Ticketmaster scandal reveals the dirty underbelly to legalized scalping (1 Viewer)

[superchuck500]

Though Ticketmaster now has a legal "re-selling" service, which effectively gives TM a piece of the scalping pie, the company has long insisted that it has safeguards in place to discourage true scalping - where profit-minded buyers acquire large numbers of tickets for the sole purpose of reselling them above the price stated on the ticket. In an area that has become very grey, scalpers now use TM and other legal re-sellers to front their tickets . . . but undercover reporting that broke last week shows that TM (or at least some agents of TM) are encouraging the scalping business, and even helping scalpers work around TM's own rules and terms of service that are ostensibly to prevent volume re-sellers from accessing the system.

Purists argue that scalping is just free market forces at play - while opponents submit that scalpers use tools (like IP-masking bots and multiple, simultaneous logins at the point-of-sale) that the consumer ticket buyer just doesn't have. Opponents also argue that for most events, the average price of re-sold tickets ends up fairly close to the ticket prices themselves (as enthusiastic demand will pay 2x , 3x, or more, but demand falls off before the show and prices often go well below ticket price or go unsold entirely), which defeats the purpose and should otherwise use a single point-of-sale.

TM has vigorously defended its rules and terms of service, and argues that the scandal is the result of rogue TM employees.


View: https://youtu.be/a0Mv2wqTh6A


The story has legs, and even prompted a swift, bi-partisan inquiry from the US Senate requesting that TM go on the record about its re-selling practices:
https://www.moran.senate.gov/public...0EFA8A0.9.21.18---bots-live-nation-letter.pdf


TM president's response:

Ticketmaster is continuing to speak out after accusations that they were working behind-the-scenes with online ticket scalpers in order to profit twice.

According to an investigative report by CBC News and the Toronto Star, Ticketmaster was allowing them to have more than one Ticketmaster account to secure tickets and resell on Ticketmaster’s secondary-market site TradeDesk.

As a result, Ticketmaster profits twice while also allowing users to directly violate their own terms and use policy by having more than one account. Ticketmaster president Jared Smith is now commenting on the accusations, stating the company is going to investigate its own policies regarding the secondary-market, according to Billboard.

“We absolutely do not turn a blind eye to the misuse of our products,” Smith says. ”As you know, we spend a ton of money and a ton of time doing things like building software that prevents bots from buying tickets. These tools are not perfect, but we continue to improve those tools that identify suspicious activity.”

“We have gotten pretty effective at blocking people from buying lots of tickets, and we take it seriously,” he continues. “Where the distinction has been made and where we have to improve, I think, is on the backside of those products. We probably don’t do enough to look into TradeDesk even though it’s hard and it’s not as obvious as people are suggesting it is.”

Ticketmaster president defends resale practices following scalping scandal

 

[antipop]

it would be nice to see TM go down...they have been slimy for decades

 

[Brennan77]

Back in college when most tickets were still sold over the phone, I was offered a job working for a scalping company. The office was a basement filled with fold out tables and phones. The idea was to call the ticketing agency 5 minutes before a big event would release tickets. Of course when you requested the event they'd tell you to call back in 5. So you'd stall for a few minutes by asking them about other events. When the 5 minutes had passed you'd ask them again about the big event since you're already on the line. Then you'd use a company card to purchase as many as they'd let you buy. I had friends that made a few bucks working for them. But once I was told what was really going on I walked out. It was just slimy.

 

[guidomerkinsrules]

luckily my shocked face has had a good amount of work lately so this reaction should be pretty easy

 

[staphory]

I just don’t bother going to these events. I’ve given up. My wife wanted to see Jimmy Buffet last year. The tickets sold out in 10 minutes and were available from resellers almost immediately for a minimum $100 mark up. No thanks.

 

[superchuck500]

I just don’t bother going to these events. I’ve given up. My wife wanted to see Jimmy Buffet last year. The tickets sold out in 10 minutes and were available from resellers almost immediately for a minimum $100 mark up. No thanks.

Yep, that's precisely the problem.

 

[Brad Mojo]

My daughter is a huge McCartney fan, so I got her tickets to his upcoming tour...barely.

6 days before "tickets on sale date" there is a pre-sale for "verified fans" - sign up to prove you are not a scalper and maybe get a pre-sale code
5 days before public sale there is a pre-sale for Amex cardholders
3 days before public sale there is a "venue pre-sale" for those that have been to other events at the venue

I started checking way before any of these pre-sales, before any legal sale daye, and websites like Vivid Seats had plenty of tickets on sale for several hundred $ each. I signed up for the verified fan pre-sale and got an e-mail saying I wasn't selected, but would be put on a waiting list (yeah right).

I was very lucky to get nosebleed seats on Amex pre-sale day.

On Venue pre-sale day I tried to get tickets again but as it turned out "No seats available" as soon as it was "opened". Same for the actual public sale.

SO all tickets were "sold" not only before the public sale date, but even before the venue pre-sale date.

Yet Vivid seats had tickets on sale - complete with row and seat numbers - way before any of the pre-sales.

 

[staphory]

Here’s a pretty good story by Freakonomics.

Why Is the Live-Event Ticket Market So Screwed Up? - Freakonomics
The public has almost no chance to buy good tickets to the best events. Ticket brokers, meanwhile, make huge profits on the secondary markets. Here’s the story of how this market got so dysfunctional, how it can be fixed – and why it probably won’t be.

 

[Jeff Miller]

Oh i'm sure there is a shady side to all this with multiple companies in cahoots, but i don't have any confidence that the US Senate will have any positive effect on the situation at all.

 

[bclemms]

If I have a product that the market thinks is worth $250/each and my price is is $80/each then I just increase my price and squeeze out any 3rd party. Kind of odd that hasn't been done.

 

[superchuck500]

If I have a product that the market thinks is worth $250/each and my price is is $80/each then I just increase my price and squeeze out any 3rd party. Kind of odd that hasn't been done.

It’s not that simple. Scalpers often sell some of their tickets for less than face value.

 

[Optimus Prime]

NSFW

from this week’s episode

 

[jrdbrn]

it would be nice to see TM go down...they have been slimy for decades

Have you seen the fees of other ticket sites?

 

[porculator]

I look forward to watching that John Oliver piece. Now that I've been going to shows again it seems that getting a ticket is even more convoluted. It's really difficult to find out who the real vendor is, and the secondary markets just multiply the potential for something to go wrong.

 

[saintmdterps]

Back in college when most tickets were still sold over the phone, I was offered a job working for a scalping company. The office was a basement filled with fold out tables and phones. The idea was to call the ticketing agency 5 minutes before a big event would release tickets. Of course when you requested the event they'd tell you to call back in 5. So you'd stall for a few minutes by asking them about other events. When the 5 minutes had passed you'd ask them again about the big event since you're already on the line. Then you'd use a company card to purchase as many as they'd let you buy. I had friends that made a few bucks working for them. But once I was told what was really going on I walked out. It was just slimy.

These people are now Ticketmaster. My wife went to Dave Matthews last year. Decent but not great seats for 300.00. Nope, that 300.00 will go a long way toward buying a vintage turntable and I’ll listen to Matthews on vinyl.

Back in the day we camped out to get good seats. We got front row center for Black Sabbath and had Ronnie James Dio recognize us after the concert. Tickets were 8.50