Baldy thinks Cesar Ruiz’s best position is Center (1 Viewer)

[El Caliente]

Malcolm Jenkins was a college CB, turned him into an all-pro safety.

They drafted Jahri Evans who was a T in college and moved him to G where he became an all pro/future HOF

They drafted Carl Nicks, a college T and moved him to G and he became a probowl G.

They drafted Kaden Ellis a DE and moved him to LB. He got a 2nd contract as a LB.


If you're going to speak on it, speak on the hits too. There simply aren't many 6'2 235 LB successful edge rushers in the league. His agility measurements and size fit a more traditional LB type, that you hoped you could get some Kaden Ellis like production as a blitzer. He didn't have enough a$$ and mass to be an every down edge guy, let alone explosiveness with an under 10ft Broad jump and a 32.5 inch vert which seems like a lot, until you realize there are guys 30lbs heavier making those same jumps.

Wait, Jenkins wasn’t JENKINS until he was a few years in with the Eagles.

Ellis is with the Falcons now because the Saints couldn’t figure out how to use him until it was too late.

Sucks to suck, and outside of Evans and Nicks, we suck at moving players to new positons.

 

[SweetT]

Malcolm Jenkins was a college CB, turned him into an all-pro safety.

They drafted Jahri Evans who was a T in college and moved him to G where he became an all pro/future HOF

They drafted Carl Nicks, a college T and moved him to G and he became a probowl G.

They drafted Kaden Ellis a DE and moved him to LB. He got a 2nd contract as a LB.


If you're going to speak on it, speak on the hits too. There simply aren't many 6'2 235 LB successful edge rushers in the league. His agility measurements and size fit a more traditional LB type, that you hoped you could get some Kaden Ellis like production as a blitzer. He didn't have enough a$$ and mass to be an every down edge guy, let alone explosiveness with an under 10ft Broad jump and a 32.5 inch vert which seems like a lot, until you realize there are guys 30lbs heavier making those same jumps.

Despite Jenkins being an All Pro in 2010, I still don’t think he played that well for us at the safety position. He did an admirable job, but he really got a hang of the position in Philly. I will say that changing his position, did extend his career, and get the most out of it. Which led to him doing the same for us when he came back. Just my $.02

Your point remains tho.

 

[60minutes]

Listened to him on nofootball podcast and he gave his thoughts on a few players, mostly oline.

Fuaga - Thinks he has more power than Alt, as much power as Latham and very good balance. Doesn’t think his arm length will be a problem because he’s got good feet, and he’s not a two-hand puncher. Doesn’t know that he can’t play LT.

Penning - Thinks the scheme will hide some of his deficiencies, but 3rd and long is 3rd and long, there’s no PA for that and he has to prove he can stay in front of his guy and the QB. Has to be able to drop an anchor. Hasn’t been good, hasn’t been consistent.

Erik McCoy - other than one year he’s been available

Cesar Ruiz - Biased, he works out with him. Thinks he’s smart, best position is center. Had opportunity to play it when McCoy went down but is plenty athletic enough to fit zone scheme.
What I’m curious about is should the new OL coaches be looking at guys as set at certain positions.

Fuaga, McCoy, Ruiz, Saldiveri, Penning may be the best combo overall for OL. The unit as a whole and how it pans out will be one of the more interesting storylines to follow.

I completely agree with Baldy. I saw it up close.

 

[ELLIASJWILLIAMS]

Wait, Jenkins wasn’t JENKINS until he was a few years in with the Eagles.

Ellis is with the Falcons now because the Saints couldn’t figure out how to use him until it was too late.

Sucks to suck, and outside of Evans and Nicks, we suck at moving players to new positons.

You believe that don't you lol.

No matter if Jenkins became good afer he left or before...he still didn't finish his career as a CB

Ellis is still continuing his career as a LB, not the position he came out of college playing.

Cmon man, you just arguing to argue at this point. I digress.

 

[Hedon James]

Wouldn't call it a "Saints thing" more than, Peat wasn't going to unseat Terron Armstead so they asked him to play RT. He couldn't play there so they asked him to play RG once they moved on from Jahri. He couldn't play there either so they asked him to play LG.

Now arguably, had they moved Peat to LT in 2023 folliwing Armstead's departure vs reaching for Penning, perhaps we'd have been in a better position but acting like the Saints changed Peat's position just for the sake of it is remembering history incorrectly.

yep...what EJW said ^. And as far as Ruiz, it was reported that they took Ruiz with intent to move McCoy to G. Then covid happened, which limited in-person OTAs and classroom time....very limited face-to-face and hands-on interaction, it was "all classroom"; which stunted Ruiz's development and Saints plans. So they stashed him at G and crossed their fingers. Even hired Jahri Evans to work with the dude to help him transition from C to G. I don't think they moved Ruiz cuz they WANTED to, but cuz they HAD to.

