Underhill thinks Carr will be Saints starter [mod edit: Moore-Carr meeting went well; Saints plan is to keep Carr in 2025 & figure out contract] (109 Viewers)

[RaisingTheBar]

What if restructuring could mean making the contract more incentive-based (which shouldn’t bother Carr if he’s confident in himself) and removes the no-trade clause to set up a true Carr vs. Rattler that could allow us to trade Carr should Rattler win. If Carr is confident, he shouldn’t be worried. Point being, we have no idea what another restructure could/would mean? Are we sure it HAS to mean kicking the can down the road, or could it mean setting things up to give Carr and Moore the chance to see how well they can work together or make it easier (and hopefully less painful) to let Carr try somewhere else?

That would be great if he didn’t give injuries as one of the reasons he wouldn’t be open to a pay cut. So I can’t see anything incentive based happening, again that would be great, just don’t see it.

If he is on the roster in 2025 it means we’ve kicked more money into the future, a lot more. We will likely follow our old buddy SP’s approach and rip the bandaid off after 2025 aka what they did with Wilson. and if we stink that year hope it’s enough where we find our “Bo Nix“. Either way. Sometime within the next 2 years, we’re going to have to commit a high pick to a QB.

 

[Taker597]

Taking a $60m dead money cap hit next year to cut him isn't an out. That's more dead money for a single player than any team has in total right now. The top 2 teams in dead cap right now have $50m but that is for 7 & 8 players respectively. On top of that, we have $57m in dead money in 2026 from void years of other players. That's $117m in dead money. It breaks the record by $32m.

The only really dagger in this situation that it effectively forces us to push our rebuild back. Which will be at minimum a 2 year process to get cap healthy.

If Loomis does go crazy in FA... It could get worse.

The only viable option to cutting Carr was always him getting paid $4-5 million to become a FA in exchange for Cap Savings.

This strategy would of greatly accelerated our timeline of our rebuild.

I remember seeing a Post a few years back to get prepared for a decade long drought at minimum. And it's getting really apparent that we are almost halfway through one.

We haven't started doing the dirty work of rebuilding yet. If an elite HOF coach with personnel control and a healthy cap situation took 3 off-seasons to build us back with 2015, 2016, and 2017. I honestly don't know how long it will take for our current situation to get turned around. It's pretty daunting, and it's why that I have such a hard line stance against pushing to win at all cost with mortgaging our future.

I think a lot of the reasons that Loomis refuses to go through a rebuild or a reset.

It's because he and people he work with may probably not survive to see it through the other side with how poorly they already been doing while trying to win. A rebuild just accelerate that process entirely, because you can only have 1 or 2 three-win season and survive. Yet, you can almost string together an eternity of 7 win season if you have enough excuses.

 

[RaisingTheBar]

Did the Broncos restructure Wilson in Payton’s 1st year?

No, however they took on the record for single player dead cap hit in 85mil that they split over 50ish and 30ish the next 2 years as a June 1 designation.

 

[Brandon13]

Man please do not restructure him.. .. I was looking forward to the rebuild. Ugh.

 

[Hubig]

Winning 8-9 games in 2025 just makes you miss on top QB prospects. I'm not saying we should tank but thats exactly what Carr is gonna give you if everything goes well. He has been in the league 11'ish years, what more do you need to find out?

We'll see what they do with the restructure but dear god, let this be the last year of this crap.

 

[dataussie]

The only really dagger in this situation that it effectively forces us to push our rebuild back. Which will be at minimum a 2 year process to get cap healthy.

If Loomis does go crazy in FA... It could get worse.

The only viable option to cutting Carr was always him getting paid $4-5 million to become a FA in exchange for Cap Savings.

This strategy would of greatly accelerated our timeline of our rebuild.

I remember seeing a Post a few years back to get prepared for a decade long drought at minimum. And it's getting really apparent that we are almost halfway through one.

We haven't started doing the dirty work of rebuilding yet. It an elite coach with personnel control and a healthy cap situation took 3 off-seasons to build us back with 2015, 2016, and 2017. I honestly don't know how long it will take for our current situation to get turned around.

I think a lot of the reasons that Loomis refuses to go through a rebuild or a reset.

It's because he and people he work with may probably won't survive it to see it through the other side with how poorly they already been doing while trying to win. A rebuild just accelerate that process entirely, because you can only have 1 or 2 three-win season and survive while you can almost string together an eternity of 7 win season if you have enough excuses.

Loomis is the crux of our problems. like you say, he won't do what's necessary. so were stuck treading water in some very mediocre waters.

 

[Elvis]

The only really dagger in this situation that it effectively forces us to push our rebuild back. Which will be at minimum a 2 year process to get cap healthy.

If Loomis does go crazy in FA... It could get worse.

The only viable option to cutting Carr was always him getting paid $4-5 million to become a FA in exchange for Cap Savings.

This strategy would of greatly accelerated our timeline of our rebuild.

I remember seeing a Post a few years back to get prepared for a decade long drought at minimum. And it's getting really apparent that we are almost halfway through one.

We haven't started doing the dirty work of rebuilding yet. It an elite coach with personnel control and a healthy cap situation took 3 off-seasons to build us back with 2015, 2016, and 2017. I honestly don't know how long it will take for our current situation to get turned around.

I think a lot of the reasons that Loomis refuses to go through a rebuild or a reset.

