Sean Payton Without Gregg Williams (1 Viewer)

[SaintsMan209]

Just wondering, do you think he'll ever win a Super Bowl? I'm going to say NO.

 

[nakadish]

Just wondering, do you think he'll ever win a Super Bowl? I'm going to say NO.

I've wondered the same thing. But, I think if he couldn't do it with one of the best to ever play the game, he's not doing with anyone else. I think the reason that it worked with Gregg Williams is because GW didn't really listen to Sean on how to run the defense.

 

[SigFreudianSlip]

It will have to be dominant, as Roger and the refs do not like Sean, at all.

 

[rsmith2783]

In a way it reminds you of the Ditka & Ryan Duo.

 

[Xeno]

SSF now:

 

[2024InjuryApocalypse]

In a way it reminds you of the Ditka & Ryan Duo.

I don't buy this analogy. Ryan's defense was by far the dominant unit on that 85 team. The offense was the dominant unit on Payton/Brees' teams. Yes, our '09 defense helped by forcing a lot of turnovers, but I'd rate Payton higher than Ditka. It took one of the worst blown calls in the history of sports to keep Payton out of his 2nd Super Bowl.

 

[BayouSAINTJoe]

I'd say the inmate who shall not be named had more of an effect on the D than Williams that season...without him we don't win the Miami game and we would've had to go on the road against Minn in the NFCCG and who knows

 

[GeauxSainz]

Isn't Ryan also the reason we blew that 9ers game in 2011?







I don't think we win 09 w/o his defense, but probably could have won 11 without his ego.

 

[Joshwa]

I don't buy this analogy. Ryan's defense was by far the dominant unit on that 85 team. The offense was the dominant unit on Payton/Brees' teams. Yes, our '09 defense helped by forcing a lot of turnovers, but I'd rate Payton higher than Ditka. It took one of the worst blown calls in the history of sports to keep Payton out of his 2nd Super Bowl.

85 Bears had like a top two offense that year. It was definitely a culmination of both sides. Spectacular games.

 

[Rouxble]

I don't buy this analogy. Ryan's defense was by far the dominant unit on that 85 team. The offense was the dominant unit on Payton/Brees' teams. Yes, our '09 defense helped by forcing a lot of turnovers, but I'd rate Payton higher than Ditka. It took one of the worst blown calls in the history of sports to keep Payton out of his 2nd Super Bowl.

I agree, offense and turnovers were the key in 09, it’s not like we had a shutdown defense. We were 20th in points allowed and 25th in yards allowed our SB year.

We were 1st in points and yards on offense, and 3rd in turnover ratio.

 

[rsmith2783]

Isn't Ryan also the reason we blew that 9ers game in 2011?







I don't think we win 09 w/o his defense, but probably could have won 11 without his ego.

GW. I fault him because he didn't properly adjust to cover Vernon Davis, which was the only guy who burned us in that game. If I remember correctly, he had Harper and Shanle on Davis, which is an easy win for the offense.

 

[2024InjuryApocalypse]

85 Bears had like a top two offense that year. It was definitely a culmination of both sides. Spectacular games.

Their offense was 7th in yards, which is better than I expected, but...as noted above, the Saints' defense in 09 was bottom half in yards allowed and points allowed. So it's still fair to say the offense was the dominant unit for Payton and think the Buddy Ryan is a bit unfair to Payton. The Bears were 1st in points and yards on defense in 85 just as the Saints were first in points and yards on offense in 09.

Payton had his flaws as a coach, but the issues in our later years were a combination of injuries at the wrong time (our defensive front 7 in 2017 was decimated by injuries to the point we had three guys we'd signed as free agents late in the regular season getting significant playing time in the playoffs, Dez & Rankins & Watson & Josh Hill & the o-line playing seriously hurt in 18, Latavius and Taysom getting hurt in the Bears' game in 2020) and Brees being hindered by age and injuries (Brees was still a quality QB, but 2017-2020 Brees was not 2008-2011 Brees).

 

[rsmith2783]

I don't buy this analogy. Ryan's defense was by far the dominant unit on that 85 team. The offense was the dominant unit on Payton/Brees' teams. Yes, our '09 defense helped by forcing a lot of turnovers, but I'd rate Payton higher than Ditka. It took one of the worst blown calls in the history of sports to keep Payton out of his 2nd Super Bowl.

You're right, the call did keep us out of the 2nd Super Bowl but I brought it up because Ditka mentioned that he and Buddy probably could have accomplished more together than they did when they were apart. Looking at some of our playoff losses, some of them falls on the shoulders of the defense.

 

[RebSaint]

Forum needs moar Payton threads!!!

 

[bigdaddysaints]

Well, GW was part of why we won the Superbowl, but he was also the reason we didn't win it again in 2011.