Catholic Church Scandal! (2 Viewers)

[Booker]

When you see it's hundreds upon hundreds upon hundreds upon hundres, I mean, just what is it the commonality that is responsible for that? That's what I don't get.

This right here. It's an international pedophile ring that's been operating in plain sight for generation upon generation.

 

[Optimus Prime]

Low hanging fruit parallel, but, Nazi Germany did a number of good things. If someone calls themselves a Nazi, do you accept that they are only a Nazi for the good things?

I think a more accurate parallel would be assuming that every German living in Germany in the 30s-40s was either a Nazi or Nazi supporter

 

[SystemShock]

But can't you profess the Apostle's Creed somewhere else or on your own? Why does it have to be in association with an organization that aids and abets sexual predators of children? Is it that you believe your salvation can only come from you being Catholic? Do you think an organization that aids and abets sexual predators is empowered to speak for Jesus?

Low hanging fruit parallel, but, Nazi Germany did a number of good things. If someone calls themselves a Nazi, do you accept that they are only a Nazi for the good things?

I'm going to quote myself, since I found this image.... not so low hanging fruit after all.

 

[DCSaints_Fan]

I really don't get why people keep supporting the Catholic church. What keeps them there

Eternal salvation

 

[Saint Jack]

I really don't get why people keep supporting the Catholic church. What keeps them there?

Force of habit. Learn the religion as kids and just go through the motions as adults.
But I’ve noticed more and more of my friends leave Catholicism and become irreligious.

 

[zeetes]

Force of habit.

iswydt

 

[Waymer]

I just wonder what drives a person to continue to be associated with an organization that aids and abets sexual predators of children; that's not their only crime, but I think that should be enough for a person with any sense of morality to denounce them and cut ties with them.

By the response, I take it you are Catholic. What makes you continue supporting them?

(Disclosure: I am not Catholic.)

I simply think it's human nature. It takes A LOT for most people to disassociate from what they believe to have seen with their own eyes to be good or to bring them great joy and/or comfort. That gets to a personal level too. There's plenty of people that (understandably based on what we know about human brains) think their family member could never have murdered, raped, robbed, etc. We don't want to believe the bad about people/things that we've come to love and find comfort in. We've shared moments with these people. We've seen good in them many times. It's natural to think all the positive we've seen either outweighs the bad, or means the bad can't possibly be true.

I would venture that many/most people in any church find similar comfort. From the people they associate with if nothing else. "Breaking bread" with people is often a way to find peace. To steal a phrase from the late Anthony Bourdain, you learn a lot about people when you share a meal. Church is, in many ways, a literal and (trans)figurative meal for people. They find those they love, they learn about good deeds and morals, etc. Not much church is fire and brimstone these days. There's not, IMHO, much "fear of God" being preached, so much as a reminder of the good deeds/acts/laws/etc. So people see and feel the goodness being preached.

So I don't personally find it that odd that people associate with the church they love and know. They haven't seen the bad with their own two eyes in most cases. Their priest most likely hasn't been accused of anything. I think those that HAVE seen it, or were abused, etc are almost assuredly no longer associating with the church.

I'll put it in terms of the Saints. The Saints allegedly had a drug/Vicodin problem, which was allegedly covered up by Mickey Loomis and higher ups. They allegedly had some form of a bounty program. They had Darren Sharper in the building. The teams of the 80s had players with well-known cocaine problems. They've had stars arrested for violent crimes (Kamara), domestic violence (Will Smith), DUIs (numerous), etc. No, it's not exactly the same because it's not necessarily "institutional" and the Saints aren't a religion, but at the end of the day here we all are, supporting them because we love the team and that team makes us feel good (well, some days at least).

 

[SystemShock]

I'll put it in terms of the Saints. The Saints allegedly had a drug/Vicodin problem, which was allegedly covered up by Mickey Loomis and higher ups. They allegedly had some form of a bounty program. They had Darren Sharper in the building. The teams of the 80s had players with well-known cocaine problems. They've had stars arrested for violent crimes (Kamara), domestic violence (Will Smith), DUIs (numerous), etc. No, it's not exactly the same because it's not necessarily "institutional" and the Saints aren't a religion, but at the end of the day here we all are, supporting them because we love the team and that team makes us feel good (well, some days at least).

That's the thing, all of those cases you mention, they are not institutional. And having personal cocaine problems, alcohol problems, that's not the same as aiding and abetting child rapists.

And the Saints don't claim to be any sort of moral authority.

But even at such a low standard, had the Saints traded for DeShaun Watson, I would not be watching the games, or cheering for them.

 

[Waymer]

That's the thing, all of those cases you mention, they are not institutional. And having personal cocaine problems, alcohol problems, that's not the same as aiding and abetting child rapists.

And the Saints don't claim to be any sort of moral authority.

But even at such a low standard, had the Saints traded for DeShaun Watson, I would not be watching the games, or cheering for them.

I can completely understand that. I myself still would, for better or worse, assuming the overall team still brought me joy after such a move.

Every team aids and abets to some degree. If not, guys like Kamara and Will Smith and so many more wouldn't have stayed Saints after their issues. There's a personal line for everyone as you alluded to, and I absolutely agree. Heck, there's a line for every team and the NFL in general. But not everyone's line is the same at the end of the day when that line directly impacts them. That's just reality. I'm not saying it's right, just that it is.

The way I see it, this life is finite enough, whether you believe in something more or not (another discussion obviously). So if something brings me joy and is something I can share with my family and friend (more joy), I'll likely keep doing it even if there are some unsavory aspects that I have to acknowledge. I think the same is true for the vast majority of people.

