What measure makes Jameis a poor quarterback? (1 Viewer)

[ccss]

Just so there's a level field for discussion, Peyton vs Jameis - their first 5 years in the league - I posted this earlier but it was at the end of a thread. Why is the one so great and the other so bad?

Peyton Manning averaged 4,123.6 yards passing per year
Jameis Winston averaged 3,947.4 yards passing per year

Peyton 7.32 yards per attempt
Jameis 7.75 yards per attempt

Peyton avg td 27.6, avg interceptions 20.0, td/int ratio 1.38
Jameis avg td 24.2, avg interceptions 17.6, td/int ratio 1.375

Peyton avg sacs per season 21.6
Jameis avg sacs per season 33.8

Peyton avg rating 85.9
Jameis avg rating 87.4

They were both coached by Bruce Arians during their worst season for interceptions:
Peyton in 1998, 28
Jameis in 2019, 30

Peyton Manning played with running back Marshall Faulk in 1998 who was followed by Edgerrin James and two Hall of Fame wide receivers in Marvin Harrison and Reggie Wayne. Winston had one wideout of note in Mike Evans but had weak support from the ground game after Doug Martin’s comeback year in 2015.

??????

 

[Jiva]

Say what you want about Winston, but he has NEVER been in a situation this good in his career.
He has a full supporting cast and winning the game is now based on him playing within a system that values protecting the ball and QB vs a system that values big plays.
He's in a good situation to show he is a better quarterback than Tampa made him be. He has talent, now he has support and a team around him.
Let's see what he can do with it.
Like Teddy last year, I do think it will take a couple games to get a solid grasp of things. (Although, Teddy hadn't played in a few years, so he had a lot more rust to shake off).

 

[gavinj]

I think Peyton ate a lot more W’s

 

[BiloxiSaint1]

Just so there's a level field for discussion, Peyton vs Jameis - their first 5 years in the league - I posted this earlier but it was at the end of a thread. Why is the one so great and the other so bad?

Peyton Manning averaged 4,123.6 yards passing per year
Jameis Winston averaged 3,947.4 yards passing per year

Peyton 7.32 yards per attempt
Jameis 7.75 yards per attempt

Peyton avg td 27.6, avg interceptions 20.0, td/int ratio 1.38
Jameis avg td 24.2, avg interceptions 17.6, td/int ratio 1.375

Peyton avg sacs per season 21.6
Jameis avg sacs per season 33.8

Peyton avg rating 85.9
Jameis avg rating 87.4

They were both coached by Bruce Arians during their worst season for interceptions:
Peyton in 1998, 28
Jameis in 2019, 30

Peyton Manning played with running back Marshall Faulk in 1998 who was followed by Edgerrin James and two Hall of Fame wide receivers in Marvin Harrison and Reggie Wayne. Winston had one wideout of note in Mike Evans but had weak support from the ground game after Doug Martin’s comeback year in 2015.

??????

Steve Young was deemed a bust by the Bucs, so I think the jury is still out on Jameis.

 

[guidomerkinsrules]

one thing i'm fairly confident predicting is that he will not throw more Ints than threads about him

 

[guidomerkinsrules]

I think Peyton ate a lot more W’s

and i think that's part of the point OP is making

 

[NewOrleansBoy]

It’s mainly the fact that we are spoiled by Brees and how his play is to the point where we are accustomed to what the standards are for good quarterback play. I’m telling you, I’m gonna miss him hella when he retires.


That footwork, ability to audible, quick release, accuracy, and ability to look off his defenders and scanning through all of his options, and the leadership/warrior.

Admit it, with Brees, you never ever get blown out

*sigh*

 

[gavinj]

and i think that's part of the point OP is making

I agree. If Jameis would have won two more games a season in Tampa, he’d still be there.

 

[SaintStephen1]

Start with basic intelligence and stop there. Payton may have been the most cerebral QB of all time. Winston doesn’t approach that level like most QBs. Forget the stats it is laughable to compare Jameis to Peyton. Even Jameis would agree.

 

[efil4stnias]

I think we will find out in short order.

QBs have to be cerebral. Aside from the physical attributes ( running, passing ) they have to be able to process and act within milliseconds and it invariably has to be the RIGHT decision. ( who to throw to, where the open guy is based on the defensive posture, can i step up in pocket or need to break out...etc etc) So many mental things have to happen in unison.
Preparation is key - the more of those mental things you can remove in game, ( thinking ) the less apt you are to making a mistake in game.

What ultimately sets GOAT QBs apart is the preparation - they spend so much time preparing for any given situation, that when it arises in game, they dont think, they simply act. Almost akin to muscle memory but with the brain.

Will he be able to find the open man when there is a 6 man blitz? will he be accurate? Will he take a sack instead of heaving downfield? Was his interceptions simply a lack of coaching or lack of preparation or simply lack of ability ? So many questions need to be answered.

I suspect over the next 4 games, we will find out. I hope he finds his game. Not only for Saints, but i like when guys are afforded another chance after humbly realizing that atheltic ability alone only gets you so far. Once in the NFL, EVERYONE has THAT ability. What separates you from a back up to a viable starter? Its mental.

 

[livefromDC]

Start with basic intelligence and stop there. Payton may have been the most cerebral QB of all time. Winston doesn’t approach that level like most QBs. Forget the stats it is laughable to compare Jameis to Peyton. Even Jameis would agree.

When it comes to football intelligence, that's one of the things Winston has been lauded for in the past.

 

[efil4stnias]

When it comes to football intelligence, that's one of the things Winston has been lauded for in the past.

Sitting in a QB room on a Wednesday afternoon, rattling off what player is open against Cover 3 is one thing.

Doing it on Sunday afternoon when the lights are on and 5 guys are trying to take your head off is another.

 

[football]

One thing about Winston, I am not a fan of, is his footwork. He has some of those infamous "happy feet" when he sense pressure. He gets rattled with the slightest of pressure. And when he does, he makes ton of mistakes. You can see the difference when watching Bridgewater from last year and Winston. Bridgewater does a great job setting his feet and going through his progression. Doesn't make mistakes and just take whatever the defense allows.

 

[BelowZero]

It’s mainly the fact that we are spoiled by Brees and how his play is to the point where we are accustomed to what the standards are for good quarterback play. I’m telling you, I’m gonna miss him hella when he retires.


That footwork, ability to audible, quick release, accuracy, and ability to look off his defenders and scanning through all of his options, and the leadership/warrior.

Admit it, with Brees, you never ever get blown out

*sigh*

Sans leadership (which the Saints seems to have in abundance, according to fans at least.), all of that can be learned. If Winston is intelligent at anything at all, it's football. Will it take time? Of course, being great doesn't come naturally. It's honed to an art, it was no different for Brees, who was by no means elite in his first few years with Chargers and Saints.

There's just so much blind hate/doubt for Winston based solely on his (rather old) off the field antics or playing for Tampa. Let the guy have a game or three to show fans what he's capable of.

 

[ccss]

Brett Favre didn't worry much about footwork.

One thing about Winston, I am not a fan of, is his footwork. He has some of those infamous "happy feet" when he sense pressure. He gets rattled with the slightest of pressure. And when he does, he makes ton of mistakes. You can see the difference when watching Bridgewater from last year and Winston. Bridgewater does a great job setting his feet and going through his progression. Doesn't make mistakes and just take whatever the defense allows.