I Think Sometimes We Focus on the Wrong Things (My Thoughts on Derek Carr Catching Backlash for Not Being in the City) (24 Viewers)

[Elvis]

I feel the same level of criticism of Carr from some and defense of Carr from others as I did when Jameis' time was nearly done with the Saints. Or when it became super clear that Taysom was never going to be the starting QB. Some said it wasn't fair, others said we'd seen enough. What is clear is that there is no consensus and when there is no consensus of whether the QB is good enough to be the starter, it usually means they aren't good enough to be the starter.

People didn't just decide to dislike the guy. He has a history in the NFL. He's been showing us who he is for a decade. If he showed the qualities on and off the field that people wanted to see, nobody would want him to leave. And it's not just about wins. It's about believing that the QB can will a team to a win at any time. Not all the time, but at any given time. I don't think many Saints fans believe Carr can do that at this point. I think most think he can only play to the level of those around him and nothing more. Sometimes that is good enough for a team and it's fans. But not this team and not these fans, not right now. The memory of Drew is still too fresh for fans to settle for a QB like Carr, Jameis or Taysom. We wanted the Montana to Steve Young or Favre to Rodger transition. Not Tom Brady to Mac Jones. With time, some may think differently about Carr's ability on the field, but I doubt many will change their mind about him off the field. I don't think he ever really tried to be New Orleans' QB, just the QB a in New Orleans. There is a difference.

 

[St. Geezy]

And when another QB folds after a half, plays helpless in a shutout, and it is assumed he would be much better with healthy weapons, that's an indication he's not gonna be a championship caliber QB. It also speaks about his mental game.

It happens.

 

[StudioSaint]

What is clear is that there is no consensus and when there is no consensus of whether the QB is good enough to be the starter, it usually means they aren't good enough to be the starter.

Whelp, that settles it. The Saints should also buy Rattler and Haener a ticket on the same flight out of New Orleans as Carr, because fans can't come to a consenus on those two either.

By the standard quoted above, Rattler and Haener most likely aren't good enough either, so don't waste any more time on them either.

 

[St. Geezy]

It’s kind of interesting and frustrating to me that it is so hard for some folks to fathom the idea that it’s possible for a QB to be good, above average but somehow end up stuck on bad teams all the time.

It’s like we all acknowledge that the Raiders are one of the most dysfunctional teams in pro sports, consistently hires bad head coaches and makes poor personnel decisions, had never had a good defense while he was there, acknowledge that Dennis Allen was one of the worst HCs of all-time while here and also was the HC to start Carr’s career, that our injury situation was incredibly, historically awful here, that Pete Carmichael had no idea what he was doing as his OC…but hey, that Derek Carr guy should overcome all of this and win some games already!

He’s had an anomaly career. Teams aren’t just starting him for the sake of it or based on merely reputation…the guy can play.

He’s just not the type of QB that you can stick on a bad team with just anyone at WR and expect him to elevate their games like Drew did at times. Heck, as Saints fans, we saw what happened even if you stick a DREW BREES on bad teams with bad defenses…he doesn’t win nearly as much. The fact that we had so many 7-9 seasons with Drew friggin’ Brees in his prime at QB, which is downright pathetic on the part of Sean Payton and a lowkey fireable offense that he was lucky to survive, tells you how easily things like this can happen.

This is what Carr was working with in Oakland/Vegas, but hey, it’s all his fault that they never won a playoff game amirite?

 

[Saint KayBee]

What does this have to do with people saying that the think the starting QB for the Saints, who is supposed to be the leader of the team should have been here for the Super Bowl promoting the city and the team when so many other current and former players were here?

It’s more unhinged crap too many people in this fan base participate in, in the name of being petty as if that’s a badge of honor. People who made up their minds that they hate him because he took his kids to a recognizable restaurant then fomented their hate because they don’t understand NFL QB contracts are people who are not working from solid foundations, yet they comprise the loudest and most irritating voices in the fan base. It is very important to establish that the guy had two strikes against him from large swarths of the fan base before he went to sleep for the first time as a Saint. That the team hasn’t gone to back-to-back Super Bowls has made the loud jerks louder and jerkier. And anyone who doesn’t join the pile-on gets accused of being related to, or sleeping with (if you’re a woman, as I am) the team member in question. The former accusation is harmless but the latter is extremely tacky.

We can pretend that being an NFL starting QB is just like any other job, but we all know that's not true especially in smaller cities like New Orleans. That precedent was set long ago by Archie Manning, was even carried on by Bobby Hebert, and then Drew Brees. It is part of the job and Brees made that clear years ago.

What does this have to do with Super Bowl week being here, especially when the majority of the fan base here doesn’t even like him? Was he supposed to be a public spectacle for locals to ridicule on an international stage? Being an ambassador during Super Bowl week is a plus, but not a requirement. The Saints were represented plenty during the festivities - even the dearly beloved sex pest who Fox Sports gave a mic to.

