Saints Cap Moves: $28,156,521 cap space ….. 8 restructures, 3 extensions, 3 pay cut, 1 release [All current cap moves are in OP]

[Elvis]

Is this the article?



They could not have shopped him (or let him "test the market") unless they wanted to eat the full dead cap. So unless I'm missing something, that's a meaningless statement. Maybe "test the market" thing came from Carr's camp. He could've tested every market, it just meant that the Saints would have jumped their 2025 Dead Cap to $90M, and that's before they've made decisions on Ruiz, Hill, Ramcyz, others.

Business szn.

"Several NFL sources believe that Carr was open to testing the market"? "Sources" and "believe"? And they didn't both report it, but both contributed to the same article?

That said, the math you're using is wrong. The team could have had a one time dead cap hit of $51m if they had flat out cut him or a $41m hit had they traded him. They would have had to restructure far more deserving players to do it, but those are the numbers.

 

[St. Geezy]

Is this the article?



They could not have shopped him (or let him "test the market") unless they wanted to eat the full dead cap. So unless I'm missing something, that's a meaningless statement. Maybe "test the market" thing came from Carr's camp. He could've tested every market, it just meant that the Saints would have jumped their 2025 Dead Cap to $90M, and that's before they've made decisions on Ruiz, Hill, Ramcyz, others.

Business szn.

I’m pretty certain that Carr’s side is not dumb enough to believe we’d do a trade and take on his entire cap hit immediately. Logic and common sense dictates that salary modifications would have had to be made to facilitate any deal.

 

[St. Geezy]

A really good, level-headed read from Sean Fazande on the subject.

 

[texasjefe]

I’m pretty certain that Carr’s side is not dumb enough to believe we’d do a trade and take on his entire cap hit immediately. Logic and common sense dictates that salary modifications would have had to be made to facilitate any deal.

Regardless of the option, they did not extend, spread, and trade.
Too much of a PITA.

They bought 12 months to figure out how to wrestle with his 2026 $70M cap number. Can't wait!

 

[St. Geezy]

Regardless of the option, they did not extend, spread, and trade.
Too much of a PITA.

They bought 12 months to figure out how to wrestle with his 2026 $70M cap number. Can't wait!

I think if he’s good in the new system, you work to give him a reasonable 1 to 2 year extension to buy yourself a little more bridge QB time. If he’s bad, you cut him with a 6/1 designation and go all-in on a new passer in the draft or next year’s free agency/trade period.

What’s defined as “good” or “bad” will need to be evaluated by the team, in conjunction with the team results.

 

[livefromDC]

Tell yourself whatever you have to tell yourself to hold onto the hope that you were right all along, even if that includes believing our new head coach is being manipulated and is lying.

All I know is that if the team had decided to go against my own wishes and moved on from Carr, I wouldn’t be on here complaining about it all day every day like some.

Learn to cope and move forward with ways we can fix the team based on the framework that’s being laid out.

This is entertainment…watch it, follow it, critique it if you must, but don’t act like you know what’s best and scream it to the ceiling every time the team’s philosophy doesn’t flow with how you and all your GM and coaching experience would build a team. We aren’t GMs and complaining endlessly isn’t going to change anything.

What’s the point of being a fan if you’re just going to be mad at every single thing the team does at this point? You know we aren’t going forward with the vision you and others had, so find a way to cope.

Just my advice.

I guess the most puzzling thing about this thread is that it seems people are shocked that this happened. I know Elvis made an interesting "what if" thread about the salary cap, but I surely thought that everyone knew that THIS (not cutting Carr) was the most likeliest scenario, Carr is restructured. Outside of an insane Superbowl run, it was going to be easier to cut ties with him next off-season compared to this one. That was always the most likely outcome. Why have Carr eat up the cap for a year and then have to sign a veteran anyway? This was always the most logical outcome. Even Denver waited a year when Payton was obviously ready to move on to a new QB. Moore gets the space to start adding his pieces, a year to evaluate Rattler in his system, and a softer salary cap hit over 2 years when Carr is likely cut next off season.

We are going to pay 50 million dollars to players not on the team, and they are going to end up paying Derek Carr 150 Million Dollars. This is just insane to me for a team with no pro-bowlers. Why didn’t we just wash it all. Start from scratch next year with these draft picks.

Because that's not how the salary cap works. You can't just cut everybody since that money immediately counts against the cap. To do so would mean, the Saints go over the cap and no money to pay new players replace those let go. Letting it play out this year helps considerably. They will even be in a better place to let players go come August if need be. Yes, it's painful when you choose to pay the wrong players, but that's being rectified through Dennis Allen's firing and contracts expiring over the next year.

This isn't the problem some of us are making it out to be. "We" ( i have to laugh at that and correct it)...watching the Saints pay $50 million to players that are not on the team is a lot better than being a fan of a team not willing to pay $50 million to players that are the heart and soul of their team. We're lucky to have an ownership that wants to win and will invest in doing so. The Saints are currently shackled with Payton's bad contracts (Taysom) and Allen's (Carr), but there's plausible way through them. This is the way.

 

[texasjefe]

I think if he’s good in the new system, you work to give him a reasonable 1 to 2 year extension to buy yourself a little more bridge QB time. If he’s bad, you cut him with a 6/1 designation and go all-in on a new passer in the draft or next year’s free agency/trade period.

