Well, It's Time... (The Wall) (1 Viewer)

crosswatt

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So apparently yesterday Sen. Lindsay Graham said that Trump should move forward with his emergency declaration if he can't get wall funding from Congress.




It is quite a remarkable statement from a senator who seems willing to advocate an unconstitutional undermining of the congressional power of the purse, and the very pillar of government in which he sits.

Conor Friedersdorf, the staff conservative at the Atlantic writes:



https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2019/01/lindsey-graham-wall/581500/

And in this piece, also published at Atlantic, Elizabeth Goitein, an expert on executive power (and abuse) at the Brennan Center writes that emergency power is very specifically not constitutional when its sole impetus is that Congress refuses funds for a project the president desires:



More at https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2019/01/trump-has-no-case-national-emergency/581356/
Two points:
1. Conor Friedersdorf will now be considered a RINO, and dismissed with "when did he become a democrat" and other such undermining efforts.

2. The best case scenario right now for GOP momentum in 2020 is to have the current Oval Office occupant declare a national emergency, the action be opposed via a long drawn out legal battle, and the talking points executed in a full out blitzkrieg to frame the narrative that the deep state Democrats are trying to keep the glorious leader from fulfilling his destined place as the one true protector of our great land.
 

Saintamaniac

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Am I ignorant in my understanding that if Trump were to suddenly declare a state of emergency at the southern border that it'd be immediately challenged in the courts (I believe I heard it'd be in the 9th circuit as well, which hasn't been too kind to Trump's most idiotic demands and actions) and be tied up for quite some time?

Wouldn't this prevent him from possibly getting any money for his wall even longer than it would if he'd actually negotiate?
He knows that. That will be his out with his base on the issue of the wall. All he has to do is tell them he tried but the evil enemy of the people 9th circuit is stopping him and there's nothing he can do. They'll all agree he's playing infinity-D chess and forget about the wall. His supporters only believe what he tells them anyway.
 

superchuck500

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Am I ignorant in my understanding that if Trump were to suddenly declare a state of emergency at the southern border that it'd be immediately challenged in the courts (I believe I heard it'd be in the 9th circuit as well, which hasn't been too kind to Trump's most idiotic demands and actions) and be tied up for quite some time?

Wouldn't this prevent him from possibly getting any money for his wall even longer than it would if he'd actually negotiate?
I think we could expect that any declaration of emergency would be immediately challenged - but how that is done could vary. You can expect that any filing would request the court to enjoin the emergency declaration, which, if granted, would put a halt to any activities stemming from it.

Where the action was filed would determine what federal circuit it is in - though much of the southern border is in the 9th Circuit, not all of it is. And there might be other venues where a proper action could be filed.

And any action would have to be keen to identify a proper plaintiff (with standing) and the legal basis for the challenge would require some thoughtful work by the attorneys (probably a 5th A due process claim but maybe something else?) Or would members of Congress be the ones to bring the strongest action (it has been held that Congress can sue the president where the president acts unconstitutionally). Of course, I'm sure much of that thinking has already been done, but it would be quite dramatic . . . . and happen fairly quickly, I would imagine.
 

insidejob

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It's not about the negotiation. It's not about the wall. It's not about the 'emergency'.

It's about the wedge of being able to claim Dem's are obstructionists. It's about being able to claim to fight those evil snowflakes. It's about keeping power and profits.
Yup. Pretty sad this is what they've been reduced to.
 

insidejob

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I think we could expect that any declaration of emergency would be immediately challenged - but how that is done could vary. You can expect that any filing would request the court to enjoin the emergency declaration, which, if granted, would put a halt to any activities stemming from it.

Where the action was filed would determine what federal circuit it is in - though much of the southern border is in the 9th Circuit, not all of it is. And there might be other venues where a proper action could be filed.

And any action would have to be keen to identify a proper plaintiff (with standing) and the legal basis for the challenge would require some thoughtful work by the attorneys (probably a 5th A due process claim but maybe something else?) Or would members of Congress be the ones to bring the strongest action (it has been held that Congress can sue the president where the president acts unconstitutionally). Of course, I'm sure much of that thinking has already been done, but it would be quite dramatic . . . . and happen fairly quickly, I would imagine.
Your legal advice and explanations on this board are super appreciated. I learn about as much from you as I did when getting my Law & Order degree. Ben Stone, Claire Kincaid and Adam Schiff were my best teachers before you showed up in the mix.

:melike:
 

Zztop

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Who needs a wall when you have right wing armed "militiamen" rounding up dem' illegals

Armed rightwing militia members detained a large group of migrants at the US-Mexico border and coordinated with US border patrol agents to have them arrested, according to the American Civil Liberties Union, in a series of actions the civil liberties organization called a “kidnapping” and a flagrant violation of the law.
 

Oye

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Who needs a wall when you have right wing armed "militiamen" rounding up dem' illegals

Armed rightwing militia members detained a large group of migrants at the US-Mexico border and coordinated with US border patrol agents to have them arrested, according to the American Civil Liberties Union, in a series of actions the civil liberties organization called a “kidnapping” and a flagrant violation of the law.
thankfully, those aren't the only people working at the border



 

N.O.Bronco

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So um, this is certainly something...


 

mt15

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Yay- vigilantes running around with guns. 🤪
 

nolaspe

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Good.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/fbi-arrests-larry-mitchell-hopkins-leader-of-united-constitutional-patriots-border-militia?fbclid=IwAR1A-kAt3oEIKPZaY1vBVTIM3rIKY_Lnguz-mvl55eua6nGJUo9DnzhWwmo

Larry Mitchell Hopkins, who runs The United Constitutional Patriots (UCP), an armed border militia group that spreads far-right conspiracies and rounds up asylum seekers on the border, was arrested by FBI in New Mexico Saturday on charges of possessing firearms and ammunition as a convicted felon.
 

Merl

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Goatman Saint

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