Why won’t DA give Winston a shot ?? (1 Viewer)

Go back to the 1st 3 game boards. Talking about slanted views. According to the majority on here bashing Dalton you made every excuse in the book for JW play. None of the camps are different. Everyone has bias for who they want and who they think gives us the best shot. Problem is, it is no one on the saints roster. We need a new coach and rebuild. Yall keep trying to pick the worst turd.
Nah, can't say that about @BayouSAINTJoe . Him, myself, and a few others have spent more time talking about the horrible scheming , play-calling and faulty evaluation as opposed to the Winston-Dalton "war." We were bashing coaching before it was the cool thing to do on this board.
 
Winston has been trash all year. This team is undisciplined in its play has too many injuries at crucial spots O line CB, DL, and WR. Our coach is lost and in over his head and it’s obvious. Winston not fixing this. New coach and staff needed. A few new players at certain positions and a turn around can happen next few seasons.
How can you say a guy who hasn’t played since the third game of the year has been trash all year, but praise a guy who’s played healthy but has gone 2-6?
 
Last edited:
I wonder if people that just go right to blaming the QB realize how lazy that is and how much it clarifies that they don’t really realize what they’re watching.

If someone thinks Dalton is why we lost today they either don’t truly understand the game or they simply have some type of agenda to bash anyone that plays QB, or maybe anyone besides Winston.

I’m fine if he gives Winston a shot, at this point what’s it really matter. However, Dalton played fine, he played just as well as the QB that won the game.

Winston isn’t the answer either.
Oh so you know what you are watching better than we do because we want to see either Hill or Winston because Dalton is just NOT getting it done? Get outta here with that!!!!
 
Nah, can't say that about @BayouSAINTJoe . Him, myself, and a few others have spent more time talking about the horrible scheming , play-calling and faulty evaluation as opposed to the Winston-Dalton "war." We were bashing coaching before it was the cool thing to do on this board.
My thing is that we start Winston in the same exact Small Ball Pete offense... We are just gonna get worse results.

They never built an offense around Jameis. They just charade the corpse of Payton's playbook and call the most predictable offense imaginable.

Your only real solution is get coach that build a system made for Wintson. The spread system in Maimi and Kansas City come to mind...



Your top three shotgun offenses are Miami, Kansas City, and Seattle. NO surprise that they are also top offensive teams.
 
My thing is that we start Winston in the same exact Small Ball Pete offense... We are just gonna get worse results.

They never built an offense around Jameis. They just charade the corpse of Payton's playbook and call the most predictable offense imaginable.

Your only real solution is get coach that build a system made for Wintson. The spread system in Maimi and Kansas City come to mind...



Your top three shotgun offenses are Miami, Kansas City, and Seattle. NO surprise that they are also top offensive teams.
I made a point to bring that up earlier in the season. Every QB that people on here salivate over plays majority of their snaps from the shotgun and the game has been simplified for them. Andy Reid's system gave Mike Vick his greatest season as a passer. Let that sink in for a second. Successful coaches build the system around their player which takes us to the point below.

It’s been said before, but to echo the insanity, we are running an offense designed for Drew Brees, and coached by Sean Payton, but neither of those guys are here, and we are stuck like schmucks. It’s just dumb.
And the sad thing is it isn't even a Prime Brees offense that we were running but the offense built for the shell of Drew. A sure fire sign to see that they really didn't make that many changes to the offense schematically? Taysom still taking snaps at QB instead of being a true H-Back like Deebo Samuel.

They talked a good game this off-season but results on the field tells the story.
 
Again, he made enough throws and plays to win today.

Putting an unhealthy Jameis out there doesn’t solve anything.

Well it would solve one thing, people would stop having a ***** about putting Winston every time the first series doesn’t go according to plan. At this point I’m kind of on board actually. Not because I think Winston will miraculously turn into a player he’s never been in his NFL career but because the narrative that he would solve any of our offensive problems is boring and I think it’s the only way it ends.
 
Well it would solve one thing, people would stop having a ***** about putting Winston every time the first series doesn’t go according to plan. At this point I’m kind of on board actually. Not because I think Winston will miraculously turn into a player he’s never been in his NFL career but because the narrative that he would solve any of our offensive problems is boring and I think it’s the only way it ends.

It's not that Jameis will solve our offensive issues. It would be the fact that his retaking of the offense would be an acknowledgement that small ball west coast offense doesn't work against good defenses. The Saints need to change their tactics and strategy to match the players available.

FYI, west coast died when everyone started drafting 235 lbs linebackers that run 4.4 40's. The space that existed around big lumbering 265 lbs gap fillers is gone now that the league is so passing skewed. You could see it even with Brees 5 years ago. The defenses adjusted and our yards per attempt kept dropping because of his arm strength and the lack of space.
 
Last edited:
Alright, just gonna throw out there that in the red zone, Jameis's stats put him amongst the all time greats. Dude has his issues, but red zone scoring is indisputably not one of them.

Maybe we should let Dalton get us to the red zone and then have Jameis close the drive out.

In all seriousness I think redzone playcalling is a big issue and I don’t know that that changes no matter who’s undercenter. Today we couldn’t run the ball willingly at all. Typically that’s not the issue though. Generally it seems to me that our receivers don’t win their battles in the redzone consistently. Part of that is that we really only got Olave and Landry that are established/good receivers. Then there’s Tre’Quan who has 2-3 good games a year and either gets hurt or disappears. Olave’s skillset as a rookie is limited by the compact area of the redzone. Landry’s been hurt himself. Everyone else are UDFA guys really. I don’t make why we don’t use Trautman more, I think he’s quietly had a good season catching the ball but I have to assume he’s not winning either since I can’t see the all 22. Johnson had been good the last few weeks but wasn’t good today. When he did win today he didn’t catch the ball. Taysom won and also didn’t catch the ball.
 
