Would you rather? Part 2 (2 Viewers)

[Optimus Prime]

I posted this before a few years ago.

It is a crime that the Dome Patrol Saints never won a Super Bowl.

You have a time machine you can make one of the following happen:

Bring in an in his prime Drew Brees to pass to Eric Martin and Quinn Early, handing off to Dalton Hilliard and Ironhead but coached by Jim Mora and Carl Smith

Or...………….

Bring Sean Payton to coach and call plays with Bobby Hebert as QB

Which has the greater impact?

I never want to vote against Drew no matter the question

It could be Drew Brees vs Godzilla and I'm picking Brees

But this time I gotta go against Drew

As conservative as those offenses were there was talent there and I think that Payton would do a much better job with Hebert, Martin, Early etc than Mora does with Brees as QB

And we'll assume that the defense plays the same as they did

 

[Zardnok]

Drew's drive would cause him to excel in any scheme. Hebert is not intelligent enough to grasp all of the complexities of Payton's offense. Perhaps those offenses were so simplistic because that was all Hebert could grasp.

 

[sammymvpknight]

I went with Brees, but I do think that Hebert could probably do pretty well handing the ball off to Kamara and Ingram all game

 

[saint_drago]

Drew's drive would cause him to excel in any scheme. Hebert is not intelligent enough to grasp all of the complexities of Payton's offense. Perhaps those offenses were so simplistic because that was all Hebert could grasp.

This is such a great point. I can honestly say that this thought had never occurred to me. Maybe Mora/Smith were being held back by the limitations of their QB and not the other way around.

But I'm going with Drew Brees on this one. I think he is so good, so driven, and so accurate that he could've made the most out of the situation. We didn't need the #1 offense back then just like we don't need the #1 defense now. We just needed a guy to move the chains and hit the open man when he was there. I have no doubt Drew could've done that.

 

[GilFinnerty]

Drew did well with a run based 22 perosnel scheme in SD I beleive.

 

[Saint Jack]

If Mora had Brees with the Dome Patrol, the Saints would've had a Super Bowl in the late 80s/early 90s.

 

[Zardnok]

This is such a great point. I can honestly say that this thought had never occurred to me. Maybe Mora/Smith will being held back by the limitations of their QB and not the other way around.

But I'm going with Drew Brees on this one. I think he is so good, so driven, and so accurate that he could've made the most out of the situation. We didn't need the #1 offense back then just like we don't need the #1 defense now. We just needed a guy to move the chains and hit the open man when he was there. I have no doubt Drew could've done that.

If you look at Hebert's stats with the Saints being "Conservative" and then compare them to when he went to the Falcon's and they tried to "open things up", his fumbles and interceptions spiked as he struggled to adjust to a "more wide open" passing system. Hebert averaged 1.8 turn-overs per game for the Falcons (49 int, 23 fumbles, in 40 games) versus just over 1 turn-over per game with the Saints (75 int, 8 fumbles, in 78 games) .

 

[Optimus Prime]

Drew's drive would cause him to excel in any scheme. Hebert is not intelligent enough to grasp all of the complexities of Payton's offense. Perhaps those offenses were so simplistic because that was all Hebert could grasp.

Good Point.

If I remember right a lot of people were of the opinion that Mora wouldn't have been able to take advantage of Brees' massive talent


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZDOI0cq6GZM


First 15 sec

 

[GW93]

Good Point.

If I remember right a lot of people were of the opinion that Mora wouldn't have been able to take advantage of Brees' massive talent


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZDOI0cq6GZM


First 15 sec

Heh heh. “Mule.”

 

[Swimmer]

I went with Brees, but I do think that Hebert could probably do pretty well handing the ball off to Kamara and Ingram all game

I go with Brees but also would like to give Hebert the benefit of the doubt. Bobby did throw the short passes well, so he could have utilized Kamara and Ingram. But with Hebert, defenses were never worried he would take the top off the defense so they stacked 8 in the box and even 9 in a loose box, if there is such a thing

 

[renegadewa]

I go with Brees but also would like to give Hebert the benefit of the doubt. Bobby did throw the short passes well, so he could have utilized Kamara and Ingram. But with Hebert, defenses were never worried he would take the top off the defense so they stacked 8 in the box and even 9 in a loose box, if there is such a thing

This is pretty spot on in that Hebert scared no one. The Saints did have playmakers back in those days and Hebert was NOT one of them!!