What’s defined as “good” or “bad” will need to be evaluated by the team, in conjunction with the team results.

I agree with this but an argument can be made that he'll never do enough to justify extending him and his over-rated salary onto more caps, which extends out the nasty dead cap.

The key to gold in the NFL is to get a QB on a first contract so you really can spend big money on lines, weapons, and defense. If you don't have that and you're playing pocket pool with a vet with a known mid-ceiling, then well you're just playing pocket pool, on the field and on the cap.

Fazende's article was net zero. Nothing new, didn't move the needle. But he feels bad for Derek's hurt fees fees.

A Dallas radio guy I like explained fan hate well.

He said that when the team is not winning, then they want to blame someone. They can blame Owner, GM, Head Coach/coordinators, or QB.

With the Saints, we're not hating the owner. Some blame the GM but that gets people rising up in GM's defense.

Owner blamed the coach and fired him so coach is out of the picture.

That leaves the enigmatic poster child of the Dennis Allen era, Derek Carr.

 

[Saints 318]

 

[St. Geezy]

I agree with this but an argument can be made that he'll never do enough to justify extending him and his over-rated salary onto more caps, which extends out the nasty dead cap.

The key to gold in the NFL is to get a QB on a first contract so you really can spend big money on lines, weapons, and defense. If you don't have that and you're playing pocket pool with a vet with a known mid-ceiling, then well you're just playing pocket pool, on the field and on the cap.

Fazende's article was net zero. Nothing new, didn't move the needle. But he feels bad for Derek's hurt fees fees.

A Dallas radio guy I like explained fan hate well.

He said that when the team is not winning, then they want to blame someone. They can blame Owner, GM, Head Coach/coordinators, or QB.

With the Saints, we're not hating the owner. Some blame the GM but that gets people rising up in GM's defense.

Owner blamed the coach and fired him so coach is out of the picture.

That leaves the enigmatic poster child of the Dennis Allen era, Derek Carr.

Yep. Everyone craves a “Mascot” to direct their ire at. There was a point where the mascot was DA, then it became Mickey, then wildly for a bit it became Mrs. Benson. Once DA was let go, it needed to turn full fledge to the next person in line, Mickey.

I’m one that’s not as into the blame game/thirst for blood thing and have gained a sort of zen and appreciation for both the luck involved in winning as well as the natural ebb and flow of the league (you will have periods of down times naturally), specifically when talking about the GM level.

I’ll call out incompetence when I see it though (I was very critical about DA and Carmichael), especially if the person involved has never shown they can do the job well, so I am not a Sunshine pumper. I just think we’ve hit a natural rut, a string of bad luck and misfires, and that sometimes takes a bit to dig out of.

We won a lot of football games over a 15 year span, and sometimes the law of averages comes back with a harsh vengeance.

 

[Merl]

Why post that drivel

 

[DerrickB]

Why post that drivel

Why not?

 

[St. Geezy]

To add to my last post, I think for me, I blame more of our woes on extremely poor coaching and injuries than our roster being egregiously worse than everyone else’s.

Sure, we could use a big WR, LG, a fat DT, and maybe a secondary guy or two, but we aren’t a 5-12 roster. I mean, for as bad as DA was, we sure played a lot of close games, some against some really good opponents, and I’d like to think a great coach could have been the edge in many of those games.

Subpar coaching has not maximized the players we have on the roster and drafted, and we have had an abnormal amount of depth all on the field at the same time due to injuries, which spells disaster for just about any team.

So maybe that’s why I’m a lot more in a “Let’s plug these holes and try to win” mode than most are. I look at our roster and see a different picture than most people do.

It’s an average roster with some holes, primed and ready to take off if we can string together a good off-season haul, starting tomorrow, and get a little bit more good fortune going our way in games. JMO.

 

[DSnfla]

I think his worth is 2 year 19m. That Sigler guy is a negative Twitter troll. His last tweet about Carrs restructure : “THE CALIFORNIA BASED Derek Carr won’t help out his team”. Or something inflammatory like that. Coming from a guy that looks like he hasn’t bathed in his life.

Siglar is the biggest negative hack on the internet . I call him out all the time , All he does is chase Carr haters for click bait

 

[DSnfla]

It is such a weird tone shift from media day with being noncommittal. It didn't help that Loomis broke the news about sticking with Carr, either. Should of been Moore.

I will not buy the Loomis conspiracy of Carr being forced onto Moore. The only thing that I'll entertain is that Loomis took some time convincing Moore to keep Carr for a year. So, regardless... This is Moore's decision to sort of spend a year with a QB that doesn't make sense long term.

The last thing we want to do is actually build a contender around a 35 or 36 year old QB that will decline at a moment notice or fall apart from fatigue in the final hour on a playoff run. The window to succeed with Carr has passed.

So, it's just weird. Being two years away from a younger QB vs. being 1 year away is certainly a decision.

It does seem like if Gayle didn't step in with DA firing. I would imagine that he probably would of gotten one more year.

LOL it's the media and the DC haters that interpreted that KM was non-committal about DC . He did nothing but praise Carr in his presser