Do you think we'll continue being aggressive in the draft now? (2 Viewers)

[Big_L]

We also gave up a 2, 3, 3 and a 4 in all the draft 'maneuvering' Loomis did to move this years first to last year and to move around the first round.

Quit justifying it as equal. Its just not. Its not as simple as "we drafted our 2023 1st round pick in 2022". A franchise rebuilding relies on young talent on their rookie contract not eating up a chunk of the salary cap. Thats 4 potential heavy contributors we dont have in our back pocket. And our 2023 1 would be higher than both of the 1st we selected last year.

Well, seeing as it was about FIRST round picks, your post is irrelevant. Cool story though.

 

[HattiesburgWhoDat]

Well, seeing as it was about FIRST round picks, your post is irrelevant. Cool story though.

How do you think we got that pick? All the picks Loomis treated like monopoly money and gave away in trades we wound up getting taken to the cleaners in.

 

[44slayer]

Well, seeing as it was about FIRST round picks, your post is irrelevant. Cool story though.

The post was about the first round picks. It was a cool story you just cant comprehend.

 

[Big_L]

The post was about the first round picks. It was a cool story you just cant comprehend.

So your drivel about 2nd and 3rd rounders . . . irrelevant. Like I said.

 

[DSnfla]

Problem there is Loomis would have no issue trading away those future picks anyway like a drunken sailor. I think there is a good chance Loomis keeps doing what he has been doing in the draft.

Loomis like most of us figured we had a playoff team last yr because barring injuries we had one in 21. He traded those picks because he thought we could get 2 starters in 21 on a rookie 1st rd contract and we would have had not Penning had the injury. Plus we got Taylor who can be a starter in 23. the problem was overestimating DA as an HC and all the injuries. It's not like ML said " I think I'll trade away a bunch of picks cause it's TUESDAY"

 

[44slayer]

So your drivel about 2nd and 3rd rounders . . . irrelevant. Like I said.

2nd round picks - Michael Thomas, Eric McCoy, Pete Werner, Marcus Maye, Alontae Taylor, Jarvis Landry

3rd round picks- Alvin Kamara, Demario Davis, PJ Williams, Tyrann Mathieu, Paulson Adebo, Trequan Smith, Adam Trautman

4th round picks - David Onyemata, Kentavious Street

Thats why it matters. These posts about "we had 2 1's last year so its ok we dont have a 1 this year" just dont hold the slightest bit of water. Its not as simple as we drafted our 2023 1st is 2022.

It cost us a 2, 3, 3, and 4 to take the 2023 in 2022 and move around the first round last year.

 

[DSnfla]

As I've said before, franchises create "franchise QBs" and not the other way around. No point of drafting a QB to be ruined by this coaching staff.

I disagree, You can't turn a sow's ear into a silk purse. The Bengals floundered until Burrow got there and then they got luck drafting Chase. They were far from even a good franchise before he got there. Buffalo is pretty much the same thing. I'm not saying a bad coaching staff can ruin a great QB but a great coach can only get so much out of a mediocre QB . You put Burrow or Allen or Mahomes on the Saints last yr and even with all the injuries and the incompetence of DA and we're in the playoffs and maybe further

 

[J.T.]

I would be fine if they trade DOWN in 2023 and take any picks they get this year for Sean Payton and roll them into more picks in 2024 to load up for a QB next year. I'm fine with Dalton in 2023 IF the Saints are somehow able to wind up with two first round picks next year and two second round picks. The Saints pick next year might be a top five pick.

Try to get the cap slightly in order and load up with picks next year.

 

[jahsoul357]

I disagree, You can't turn a sow's ear into a silk purse. The Bengals floundered until Burrow got there and then they got luck drafting Chase. They were far from even a good franchise before he got there. Buffalo is pretty much the same thing. I'm not saying a bad coaching staff can ruin a great QB but a great coach can only get so much out of a mediocre QB . You put Burrow or Allen or Mahomes on the Saints last yr and even with all the injuries and the incompetence of DA and we're in the playoffs and maybe further

Here is the thing, we are looking at it with where they are now:
Here are 3 questions that we will never know the answer to
-Where would the Bengals be if they didn't go after Chase?
-Where would Allen be if the passing offense wasn't centered around Diggs?
-What would Mahomes be without playing for one of the best coaches ever in one of the most QB friendly schemes ever?

We judge a play based off of their current situation but the truth is, we don't know what any of those quarterbacks will do in our scheme. How many were clamoring for Russell Wilson believing you could just put him anywhere? Same concept applies for every QB in the league. The great Brady couldn't play in BA's "no risk it, no biscuit" offense and changed it to what he was familiar with.

