Do we have the personnel for a Shanahan/McVay offense? (2 Viewers)

[saintmike23]

Apparently, that’s the direction we’re going in like it or not. If you wanted more motion we’re certainly getting more motion. I was at the Saints vs Rams game and all that motion was so annoying. Just run the damn play already!

But I have to admit that this style of offense puts a lot of tension on defenses.

We have the wide receivers. Maybe we can add one or two into the mix, but even Bowden performed better at the end.

“Do we have the offensive line ?” is the big question. We can draft a tackle easily in the first round. In this offense I like Taliese Fuaga out of Oregon state. He looks fluid and agile.

We honestly need 2 tackles and if there’s any draft to get 2 this is the one. Except, we never trade down.

I don’t like Andrus Peat in this offense at guard especially and even tackle. He’s a power run lineman for the most part and I can’t imagine him pulling consistently.

Penning, I have given up on but others have not. If he can get his head together he does fit this scheme. I’m just not counting on it.

From what I’ve seen of Saldiveri’s college tape, I like him at guard or tackle in this scheme.

So if we add two tackles and a guard I will feel better about our line. (Not necessarily in the draft)

Oh yeah, Ramczyk is way too toast to play this scheme if he can play at all.

As for tight ends, we need more versatile players who can block, and get open. Juwan Johnson is more of a downfield threat and doesn’t offer much in terms of blocking.

Taysom is an okay blocker and a real threat on any pass play.

Moreau is mostly a good blocking tight end who can be a sneaky option on PA.

So I would expect us to draft a TE in the later rounds. Someone like AJ Barner from Michigan, Ben Sinnott Kansas, Tanner McLachlan Arizona. All bigger dual threat guys. If Bowers falls to us then it’s a huge win but we might have to trade up for a tackle like Morgan from AZ.

I think Shaheed and Olave will be even better in this offense. And we should draft another RB if we want to have more explosive run plays.

 

[saintmike23]

Shanahan scheme evolution

 

[BelowZero]

I think Carr can match Stafford, at the very least. Though, in the right system, I think he might be better than Stafford. This might just be that system.

I think we're fine at WR. Perry feels very Puka-ish. Not quite as well-rounded, but with some experience and the confidence Carr seemed to have in him late in the season, he might very well be something. That being said, I'm taking Olave and Shaheed in a Shanahan/McVay system every time over Cooper/Puka. Better route running, better speed, better deep ability, etc. Think we're just slightly better all-around at WR. A shifty receiving back like Achane wouldn't hurt, either.

Tight end is a very quiet need, imo. Possibly more so than OL. JJ just doesn't feel like he's growing the way we expected him to, though part of that may very well be coaching, and Moreau is what he is at this point in his career. Average TE with above average blocking ability. Just feels super average at the position with no real threat of breaking something. Do still agree that OL is the biggest question mark moving into this system. I could very much see us possibly drafting a tackle, and then trading for another one after. Possibly someone that needs a change of scenery that won't break the bank. I could also see a reality where they go all-in on O-Line. Trades, FA, etc. I imagine it'll be somewhere in between over multiple seasons.

I think this is very much the right direction at the end of the day, and we already have the more important bits already in place.

 

[Stalwart385]

Tackle is tough for me to judge. I'll have to leave that to the organization. My first two questions would be how is Penning mentally and what is going on with Ramczyk's future? I can't answer those well enough myself.

Certainly not opposed to drafting one.

 

[Rouxble]

At OL, we need help regardless of scheme, but I would think a solid run blocking LT would be crucial. They need to drive out the EMOL in the mid zone runs to keep that scheme effective. We will need two tackles if Ram decides to retire, and we have an opening at LG that needs to be filled.

At WR, we need players that are willing and able to block, that’s an underrated part of those offenses. For example, the Rams have three of the top ten run blocking receivers according to PFF. Both Kupp and Nacua are in that top ten, it’s not just their receiving ability that makes that offense go. That goes into the “find players that love football” mindset for picking receivers, players that just love getting the ball don’t usually have an appetite for going after a box defender.

At TE, I think we can manage, probably need one more to go with Moreau unless Johnson settles into a more traditional TE role. Out of the Rams, Bengals, and Seahawks, none of those offenses have a TE that is in the top 20 for targets. The 49ers make use of Kittle’s receiving ability, but they also tend towards heavier personnel groupings than the Rams/Bengals/Seahawks.

At RB, both Kamara and Miller should be effective in a zone scheme. Williams probably sticks around due to his contract, but he wouldn’t be your first or second option.