 

[albionmoonlight]

Payton > Mora

Drew >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hebert

 

[ChaChingBaby]

Voting with option 2.

Herbert is probably the most overrated player in all of Saints history and is easily the most overrated Saints QB of all time.

When people talk badly about Brees, I have to wonder how old they are cause there was a time when we were used to having bad QB's. If you grew up watching this team in the 80's and 90's, chances are that you had to watch the 49ers with Joe Montana and later Steve Young, the Packers with Brett Favre, the Cowboys with Troy Aikman and all these teams went on to win Super Bowls with their Hall of Fame QB's.

Most of those horrifying playoff losses under Mora fall on his shoulders. It sometimes felt like he just saved his worst performances for the playoffs. Internet did not exist back in the day and you didn't have advanced stats, DVOA or any of the sites that measure QB performance broken down into a number of stats. If we had the internet back then and those advanced stats, I think Herbert would've been ranked as one of the worst QBs in the playoffs. He was basically to us what Blake Bortles is to the Jaguars except we didn't win playoff games with Herbert. He would melt down and save his absolute worst game for the playoffs.

As great as the Dome Patrol defenses were, we were doomed from having a bad QB situation that only got worse when we tried to replace Herbert. Jimmy Johnson in Dallas ended up fleecing us in that trade for Steve Walsh. Read up on "The Boys Will Be Boys" by Jeff Pearlman and it lays out how Johnson realized quickly that Walsh was a bust and he came up with an idea to trade him for draft picks by using the media to make it seem like there was a QB competition between Walsh and Aikman. Dallas spent all training camp in 1990 talking about how amazing Walsh was to get some team to foolishly believe in him and then trade him for draft picks. Along came the Saints and we gave the Cowboys our first and third round pick.

I don't think we even needed Brees back then but it would've been amazing to see Eric Martin catch TDs from him. Jim Everett in 1994 and 1995 had the two best seasons of a Saints QB in franchise history up to that point. If we would've had Everett in 1991-1992 with that defense, we're probably looking at a championship or at least a trip to the NFC title game.

The 1991 playoff loss to Atlanta is still to this day the worst playoff loss in franchise history to us. Yes, the 49ers loss was heart breaking and so was the recent Vikings loss, but there was something special about 1991 and then it was all over to our hated arch-rivals who had Deion Sanders and MC Hammer with that annoying "Too Legit To Quit" stuff. That game was going great early on at 10-0 until Herbert throws the INT to Deion Sanders in the end zone. That's when the game turned upside down. Why was Herbert even throwing the ball at the goal line to begin with? Just punch it in, go up 17-0 and I have no doubt in my mind that our defense would've slowly suffocated that offense and we win easily. Instead, Herbert being Herbert throws it over their best player (Sanders) and it turns into a ball game after that.

Payton wouldn't have been able to get much out of Herbert and I figure he would've gave up on him a lot sooner than we did. The peak of the Dome Patrol was wasted with a bad QB situation between Herbert and then the brief time with Steve Walsh that ended in a disaster.

 

[albionmoonlight]

Herbert is probably the most overrated player in all of Saints history and is easily the most overrated Saints QB of all time.

Truth.

 

[kcirdor]

Drew's drive would cause him to excel in any scheme. Hebert is not intelligent enough to grasp all of the complexities of Payton's offense. Perhaps those offenses were so simplistic because that was all Hebert could grasp.

I don't think those offenses were a product of Hebert. They were a product of Mora's conservative coaching style. Carl Smith is actually a super bowl champion coaching up Russel Wilson.


Run Run Run Punt when clearly Eric Martin could catch anything.