It's because he and people he work with may probably won't survive it to see it through the other side with how poorly they already been doing while trying to win. A rebuild just accelerate that process entirely, because you can only have 1 or 2 three-win season and survive while you can almost string together an eternity of 7 win season if you have enough excuses.

I never thought of it that way. Loomis might be trying to win now even though the odds are small and it may cripple the team for a decade because he won't be here long enough to see success the other way. If they win now, he can claim that it was him all along. If he's forced to rebuild and not survive to see it build back up, all of the credit for past successes will always be tied to Payton, not Loomis. These might be legacy moves, not planning for the future moves.

 

[StudioSaint]

Weird that Mickey would confirm Carr as the 2025 starting QB. Did our new coach okay this decision? Was he asked?

No, the Saints didn't ask Moore for his opinion. Hiring Moore was just a PR stunt. They keep him locked up in secret closet in the team's building. They only let him out to make PR appearances, like interviews.

They'll let him walk the sidelines during the games with a play sheet and headset while pretending to be running things, but his headset will just be a prop and no one will actually be listening to anything he says. His hiring is all for show. Moore's just a powerless figurehead.

 

[greatshow25]

Spotrac vs. some guy on SSF. Hmmm, tough choice.

Elvis I don’t think that includes his 10 million roster bonus that kicks in this year. SMH

 

[DSnfla]

I'm one that wanted to move on from Carr, not because he's bad, but because I think we need to start looking for our franchise QB now and I don't want to wait a year. But it wasn't because I think Carr is bad. He's not, he's just mediocre. But, if he is staying, I hope Moore can somehow unlock Carr and make him the best he can be.

Or, hopefully Rattler takes a giant leap this offseason and beats Carr out in training camp. That would solve so many problems for this team. I don't think it's likely to happen, but it would be amazing if it did.

How is keeping DC another yr or even 2 mutually exclusive to finding our franchise QB? It's highly unlikely we draft a franchise QB this yr. I'm not sure if there is one in next yrs draft. There for sure is not going to be one available in FA. And what team is going to trade away a young franchise QB ?

If we had the #1 pick in the draft would you draft a QB this yr? I wouldn't. Is there anyone in next yrs draft that you can say they have a good shot at being THE QB?

Let's say you all get your wish and we cut DC. We are either going to have to sign a cheap vet QB for about 10 mil ( Wasting part of that $ we get back 6/1) Or we will roll with Rattler/ Haener. We won't have $ till 6/1 , FA will be pretty much over so getting whichever QB we have any help will be shot. And what if Rattler does not have it? Or we win 6-7 games and not in position to MAYBE draft a QB that COULD be the guy.

Burrow , Williams , Daniels , Maye, even Nix, Penix and Stroud showed flashes before their last yr in collage. Can you name 3 guys that you can say" Yes they are ready to make the leap " in the 26 draft @QB
The Browns have been looking for a franchise QB for over a decade. So have the Jets, Titans , Steelers, Bears. Look how long it took the Bengals to luck into Burrow

Nah, I'm fine keeping DC for another yr or 2 all the while seeing if Rattler can develop and building the team the way CKM wants so that WHEN we do find a QB that he thinks is THE guy he is set up for success

 

[StudioSaint]

FWIW, in the latest NOF article, it has been said by sources off the record that the contract talks with Carr involve more than just a simple restructure.

I think the most likely thing is that Carr's contract will get reworked, more than just restructuring payment types, to have Carr get one of those "cap pay cuts that don't actually cost the player any money" type of pay cuts that a lot of players do.

 

[DSnfla]

If this is what Kellen wants, I'm 100% on board.
If this is Loomis...

Bud , You know how Loomis works, He may be driving the bus, but the HC and the scouting dept are the navigators telling him which way to go.

 

[Elvis]

Elvis I don’t think that includes his 10 million roster bonus that kicks in this year. SMH

It does, and that money is guaranteed regardless. When you restructure $30m in salary and $10m in bonus, you have to leave a league minimum salary of $1,255,000 AND the 2025 portion of the prorated bonus of the restructure has to be added on the the existing prorated bonus for 2025 as well. That leaves his 2025 numbers looking like this.



His 2026 numbers would then look like this if we kept him.



If we cut him in 2026 because we won't want to pay him $50m in salary and a $69,207,000 cap hit for the 20th best QB in the NFL, we would have to take his prorated bonus from 2026, 2027, 2028 and 2029 and add them up. Those are $19,207,000 in 2026, $19,207,000 in 2027, $13,507,000 in 2028 and 7,749,000 in 2029. That adds up to $59,670,000 in dead money. I'll show all of the tabs below.

 

[Taker597]

. Is there anyone in next yrs draft that you can say they have a good shot at being THE QB?

Do you not follow college or live under a rock? Arch Manning, and he looks amazing. Then, you have Garrett Nussmeier with a ton of hype around him now.

Then, the QB class falls off a mountain.

 

[Fiyo]

Do you not follow college or live under a rock? Arch Manning, and he looks amazing. Then, you have Garrett Nussmeier with a ton of hype around him now.

Then, the QB class falls off a mountain.

I truly believe Manning will play two more years in college. He’ll be in the 2027 draft. And if he’s there, and does what I expect him to the next two years, he’s one of those rare QBs I’m willing to trade up for to take.