But considering that we're looking at 3/5 new OL next season, AND a change in scheme, AND new OL coaches, I absolutely hope they look into flipping McCoy and Ruiz. I feel that Ruiz is probably as good a C as McCoy, but McCoy is probably a better G than Ruiz. If I'm right, that's a net gain by flipping their positions. I'm not saying it SHOULD happen....just that I hope it's being considered, under the current circumstances. And I won't question anything if that actually happens!

 

[El Caliente]

You believe that don't you lol.

No matter if Jenkins became good afer he left or before...he still didn't finish his career as a CB

Ellis is still continuing his career as a LB, not the position he came out of college playing.

Cmon man, you just arguing to argue at this point. I digress.

I don’t believe that. I cited the failed experiments, there is nothing to argue here.

 

[Scorpius the Allfather]

Ruiz was a center at Michigan. He was the top center prospect in his draft.

The Saints did a Saints thing and moved him to guard.

This is similar to what they did with Andrus Peat who was a standout left tackle in his draft, but we put him at guard because of reasons.

That reason was that we had Terron Armstead. In what universe does Peat start over Terron?

 

[ELLIASJWILLIAMS]

I don’t believe that. I cited the failed experiments, there is nothing to argue here.

And I cited the successful experiments. Eats a grape and pets kitten

 

[El Caliente]

And I cited the successful experiments. Eats a grape and pets kitten

It seems that we will need to agree to disagree.

 

[El Caliente]

That reason was that we had Terron Armstead. In what universe does Peat start over Terron?

In what world do you spend a top 15 1st rd draft pick on a player (who is known to dominate a position that you already have an all pro talent at) to move him to a position that he isn’t known to dominate at?

This wasn’t some Mahomes/Brees situation where one guy is at the end of his career so you need to find his replacement. This was a foolish move then just as it looks like a foolish move all these years later.

 

[Scorpius the Allfather]

In what world do spend a top 15 1st rd draft pick on a player (who is known to dominate a position that you already have an all pro talent at) to move him to a position that he isn’t known to dominate at?

This wasn’t some Mahomes/Brees situation where one guy is at the end of his career so you need to find his replacement. This was a foolish move then just as it looks like a foolish move all these years later.

It's normal to put a player that played tackle in college in at guard in the NFL. And it wasn't foolish because we needed a guard and last time I checked, he made multiple pro bowls at guard. And there was a zero percent chance he starts over Terron. What are you even complaining about?

 

[El Caliente]

It's normal to put a player that played tackle in college in at guard in the NFL. And it wasn't foolish because we needed a guard and last time I checked, he made multiple pro bowls at guard. And there was a zero percent chance he starts over Terron. What are you even complaining about?

We are talking about drafting players that played one position in college and forcing them into a position that they didn’t play before arriving in New Orleans.

it’s like putting a crypto currency in place of fixed income in your retirement portfolio, and expecting consistent returns from it. It doesn’t seem like the best idea at the time, and it isn’t proven yet, but hey, why not give it a try.

Side note, I think it’s awesome how now we are all giving Peat his flowers when while he was here we were killing him for not being better, and getting Brees killed (specifically in those years when he was making those Pro Bowls).

 

[joe87]

It's normal to put a player that played tackle in college in at guard in the NFL. And it wasn't foolish because we needed a guard and last time I checked, he made multiple pro bowls at guard. And there was a zero percent chance he starts over Terron. What are you even complaining about?

From what I remember, Peat competed (and lost) against Strief at RT in his rookie training camp. Even so, guard’s are a low value position in the league and not worth picking in the top 15, unless they’re a sure thing, All-Pro type of player. Plenty of the leagues top OG’s have been picked in the mid rounds.

 

[St. Geezy]

It‘a funny to me how Brian Baldinger, who has no ties to the Saints franchise from his playing days and has no clear ties to the New Orleans area whatsoever, is one of the biggest Saints fanboys in the media today.

That dude absolutely loves him some Saints football, for quite some time now.

 

[ELLIASJWILLIAMS]

It seems that we will need to agree to disagree.

I don’t disagree with you, there are failed position changes and successful position changes.

All I disagree on is selective outrage and pretending like those moves are dumb or stupid when it’s done for highly logical reasoning.

If a player is at Edge and is:

15th percentile in weight
40th percentile in 40 time
50th percentile in Vert
78th percentile in agility
40th percentile in arm length

But you move him to LB and he’s now

78th percentile in weight
65th percentile in 40 time
70th percentile in vert
90th percentile in agility
70th percentile in arm length.

You now have a better prospect and that prospect has a better chance at making it in the league. The decision is neither dumb or stupid.

Now if you want to say moving Peat to RT or drafting him to play RT when he came out of college as a LT was the wrong decision, well that’s arguable.

However, making it seem like all the saints position switches have failed and not acknowledging the ones that didn’t because they don’t support your original argument is ridiculous. Furthermore resulting to describing them as dumb or stupid because you fail to accept the reasoning behind it is worthy of me counter arguing you into oblivion