It's not that Jameis will solve our offensive issues. It would be the fact that his retaking of the offense would be an acknowledgement that small ball west coast offense doesn't work against good defenses. The Saints need to change their tactics and strategy to match the players available.

FYI, west coast died when everyone started drafting 235 lbs linebackers that run 4.4 40's. The space that existed around big lumbering 265 lbs gap fillers is gone now that the league is so passing skewed. You could see it even with Brees 5 years ago. The defenses adjusted and our yards per attempt kept dropping because of his arm strength and the lack of space.

That’s an entirely different issue though. That’s scheming an new offense and changing philosophy. They don’t have a different offense for Winston than they do for Dalton, and they clearly were never planning too based on what we saw in the beginning of this year. It didn’t look like Payton did either from what we saw before Winston got hurt last year, although I was getting the feeling the gloves were going to come off against Tampa in the game he got injured. We’ll never know for sure but whatever the full plan was Payton decided he’d rather spend a year doing TV interviews and angling for a new job than to try to bring his Winston schemed offense into 2022. I think if Payton was truly confident in a Winston schemed offense he’d still be here.
 
Last edited:
. I think if Payton was truly confident in a Winston schemed offense he’d still be here.


That's just hearsay with no objective facts and already proven to be false, PAyton was trying to leave while he had Brees... multiple times. Go brush your teeth,because you're grossly talking out of your arse, I'm tried of hearing this stupid line.
 
It's not that Jameis will solve our offensive issues. It would be the fact that his retaking of the offense would be an acknowledgement that small ball west coast offense doesn't work against good defenses. The Saints need to change their tactics and strategy to match the players available.

FYI, west coast died when everyone started drafting 235 lbs linebackers that run 4.4 40's. The space that existed around big lumbering 265 lbs gap fillers is gone now that the league is so passing skewed. You could see it even with Brees 5 years ago. The defenses adjusted and our yards per attempt kept dropping because of his arm strength and the lack of space.
Thanks for sharing this. A few of us have been saying similar, since it became obvious we were still trying to play small-ball without the HOF QB and HC that made it work in the regular season the last few years. And the O only evolved to that because Drew couldn’t stretch the field anymore, but was so great he could still deal the goods.

I thought when they brought Winston back, added Landry, and drafted Olave, they were going to do what most good coaching staffs do and tailor their system to the talent, but they did not do that.

They were fools to bring back Winston and name him starter without making sure there was a player/philosophy/playcalling fit.

Then they were fools for blaming him for the O sucking when they didn’t adjust and knew he was hurt.

Now they are fools for running a small ball offense that as you explained doesn’t work when D’s have so much speed on the edge and at LB and can crush the short passing game while stuffing the run game when there is no consistent, schematic threat intermediate and deep.

Only bottom feeder defenses that lack speed/athleticism in their front 7 “struggle” to slow this offense down. And even then, the unimaginative play-calling and predictable personnel groupings make this offense a failure on most days unless we get unicorn play (JW in game 1, Taysom and AK against Seattle, Olave and Taysom against LV and LAR).

They won’t change though. DA has dug in.
 
That’s an entirely different issue though. That’s scheming an new offense and changing philosophy. They don’t have a different offense for Winston than they do for Dalton, and they clearly were never planning too based on what we saw in the beginning of this year. It didn’t look like Payton did either from what we saw before Winston got hurt last year, although I was getting the feeling the gloves were going to come off against Tampa in the game he got injured. We’ll never know for sure but whatever the full plan was Payton decided he’d rather spend a year doing TV interviews and angling for a new job than to try to bring his Winston schemed offense into 2022. I think if Payton was truly confident in a Winston schemed offense he’d still be here.
I don't know if you know this or not but a "Winston schemed offense" (based off of everything that is said to be a strength) would be one that looked like the offense that he ran with a prime Brees and it looked like we were actually going to open things up before he got hurt last season. And that's why I think this offensive mess that we are in is due to DA's "vision" for the offense. PC sat in the same room with CSP and knew where he wanted to go but here we are; predictable scheming leading to stale play calling.
 
I made a point to bring that up earlier in the season. Every QB that people on here salivate over plays majority of their snaps from the shotgun and the game has been simplified for them. Andy Reid's system gave Mike Vick his greatest season as a passer. Let that sink in for a second. Successful coaches build the system around their player which takes us to the point below.


And the sad thing is it isn't even a Prime Brees offense that we were running but the offense built for the shell of Drew. A sure fire sign to see that they really didn't make that many changes to the offense schematically? Taysom still taking snaps at QB instead of being a true H-Back like Deebo Samuel.

They talked a good game this off-season but results on the field tells the story.
bUt yOu cAnT bE iN sHoTgUn





Except the chiefs do... with ridiculous success. You watch it.... They aren't making Mahomes throwing crazy passes. If anyone can watch that offense and tell me that Winston couldn't run same system from shotgun with those reads. All they do is overload secondaries. Nothing freaking special. Looks like the 2 minute offense Winston runs to amazing results
 

Create an account or login to comment

You must be a member in order to leave a comment

Create account

Create an account on our community. It's easy!

Log in

Already have an account? Log in here.

Users who are viewing this thread

    Back
    Top Bottom