Do we have the personnel for a Shanahan/McVay offense? (1 Viewer)

[stadanko]

I know we're good at WR, but I could see us grabbing Renfrow since he's a FA now. Carr wanted him all year and he's a poor man's Cooper Kupp, which fits the McVay offense. I'd hate to see Shaheed or Perry get less snaps because of it, but I wouldn't be shocked to see it.

 

[RJS]

Pretty good read from Albert Breer from last offseason on the evolution of the Rams offense.

https://www.si.com/nfl/2023/08/29/sean-mcvay-and-the-rams-are-evolving-to-stay-ahead

 

[SaintswonSBXLIV]

Apparently, that’s the direction we’re going in like it or not. If you wanted more motion we’re certainly getting more motion. I was at the Saints vs Rams game and all that motion was so annoying. Just run the damn play already!

But I have to admit that this style of offense puts a lot of tension on defenses.

We have the wide receivers. Maybe we can add one or two into the mix, but even Bowden performed better at the end.

“Do we have the offensive line ?” is the big question. We can draft a tackle easily in the first round. In this offense I like Taliese Fuaga out of Oregon state. He looks fluid and agile.

We honestly need 2 tackles and if there’s any draft to get 2 this is the one. Except, we never trade down.

I don’t like Andrus Peat in this offense at guard especially and even tackle. He’s a power run lineman for the most part and I can’t imagine him pulling consistently.

Penning, I have given up on but others have not. If he can get his head together he does fit this scheme. I’m just not counting on it.

From what I’ve seen of Saldiveri’s college tape, I like him at guard or tackle in this scheme.

So if we add two tackles and a guard I will feel better about our line. (Not necessarily in the draft)

Oh yeah, Ramczyk is way too toast to play this scheme if he can play at all.

As for tight ends, we need more versatile players who can block, and get open. Juwan Johnson is more of a downfield threat and doesn’t offer much in terms of blocking.

Taysom is an okay blocker and a real threat on any pass play.

Moreau is mostly a good blocking tight end who can be a sneaky option on PA.

So I would expect us to draft a TE in the later rounds. Someone like AJ Barner from Michigan, Ben Sinnott Kansas, Tanner McLachlan Arizona. All bigger dual threat guys. If Bowers falls to us then it’s a huge win but we might have to trade up for a tackle like Morgan from AZ.

I think Shaheed and Olave will be even better in this offense. And we should draft another RB if we want to have more explosive run plays.

Yes, except for a slot receiver. My guess is the Saints sign Hunter Renfrow this offseason.

 

[St. Widge]

The motion does well to create separation and confusion. If the motion causes the defense to bust a coverage once a game it results in a huge play. What seems to really stress teams inside these concepts is speed from three positions. You need two WR's with deep speed and a RB that can run. Speed plus space equals points. I think we have that with Olave, Shaheed and Miller. From an offensive design, every motion, every route and every movement has a purpose and that purpose is to stretch and bend defenses on the field while slowing defenders down a fraction of a second by adding additional thought processes.

No matter what offense you run, it still comes down to the offensive line and QB. If the line can't block and the QB can't run the offense as intended then everything else is window dressing.

All very true. But some schemes, like the Shanahan/McVay scheme help out the OL and QB by creating space with motion and misdirection both for receivers to run short or outlet routes and for the run game. Keeping the other teams front 7 guessing makes them less aggressive to the ball and really helps out the OL and QB. Things like motion and runs off of motion really help keep the other front seven more passive because if they get too aggressive they get killed with the misdirection off of the motion. It's apparently part of the reason colleges are not developing as many good offensive lineman as they once did. The spread and motions schemes that are so prominent in college means that the the linemen don't have to really learn to hold blocks as long as traditional offenses require and they aren't having to deal with the pressure that traditional offenses get in the NFL.

I have some hope that a switch to a scheme like this might help Penning finally be able to get on the field whether it's at Guard or Tackle. Although he seems to be better in man blocking than in zone blocking as I think the McVay system tends to use a lot of zone runs.

It's also the reason a lot of NFL teams are having the DL play less aggressive because they know they don't have time to get to the QB so they are sitting back waiting to try to bat balls at the line or contain running QBs. It's part of why Cam Jordan wasn't getting much pressure early in the season.

 

[St. Widge]

Yes, except for a slot receiver. My guess is the Saints sign Hunter Renfrow this offseason.

Singing Renfrow this offseason really seems like a no brainer that will be done quickly. We need slot WR, he's a good one who knows and likes Carr. And he's not going to require a huge contract and will give us good depth at WR.

 

[Rouxble]

Yes, except for a slot receiver. My guess is the Saints sign Hunter Renfrow this offseason.

If we’re going with former Raiders, Mack Hollins would be a better fit for a McVay system. Good size, decent blocker, should also be cheap.

 

[St. Widge]

If we’re going with former Raiders, Mack Hollins would be a better fit for a McVay system. Good size, decent blocker, should also be cheap.