 

[DSnfla]

Here is the thing, we are looking at it with where they are now:
Here are 3 questions that we will never know the answer to
-Where would the Bengals be if they didn't go after Chase?
-Where would Allen be if the passing offense wasn't centered around Diggs?
-What would Mahomes be without playing for one of the best coaches ever in one of the most QB friendly schemes ever?

We judge a play based off of their current situation but the truth is, we don't know what any of those quarterbacks will do in our scheme. How many were clamoring for Russell Wilson believing you could just put him anywhere? Same concept applies for every QB in the league. The great Brady couldn't play in BA's "no risk it, no biscuit" offense and changed it to what he was familiar with.

If the Bengals had traded down and picked DeVonta Smith It would have turned out almost as well, plus gotten an extra pick.
Allen would have been just fine with another FA very good WR
Mahomes with just a decent offensive-minded HC would still be a franchise QB and that HC would have been elevated to elite status .
Wilson has lost a step and that was such a big part of his game
A great coach can't make a elite franchise QB out of a poor QB. But an elite franchise QB can make a HC SOOO much better . Just look at Burrow, Allen and even Herbert. But even Herbert could'nt save Staley

 

[jahsoul357]

If the Bengals had traded down and picked DeVonta Smith It would have turned out almost as well, plus gotten an extra pick.
Allen would have been just fine with another FA very good WR
Mahomes with just a decent offensive-minded HC would still be a franchise QB and that HC would have been elevated to elite status .

We both are operating on what ifs but the fact is, we rate these people based off of their current situation and we have hindsight to go over. We don't know how they would have turned out because all we have to go on is their results here. And look at what you are saying. Burrow would have turned out OK if he got another elite WR, Allen would have been "just fine" with another very good WR, and if Mahomes ends up with just a "decent" offensive-minded HC, he would still be a franchise QB (ignoring everything he said about what going to the Chiefs and sitting behind Alex Smith did for him). We are saying these things now because these are the hands that they were dealt, instead of getting drafted to trash organizations such as the Jets, Jags, Bucs, Texans, etc (and if you didn't know, the 2019 Bengals tanked..lol).

Who on this board would have predicted that Geno Smith would have been:
-#1 in completion percentage (while throwing the ball further than Burrow, Herbert and Mahomes)
-#8 in yards (while not having receivers being responsible for most of the yards)
-#4 in TDs

Nobody because the assumption is he was who he was in New York without folks actually looking at the situation and realizing that maybe the Jets were the reason he underachieved. But he is now in a situation where the coach believes in him and the OC built the offense around him and his strengths and he produced at an elite level, and not looking at him based off his reputation playing for a trashbag organization.

Coaching/scheming/playcalling matters more than "skill" in a sport with 10 other people. It is easier in basketball for a player to carry a team; that doesn't happen much (if at all) in football.

Wilson has lost a step and that was such a big part of his game

Or he went to a system that didn't cater to his strengths while exposing his weaknesses...

A great coach can't make a elite franchise QB out of a poor QB. But an elite franchise QB can make a HC SOOO much better . Just look at Burrow, Allen and even Herbert. But even Herbert could'nt save Staley

Actually, history tells us that great coaching makes an elite QB more than a QB making a HC better. And the 3 examples that you gave don't fit the mold that you are trying to present.

Let's look at our own Hall of Fame QB. Let's compare what he did in San Diego to his first season here.

 

[TribuneUK]

Not long ago, I posted a thread in which I discussed at length that the Saints could very well have traded up to 11 without making the trade with Philadelphia that we made. However, the cost for the Olave and Penning was essentially two first-round picks, a second round pick, two third-round picks, and a fourth-round pick. (There was what we gave up to Philadelphia to get the second first-round pick and then what we gave up to Washington to trade up to the 11th spot--and the price we paid in the Washington trade was reasonable.)

Yes, the same thread where you ignored the fact that that cost included *gaining* a second first round pick. Something trading with Washington alone doesn't get you.

Yes, I will keep pointing it out

 

[jasonsw]

Considering we got two firsts last year . . . .

It is so nauseating. If Saints didn't make the moves they made, no Penning and no Olave. They picked correctly in their moves.

Just because the Davenport pick didn't work out, doesn't mean N.O should not be aggressive in the draft.

Look at K.C, if they stood pat and said we're good with Alex Smith in 2017, they wouldn't be the power they are now

 

[Epic Brownie]

You only go aggressive if you want a player that you feel is magnitudes better than the number of players from your pick or if you feel you're one player away from the Superbowl.

 

[Consigliere]

Yes, because this FO is still under the delusion that they can win now....

Delusion or self-preservation? If the front office trades players and picks for future picks, we'd lose more games in 2023 and they'd be fired.

Trading up is very selfish for the individuals currently in power. They want good players now because they don't want to get fired now.

If you are Bill Belichick then you can afford (and benefit from) the investment of trading back.

So, sure, we could be very aggressive in the 2023 draft. Indeed, it seems likely.