Yes there are some over the top things said about Carr and there are butt crevasse fans in every fanbase.

The butt crevasse ratio in this fan base is tipping too far in the wrong direction. The constant whining and extreme negativity is making fanhood unpleasant.

But this is being way blown out of proportion because of past transgressions that have nothing to do with this issue.

It’s cumulative butt crevassery + my growing annoyance with fan behavior, in and out of this space, that is driving my opinion here. It’s like some people saw Dennis Allen get fired midseason, figured it was their participation in the collective meanness that made the firing happen, and will now behave like craven manchildren toward anyone else they want gone. For what it’s worth, I don’t care that DA is gone, we get eyes on the future direction of the team under Kellen Moore and hope for better play in the future, but some people just have not stopped at DA getting the axe.

 

[Stinkers]

It’s kind of interesting and frustrating to me that it is so hard for some folks to fathom the idea that it’s possible for a QB to be good, above average but somehow end up stuck on bad teams all the time.

It’s like we all acknowledge that the Raiders are one of the most dysfunctional teams in pro sports, consistently hires bad head coaches and makes poor personnel decisions, had never had a good defense while he was there, acknowledge that Dennis Allen was one of the worst HCs of all-time while here and also was the HC to start Carr’s career, that our injury situation was incredibly, historically awful here, that Pete Carmichael had no idea what he was doing as his OC…but hey, that Derek Carr guy should overcome all of this and win some games already!

He’s had an anomaly career. Teams aren’t just starting him for the sake of it or based on merely reputation…the guy can play.

He’s just not the type of QB that you can stick on a bad team with just anyone at WR and expect him to elevate their games like Drew did at times. Heck, as Saints fans, we saw what happened even if you stick a DREW BREES on bad teams with bad defenses…he doesn’t win nearly as much. The fact that we had so many 7-9 seasons with Drew friggin’ Brees in his prime at QB, which is downright pathetic on the part of Sean Payton and a lowkey fireable offense that he was lucky to survive, tells you how easily things like this can happen.

This is what Carr was working with in Oakland/Vegas, but hey, it’s all his fault that they never won a playoff game amirite?

That whole narrative of "Carr got Dennis Allen fired twice" is such a forking joke too. Allen had already been the Raiders coach for 2 years when Carr was drafted. He already had a terrible record before Carr got there.

Carr was drafted in the 2nd Round, and they had just signed Matt Schaub (memba him?) to a HUGE free agency deal. (Edit: Schaub was acquired via trade, not signed) Carr wasn't even supposed to play. Schaub was supposed to be their starter going forward, but he played like absolute dogshirt in preseason, and Carr outplayed him by a mile. Carr was the starter in Week 1 of his rookie year, thrown into the fire immediately on a bad team.

They lost something like 7-8 games straight to start the season before Allen was fired, but he was 4-12 the previous season, and 4-12 again the season before that. Needless to say that's a pretty sheetty record. Allen was already on VERY thin ice and should have already been fired before Carr even got drafted.

But hey, whatever narrative some people want to spin to blame Carr for something else.

 

[bayoumilitia]

Why are you saying that when you’ve been saying this whole time that Carr should have been down in New Orleans for the Super Bowl. That is telling the man what to do with his time. People have described his personality as inauthentic and self serving…attacking his character. Saying he shouldn’t eat at a restaurant of his choice…Am i just not reading it right?

I’ve only seen two posts saying that his actions “seemed” inauthentic or self-serving. Could that be construed as attacking his character? Maybe. Do we actually think Derek or any other player gives a crap about what fans say about them on forums like SR or other team forums? IMO, probably not.

If you paid me millions to play a kids game, feel free to take shots at my character all day long. It’s part of the gig, the good and the bad, the love and the hate. Just about every public figure, entertainer, politician, and yes athlete gets hate for no reason at times and at other times it’s justified.

Whether or not it’s justified in this case for Carr I’m not sure. I would say this though. I think some of it also might stem from the recent terrorist attack and the NOLASTRONG support that you saw from people like Sean Payton, Cam Jordan and Mrs Gayle. Yes it was a FOX driven production with Lady Gaga but it was done to show support for the first responders, respect for those lost and their families and the resiliency of a city that has seen its fair share of heartache.

So maybe not so much as a demand but to me it’s nice to see any public figure, popular movie star, musician or athlete show New Orleans support and love. Maybe he’s extremely introverted or had other family obligations. I personally wasn’t looking for him but I think that’s the vibe (not outrage) that some of you are feeling imho. Although I could be wrong, as I often am

 

[bayoumilitia]

It’s kind of interesting and frustrating to me that it is so hard for some folks to fathom the idea that it’s possible for a QB to be good, above average but somehow end up stuck on bad teams all the time.