Yeah, but apparently Carr and Renfro are BFFs and there were apparently talks about trading for Renfro before the deadline this year that just didn't work out.

 

[Bozzhawg318]

I'm usually a skill position champion but this year I'm all in on beefing up the trenches ( gross) this year and then let the new coach pick his qb in the following draft. That way our veggies will be consumed with DA and Carr and the new HC will get to draft the meat and potatoes

 

[St. Geezy]

I think too much gets made of this. Any good coach caters his offense to what his personnel is, regardless of scheme.

Obviously you want good players everywhere, but you don’t have to have match player for player, skill-set for skill-set exactly what SF/LAR has at every position for the system to work.

 

[St. Geezy]

Yeah, but apparently Carr and Renfro are BFFs and there were apparently talks about trading for Renfro before the deadline this year that just didn't work out.

I said early last off-season that Foster Moreau was a lock to be a Saint. I will now say the same about Hunter Renfrow.

Renfrow will be our slot WR in 2024…take it to the bank.

Olave, Shaheed, Renfrow, Perry - that is going to be the group.

 

[Gumbo's Dad]

Apparently, that’s the direction we’re going in like it or not. If you wanted more motion we’re certainly getting more motion. I was at the Saints vs Rams game and all that motion was so annoying. Just run the damn play already!

But I have to admit that this style of offense puts a lot of tension on defenses.

We have the wide receivers. Maybe we can add one or two into the mix, but even Bowden performed better at the end.

“Do we have the offensive line ?” is the big question. We can draft a tackle easily in the first round. In this offense I like Taliese Fuaga out of Oregon state. He looks fluid and agile.

We honestly need 2 tackles and if there’s any draft to get 2 this is the one. Except, we never trade down.

I don’t like Andrus Peat in this offense at guard especially and even tackle. He’s a power run lineman for the most part and I can’t imagine him pulling consistently.

Penning, I have given up on but others have not. If he can get his head together he does fit this scheme. I’m just not counting on it.

From what I’ve seen of Saldiveri’s college tape, I like him at guard or tackle in this scheme.

So if we add two tackles and a guard I will feel better about our line. (Not necessarily in the draft)

Oh yeah, Ramczyk is way too toast to play this scheme if he can play at all.

As for tight ends, we need more versatile players who can block, and get open. Juwan Johnson is more of a downfield threat and doesn’t offer much in terms of blocking.

Taysom is an okay blocker and a real threat on any pass play.

Moreau is mostly a good blocking tight end who can be a sneaky option on PA.

So I would expect us to draft a TE in the later rounds. Someone like AJ Barner from Michigan, Ben Sinnott Kansas, Tanner McLachlan Arizona. All bigger dual threat guys. If Bowers falls to us then it’s a huge win but we might have to trade up for a tackle like Morgan from AZ.

I think Shaheed and Olave will be even better in this offense. And we should draft another RB if we want to have more explosive run plays.

So, to summarize, your answer is no lol?

 

[jasonsw]

I think the Saints need to heavily invest on the offensive side of the ball. No matter what the scheme is going to be. They are paying Carr a good bit, it only makes sense to invest on thst side of the ball. Either through draft or free agency, TE, WR, OL and RB help.is needed.

The Saints don't have a true no2. WR, Olave barely is a number 1. Honestly he's more of a number 2, but N.O is going to keep him at 1. Shaheed is definitely more like a 3 and Perry a 4.

RB position is a serious weakness, I just don't think Kamara has any juice left. Hrs played almost 3 full seasons since 2020 and hasn't had memorable performances. Then on his first start Miller goes off. That tells me something. Hopefully Aaint can get that physical RB, in Ricky, Duece and Ingram Style.


TE, at most JJ should be number two. Carr flourishes with a legit bona-fide TE, Waller and Cook. In his final season in Oakland he struggled when Waller was hurt even though he had Adams.

 

[meily]

I think too much gets made of this. Any good coach caters his offense to what his personnel is, regardless of scheme.

Obviously you want good players everywhere, but you don’t have to have match player for player, skill-set for skill-set exactly what SF/LAR has at every position for the system to work.

I think it is the opposite (though you have a valid point), you have a scheme and you find the players to fit your scheme. It leads to why a player can dominate on one team then cash in with another team and under perform simply because he was a player in the right scheme which ultimately benefits both the coordinator of that scheme and the player, but if said player leaves and the coach thinks he can find a player to plug into his scheme and that player under performs in his scheme it is more than likely for the same reason the player he is trying to replace is under performing on his new team.

Its why CSP would always talk about "skillset" when he spoke on personnel.

 

[Elvis]

I think too much gets made of this. Any good coach caters his offense to what his personnel is, regardless of scheme.

"Excuse me sir, I think we need to have a little chat."

 

[St. Geezy]

"Excuse me sir, I think we need to have a little chat."

When did I say we had a good coach?