And yes, again, it's easy to say so in this example because my belief in a football team is not a fundamental belief in the meaning of life, existence, a god, etc. But then again, that's probably why it's harder to let go of a religion than a football team for some people. At the end of the day people do things because it makes them feel good, whether that goodness is the hope of a Super Bowl or the hope of everlasting life.

 

[Optimus Prime]

The Roman Catholic archdiocese of Los Angeleshas agreed to pay $880m to 1,353 people who alleged that they were sexually abused as children by Catholic priests, in the largest settlement by a US diocese over decades-old abuse claims.

Archbishop Jose H Gomez expressed sorrow for the abuse in announcing the settlement on Wednesday.

“I am sorry for every one of these incidents, from the bottom of my heart,” Gomez said in a statement. “My hope is that this settlement will provide some measure of healing for what these men and women have suffered.”


The archdiocese began mediating the abuse claims after California enacted a law that allowed new lawsuits to be based on past instances of sexual abuse involving minors.

The California law and similar laws in other states have driven many large Catholic organizations to seek bankruptcy protection around the US.

In California, the archdiocese of San Francisco and the dioceses of Oakland and San Diego have filed for bankruptcy to resolve similar abuse claims.

The Los Angeles archdiocese reached its settlement without filing for bankruptcy. Gomez said the archdiocese would be able to pay victims from cash reserves, investments, loans and contributions from other religious organizations that had been named in lawsuits.

The payments will not impact the archdiocese’s mission of “serving the poor and vulnerable in our communities”, Gomez said……..

Los Angeles Catholic archdiocese to pay $880m in child sex abuse settlement

Archbishop expresses sorrow in announcement to pay 1,353 people who alleged they were abused as children by priests

www.theguardian.com

 

[Optimus Prime]

An outside expert brought in to help resolve the Roman Catholic archdiocese of New Orleans’s expensive, highly contentious bankruptcy protection case has suggested deferring pay to all professionals involved in the matter for three months.

The move is to see if that prompts the church and clergy abuse victims to compromise on conflicting settlement proposals which are hundreds of millions of dollars apart.

If the two sides fail to reach an agreement during that period, the bankruptcy restructuring professional Mohsin “Mo” Meghji has advised the judge in charge of the case to have a special examiner investigate all of the archdiocese’s assets – including cash and real estate – and whether the church filed for chapter 11 protection “in good faith”.


Costs in the bankruptcy have soared above $40m, well over the $7.5m that the archdiocese initially estimated it would take to resolve the case shortly before filing it in 2020.

It was not immediately clear whether the US bankruptcy court judge, Meredith Grabill, would adopt Meghji’s advice, contained in a 35-page report released late on Wednesday. Grabill paid $350,000 from the archdiocese’s estate for Meghji, his M3 Partners and their frequent collaborators at the Latham & Watkins law firm to produce it.

Grabill appointed Meghji, who is based in New York City, on 21 August to assess the viability of two competing church restructuring plans drafted by the archdiocese as well as those to whom it is indebted, among them hundreds of victims of sexually abusive archdiocesan clergymen and other personnel.

Church bankruptcy attorneys are proposing to settle the case by paying about $125,000 – none from insurers – to each of more than 500 people claiming to have survived clergy abuse. In turn, the clergy abuse claimants are demanding about $2m each, the bulk of which would come from the church’s insurers.…….

Expert issues report on how to settle highly contentious New Orleans church bankruptcy case

Mohsin ‘Mo’ Meghji was paid $350,000 to advise on conflicting settlement proposals from the church and clergy abuse victims

www.theguardian.com

 

[bclemms]

Eternal salvation

 

[Sailorsaint]

An outside expert brought in to help resolve the Roman Catholic archdiocese of New Orleans’s expensive, highly contentious bankruptcy protection case has suggested deferring pay to all professionals involved in the matter for three months.

The move is to see if that prompts the church and clergy abuse victims to compromise on conflicting settlement proposals which are hundreds of millions of dollars apart.

If the two sides fail to reach an agreement during that period, the bankruptcy restructuring professional Mohsin “Mo” Meghji has advised the judge in charge of the case to have a special examiner investigate all of the archdiocese’s assets – including cash and real estate – and whether the church filed for chapter 11 protection “in good faith”.


Costs in the bankruptcy have soared above $40m, well over the $7.5m that the archdiocese initially estimated it would take to resolve the case shortly before filing it in 2020.

It was not immediately clear whether the US bankruptcy court judge, Meredith Grabill, would adopt Meghji’s advice, contained in a 35-page report released late on Wednesday. Grabill paid $350,000 from the archdiocese’s estate for Meghji, his M3 Partners and their frequent collaborators at the Latham & Watkins law firm to produce it.

Grabill appointed Meghji, who is based in New York City, on 21 August to assess the viability of two competing church restructuring plans drafted by the archdiocese as well as those to whom it is indebted, among them hundreds of victims of sexually abusive archdiocesan clergymen and other personnel.

Church bankruptcy attorneys are proposing to settle the case by paying about $125,000 – none from insurers – to each of more than 500 people claiming to have survived clergy abuse. In turn, the clergy abuse claimants are demanding about $2m each, the bulk of which would come from the church’s insurers.…….

Expert issues report on how to settle highly contentious New Orleans church bankruptcy case

Mohsin ‘Mo’ Meghji was paid $350,000 to advise on conflicting settlement proposals from the church and clergy abuse victims

www.theguardian.com

There’s something ironic about investigating whether the church filed “in good faith”.

 

[SystemShock]

There’s something ironic about investigating whether the church filed “in good faith”.

"What would Jesus do?"
Lawyer up, apparently.

 

[Consigliere]

"What would Jesus do?"
Lawyer up, apparently.

But see Luke 11:52.