What would Mark Ingram's trade value be worth? (1 Viewer)

[bclemms]

The problem is we arent giving him enough runs. 21 carries in 2 games, and you think he is the problem? The line isnt opening gaping holes like you see Denvers Oline do but, if you only give your running back 10 carries in a game, dont expect him to get 100yds. 50 yds would be lucky on 10 carries because a running back has to get in a groove. So far, no groovy.

The last 11 times Ingram's name showed up in the play by play.
False start Mark Ingram -5 yards
Pass completed to Mark Ingram for +5 yards
Pass incomplete to Mark Ingram, penalty on Brandon Coleman -10 yards
Mark Ingram rush for 1 yard
Pass completed to Mark Ingram for -3
Mark Ingram rush for 1 yard
Pass completed to Mark Ingram for 2 yards.
Mark Ingram rush for 3 yards
Pass completed to Mark Ingram for 13 yards
Mark Ingram rush, holding penalty -10 yards
Mark ingram rush for 2 yards

11 plays, -1 yard

Glad you aren't calling plays.

Besides, even if you give him more rushes he wont stay healthy. Ingram misses one game for every 42 carries. (Not making that up)

 

[blackadder]

The last 11 times Ingram's name showed up in the play by play.
False start Mark Ingram -5 yards
Pass completed to Mark Ingram for +5 yards
Pass incomplete to Mark Ingram, penalty on Brandon Coleman -10 yards
Mark Ingram rush for 1 yard
Pass completed to Mark Ingram for -3
Mark Ingram rush for 1 yard
Pass completed to Mark Ingram for 2 yards.
Mark Ingram rush for 3 yards
Pass completed to Mark Ingram for 13 yards
Mark Ingram rush, holding penalty -10 yards
Mark ingram rush for 2 yards

11 plays, -1 yard

Glad you aren't calling plays.

Besides, even if you give him more rushes he wont stay healthy. Ingram misses one game for every 42 carries. (Not making that up)

Remember what happened in Ingram's 1st game rookie year?

I think it was against Green Bay on opening weekend...Saints get to GB 1 yard line trailing by a TD with time expiring. Time for 1 play to tie (or was it for the win?).

Payton wants to let Ingram win it and showcase the pick. Ingram was stuffed time expired and Saints lost. I always felt it was a harbinger of how Ingram would pan out.

It wasn't all his fault and it was emblematic of where our run game has been most of Payton's tenure and certainly since 2012. But Ingram is a really hard working high effort good guy who is really average and can only produce as much as his OL will get him.

The fact he was drafted #1 and featured, and re-signed with options like Ivory held back is all on the coaching decisions not Ingram. It's another one where the team braintrust is just off.

 

[English]

Please show us a video


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I can't look that up for you but I've pretty much seen every carry he's had with us. From breaking a long run and stumbling out of bouds getting hurt to running straight into defenders in the open. Dude runs as stiff as a block of wood.
It is what it is. Like coach said one time "I've seen enough" to know what we got with him.

 

[robsmith32]

you people turn sour on someone faster than milk left outside in new Orleans in august.

 

[HobBeh]

The last 11 times Ingram's name showed up in the play by play.
False start Mark Ingram -5 yards
Pass completed to Mark Ingram for +5 yards
Pass incomplete to Mark Ingram, penalty on Brandon Coleman -10 yards
Mark Ingram rush for 1 yard
Pass completed to Mark Ingram for -3
Mark Ingram rush for 1 yard
Pass completed to Mark Ingram for 2 yards.
Mark Ingram rush for 3 yards
Pass completed to Mark Ingram for 13 yards
Mark Ingram rush, holding penalty -10 yards
Mark ingram rush for 2 yards

11 plays, -1 yard

Glad you aren't calling plays.

Besides, even if you give him more rushes he wont stay healthy. Ingram misses one game for every 42 carries. (Not making that up)

What kind of idiot highlights penalties and passes for - yards? As if false starts, holding penalties, or busted screen passes are his fault.

 

[HobBeh]

Remember what happened in Ingram's 1st game rookie year?

I think it was against Green Bay on opening weekend...Saints get to GB 1 yard line trailing by a TD with time expiring. Time for 1 play to tie (or was it for the win?).

Payton wants to let Ingram win it and showcase the pick. Ingram was stuffed time expired and Saints lost. I always felt it was a harbinger of how Ingram would pan out.

It wasn't all his fault and it was emblematic of where out run game has been most of Payton's tenure and certainly since 2012. But Ingram is a really hard working high effort good guy who is really average and can only produce as much as his OL will get him.

The fact his was drafted #1 and featured, and re-signed with options like Ivory held back is all on the coaching decisions not Ingram. It's another one where the team braintrust is just off.

It's Pierre Thomas, Reggie Bush, and Chris Ivory's fault for all getting hurt.

 

[bclemms]

What kind of idiot highlights penalties and passes for - yards? As if false starts, holding penalties, or busted screen passes are his fault.

I wasn't blaming him, I posted that in response to saying he just needed more touches. Just saying that the running game wasn't working and throwing the ball to him wasn't working so you don't just continue to feed an injury prone player for the sake of feeding him. Sorry, guess I should have explained it better for those that struggle with comprehension.

 

[FatCitySaint]

I wasn't blaming him, I posted that in response to saying he just needed more touches. Just saying that the running game wasn't working and throwing the ball to him wasn't working so you don't just continue to feed an injury prone player for the sake of feeding him. Sorry, guess I should have explained it better for those that struggle with comprehension.