Overall, we need OL help more than anything, but that would be true regardless of scheme. We may need to find new talent at receiver as well, it will be harder to get those explosive plays if our guys aren’t willing/able to go after a safety or linebacker. We should be good at TE and RB.

 

[Snakehead]

At OL, we need help regardless of scheme, but I would think a solid run blocking LT would be crucial. They need to drive out the EMOL in the mid zone runs to keep that scheme effective. We will need two tackles if Ram decides to retire, and we have an opening at LG that needs to be filled.

At WR, we need players that are willing and able to block, that’s an underrated part of those offenses. For example, the Rams have three of the top ten run blocking receivers according to PFF. Both Kupp and Nacua are in that top ten, it’s not just their receiving ability that makes that offense go. That goes into the “find players that love football” mindset for picking receivers, players that just love getting the ball don’t usually have an appetite for going after a box defender.

At TE, I think we can manage, probably need one more to go with Moreau unless Johnson settles into a more traditional TE role. Out of the Rams, Bengals, and Seahawks, none of those offenses have a TE that is in the top 20 for targets. The 49ers make use of Kittle’s receiving ability, but they also tend towards heavier personnel groupings than the Rams/Bengals/Seahawks.

At RB, both Kamara and Miller should be effective in a zone scheme. Williams probably sticks around due to his contract, but he wouldn’t be your first or second option.

Overall, we need OL help more than anything, but that would be true regardless of scheme. We may need to find new talent at receiver as well, it will be harder to get those explosive plays if our guys aren’t willing/able to go after a safety or linebacker. We should be good at TE and RB.

I'd be curious where the Hudson for the Bengals ranked in targets once he emerged as their TE1.

 

[BBarnes]

If motion is frustrating for you in the stands, that makes even more of an understanding of why the numbers support it and why the best offensive minds use it. It’s frustrating for the defense and allows the offense to get more info on the defense


Whether we want to admit it or not or Loomis can see it or not, this will be somewhat of a down year. I hope we focus on rebuilding in the trenches and setting up our future coach and QB for long term success

 

[TribuneUK]

If motion is frustrating for you in the stands, that makes even more of an understanding of why the numbers support it and why the best offensive minds use it. It’s frustrating for the defense and allows the offense to get more info on the defense

Motioning can totally ruin a cover 4 shell as well. I used to really dislike trying to coach in the adjustments for that with trips to the secondary and LBs, although with nickel/dime substitutions at the pro level, maybe it's not so bad.

 

[Trey W.]

IMO, from what I saw of Carr this season he seems to do a lot better with up tempo and knowing where the WR’s are going to be. When the WR’s had option routes based off of coverage and the routes were long and drawn out is when he seemed to be less confident and make more mistakes. That could work itself out with another off-season.

I don’t know much about the Shanahan/McVay offenses to know if they’re option route heavy or more old school west coast precise route based. They do seem to have a lot of outlet and underneath routes which create separation for the WR’s which I like. Players like Olave and Shaheed can feast on those routes with their speed and elusiveness.

I just know our offense, especially early in the season was boring and vanilla like preseason. It will be nice to see some energy and excitement back in our players. Hopefully which ever OC we do get knows how to scheme for the talent he has an not just the talent he wants.

 

[No2DC]

I'm still skeptical that this will be a true outside hire. Remember, they brought in outsiders that supposed OC search last time.

 

[Rouxble]

I'd be curious where the Hudson for the Bengals ranked in targets once he emerged as their TE1.

From week nine on, he was ranked 15th in targets, 20th in targets per game (adjusts for not everyone playing the same amount of games down the stretch due to bye weeks and/or resting starters).

 

[bclemms]

The motion does well to create separation and confusion. If the motion causes the defense to bust a coverage once a game it results in a huge play. What seems to really stress teams inside these concepts is speed from three positions. You need two WR's with deep speed and a RB that can run. Speed plus space equals points. I think we have that with Olave, Shaheed and Miller. From an offensive design, every motion, every route and every movement has a purpose and that purpose is to stretch and bend defenses on the field while slowing defenders down a fraction of a second by adding additional thought processes.

No matter what offense you run, it still comes down to the offensive line and QB. If the line can't block and the QB can't run the offense as intended then everything else is window dressing.

 

[boutte]

Do we have the personnel to run (fill in the blank)? We need to rebuild the O line anyway, might as well build it how we want it.

 

[meily]

We have the speed on the outside for the play action deep passing game and the speed in the backfield for the zone running scheme with Kamara and Miller.

 

[BoNcHiE]

Yes