dhabi, in the UAE, before ending up in the hands of the militia. The serial number of another MRAP reveals it was manufactured by Navistar, the largest provider of armored vehicles for the US military.

The armored all-terrain vehicles are built to withstand ballistic arms fire, mine blasts and improvised explosive devices (IEDs). “It’s the vehicle that every crew wants when they’re out in the field,” Navistar’s website says. The firm declined to comment on this report.
Recipients of US weaponry are legally obligated to adhere to end-use requirements which prohibit the transferring of any equipment to third parties without prior authorization from the US government. That authorization was never obtained.
The Saudi coalition did not respond to multiple requests for comment. A senior UAE official denied “in no uncertain terms that we are in violation of end-user agreements in any manner.”
The Giants Brigade is a “part of Yemeni forces,” the official told CNN, adding that the group was under the direct supervision of the UAE and, therefore, the equipment was in the “collective possession” of the coalition.
The US Department of Defense, when asked specifically about the Giants Brigades, said it had not given Saudi Arabia or the UAE permission to hand over US weaponry to other factions on the ground.
"The United States has not authorized the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia or the United Arab Emirates to re-transfer any equipment to parties inside Yemen," Pentagon spokesman Johnny Michael told CNN. "The US government cannot comment on any pending investigations of claims of end-use violations of defense articles and services transferred to our allies and partners."
Iran is ‘assessing US military technology closely’
Because a majority of American troop deaths in Afghanistan and Iraq are caused by IEDs, it is critical that knowledge of MRAP vulnerabilities does not fall into enemy hands.
But it's already too late.
In September 2017, a Houthi-run TV channel broadcast images of Mohammed Ali al-Houthi, the de facto rebel leader, proudly sitting behind the wheel of a captured US-made MRAP in the capital Sanaa, as a crowd chanted "death to America" in the background.

From the US to the front line
US
Saudi Arabia & UAE
Internationally-
recognized
Yemeni
government
forces
Coalition troops:
Saudi Arabia,
UAE, Sudan,
other member
states
National
Resistance
Forces: Giants
Brigade, Abu
Abbas, proxy
militias
vs
Houthi
rebels
Iran
CNN obtained an image showing the serial numbers of a second American MRAP in the hands of another senior Houthi official last year in Hodeidah. The photo was first published by Yemeni journalist Hussain al Bukhaiti, the official’s brother.
The vehicle was part of a $2.5 billion sale to the UAE in 2014. The sale document, seen by CNN, certifies that "a determination has been made that the recipient country can provide the same degree of protection for the sensitive technology" as the United States.
MRAPs like these, captured on the battlefield, have been probed by Iranian intelligence, according to a member of a secret Houthi unit backed by Iran known as the Preventative Security Force. The unit oversees the transfer of military technology to and from Tehran.
The member of the force, speaking to CNN anonymously out of fear for his safety, revealed that Iranian and Hezbollah advisers have already gotten their hands on the armored vehicles and other US military hardware.
"Iranian intelligence are assessing US military technology very closely," the source said in an audio interview done from Sanaa. "Listen, there isn't a single American weapon that they don't try to find out its details, what it's made of, how it works."
The serial numbers of one MRAP captured by Houthi forces trace the vehicle back to a $2.5 billion US arms sale to the UAE in 2014.
IEDs are now mass-produced in Yemen by Houthi forces on a scale only previously achieved by ISIS, according to a re
 

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