It's how they use him, dude. I posted this last week but no one wanted to hear it, You can't run constant no back sets and then every time there is a back in the game you run it. He's tackled before he even gets the ball. The defense always know when we are running, we don't even try to hide it. We don't make the defense have to even try to figure out what we are going to do.

 

[WilliamBrees]

Ingram is is in the top 3 best offensive players we have, why would we trade him. Ingram Is a top RB in the league, hate all you want it won't change that.

He is? Someone above just said he's not as tough a runner as Ivory, does not have the break away speed that Sproles does, and does not grind out yards like PT.

Ingram, all he does is run for 3 yards on average and on a good play a 10 yard run. I think we made a mistake trading Ivory. Yeah he would have gotten hurt but we were never desperate at RB.

Ingram is best suited against run defenses who can't stop the run and he does not get enough carries in those games. He will probably do well Monday night but that's because of Atlanta and his history. It's not going to change anything different if he does not follow up against a weak run d like San Diego.

He is better than what we currently have but that's not saying much.

 

[blackadder]

It's how they use him, dude. I posted this last week but no one wanted to hear it, You can't run constant no back sets and then every time there is a back in the game you run it. He's tackled before he even gets the ball. The defense always know when we are running, we don't even try to hide it. We don't make the defense have to even try to figure out what we are going to do.

This is also a fair point, or unfair to Ingram.

He needs clear running lanes and he will give it his all, but without them he's not going to generate anything on his own the way above average backs can.

 

[bclemms]

It's how they use him, dude. I posted this last week but no one wanted to hear it, You can't run constant no back sets and then every time there is a back in the game you run it. He's tackled before he even gets the ball. The defense always know when we are running, we don't even try to hide it. We don't make the defense have to even try to figure out what we are going to do.

Care to share some stats?

We don't put Ingram in the slot very often. Actually, it's very rare. When he was in the game this past week we threw the ball 25 times, unlikely any were out of empty sets, we ran the ball 11 times. If teams were predicting something based on that they should be predicting pass since we threw the ball 70% of the times Ingram was in the game.

 

[HayBear]

It's a fair question to ask what Ingram's trade value is. Unfortunately, it isn't much. Maybe a 6th or 7th round pick, if we're lucky.

Ask this question: What is Ingram good at? What is his specialty?
Does he run tough like Ivory? No
Does he have breakaway speed like Sproles did? No
Does he squeeze the absolute most yards out of each carry like PT? No

He's an average all around NFL RB.

I have been saying this since his 1st NFL carry

Thank You.

 

[FatCitySaint]

Care to share some stats?

I will leave that up to you, I just watch the games.

 

[bclemms]

I will leave that up to you, I just watch the games.

We run a lot of empty or zero packages but we do it with the personnel grouping that fits it. This season the RB in that personnel grouping has been Cadet.

At one point in 2012 or 2013 season we were tipping our hat with Ingram since we were running almost exactly 50% of the time when we normally throw 65% of the time. However, when we go to our 1 WR, 2 TE, FB, RB set with Ingram we run the ball almost 70% of the time but the other 30% are shot plays where we go play action and take a shot. So teams don't even cheat up in that formation because they'd much rather face Ingram running up the gut than Brees taking a shot over the safety. Plus you have to factor in obvious passing situations in which Ingram isn't on the field that we are 100% pass and then factor in short yardage or goal line situations which are more likely to be running plays in which Ingram is on the field. Just those two situations are enough to account for the 15% difference.

In other words, it may appear that way because we notice that we throw 100% of the time out of empty sets but in reality, the only thing that we are tipping is that we are throwing when we go empty. As long as the offensive line is holding up I'm more than fine with Brees going empty. He is particularly lethal out of the shotgun and when you allow him to dictate match ups presnap then it negates any advantage the defense may have gained by knowing it's a pass. It's what he does as well as anyone in history. When our line is struggling to pass block and we constantly go empty it drives me nuts as well.

 

[Surviving Saint]

The last 11 times Ingram's name showed up in the play by play.
False start Mark Ingram -5 yards
Pass completed to Mark Ingram for +5 yards
Pass incomplete to Mark Ingram, penalty on Brandon Coleman -10 yards
Mark Ingram rush for 1 yard
Pass completed to Mark Ingram for -3
Mark Ingram rush for 1 yard
Pass completed to Mark Ingram for 2 yards.
Mark Ingram rush for 3 yards
Pass completed to Mark Ingram for 13 yards
Mark Ingram rush, holding penalty -10 yards
Mark ingram rush for 2 yards

11 plays, -1 yard

Glad you aren't calling plays.

Besides, even if you give him more rushes he wont stay healthy. Ingram misses one game for every 42 carries. (Not making that up)

I agree with the injury prone statement. But I would run him more. If he gets hurt, thats his problem.

His DYAR( Defense-adjusted Yards Above Replacement) is 14, ranked No. 19
His DVOA( Defense adjusted Value over Average is 8.4%. Ranked No.15

He isnt doing bad at 4.2 ypc.

Oakland game he had 12 carries for 58 yards. 4.8ypc.
NYGiants game he had 9 carries for 30 yards. 3.3 ypc

I think I would run him a little more than 9-12 times a game. Im not saying he would get 100 yards on 15 carries but its obvious we arent winning throwing 40+ times a game. Payton still have the virus. We ran 13 plays total vs the Giants. 13 times in a low scoring game. If the line opens a crease and gets a push he can get yards. Im not his biggest fan but running the ball is something we need to do.