It’s like we all acknowledge that the Raiders are one of the most dysfunctional teams in pro sports, consistently hires bad head coaches and makes poor personnel decisions, had never had a good defense while he was there, acknowledge that Dennis Allen was one of the worst HCs of all-time while here and also was the HC to start Carr’s career, that our injury situation was incredibly, historically awful here, that Pete Carmichael had no idea what he was doing as his OC…but hey, that Derek Carr guy should overcome all of this and win some games already!

He’s had an anomaly career. Teams aren’t just starting him for the sake of it or based on merely reputation…the guy can play.

He’s just not the type of QB that you can stick on a bad team with just anyone at WR and expect him to elevate their games like Drew did at times. Heck, as Saints fans, we saw what happened even if you stick a DREW BREES on bad teams with bad defenses…he doesn’t win nearly as much. The fact that we had so many 7-9 seasons with Drew friggin’ Brees in his prime at QB, which is downright pathetic on the part of Sean Payton and a lowkey fireable offense that he was lucky to survive, tells you how easily things like this can happen.

This is what Carr was working with in Oakland/Vegas, but hey, it’s all his fault that they never won a playoff game amirite?

No doubt about that. I think if he’s 100%, and our O line is healthy, add another bulldozing guard and we get our playmakers back from their injuries I think KM will find a way for us to easily generate points WITH Carr. Look at what Kubiack did in the first 2 games with a healthy offense and a full playbook.

Is Carr a HoF? Nah but we all know that and it’s sad but true like you said. If he wasn’t stuck in purgatory on teams with putrid defenses or other issues who knows what his stats might look like. I do believe if I’m not mistaken he was leading the league in just about every statistical category the last 6 games of 2023 and the first 2 games of 2024 before McCoy got hurt, soooooooo

I want us to be relevant in the post season again to but what’s crazy is as bad as the last 4 now 5 seasons have gone the Saints are still in the top 10 for most wins in the last decade.

Most NFL Wins Past Decade (2015-2024) | EDSFootball.com

Ranking NFL franchises by wins over the past 10 NFL seasons (2015-2024).

eatdrinkandsleepfootball.com

 

[Hubig]

Derek Carr is a 150m Andy Dalton. Bottom of the mid tier QB, not winning anything significant with him. You might win 10 games with him if every single thing around him goes right, he isn't elevating anyone to the next level. The optics have never been good with him, yelling at players on the field, throwing ppl under the bus, seemingly allergic to accountability, and even had a head coach that enabled him. He's been a tough player through the years, rushes to get back on the field, to his credit.

He's just not a fit for New Orleans and will never be a fit for this fanbase. He gets crushed more on twitter than Mayor Cantrell, let that one sink in. He gets crushed more than just about anyone else in the public sphere in the state. He doesn't seem very popular with the fans, either optically or just seems tone deaf, you could debate whether or not thats fair but it just is what it is.

 

[SigFreudianSlip]

No doubt about that. I think if he’s 100%, and our O line is healthy, add another bulldozing guard and we get our playmakers back from their injuries I think KM will find a way for us to easily generate points WITH Carr. Look at what Kubiack did in the first 2 games with a healthy offense and a full playbook.

Is Carr a HoF? Nah but we all know that and it’s sad but true like you said. If he wasn’t stuck in purgatory on teams with putrid defenses or other issues who knows what his stats might look like. I do believe if I’m not mistaken he was leading the league in just about every statistical category the last 6 games of 2023 and the first 2 games of 2024 before McCoy got hurt, soooooooo

Agreed. I think he definitely gets too much backlash here, he’s a pretty good QB imo. The team is just lacking talent all over right now.

 

[SigFreudianSlip]

Derek Carr is a 150m Andy Dalton. Bottom of the mid tier QB, not winning anything significant with him. You might win 10 games with him if every single thing around him goes right, he isn't elevating anyone to the next level. The optics have never been good with him, yelling at players on the field, throwing ppl under the bus, seemingly allergic for accountability, and even had a head coach that enabled him. He's been a tough player through the years, rushes to get back on the field, to his credit.

He's just not a fit for New Orleans and will never be a fit for this fanbase. He gets crushed more on twitter than Mayor Cantrell, let that one sink in.

Derek the Destroya?

 

[bayoumilitia]

Agreed. I think he definitely gets too much backlash here, he’s a pretty good QB imo. The team is just lacking talent all over right now.

I mean damn, let’s just roll it back to our 2006-2013 years. Score 40 or more and shoot for a defensive unit at least ranked about 20th. So long as they average only giving up less than 30 PPG we should be good . Have killer special teams, create turnovers, score at will. Sean knew what we had, Kellen will know exactly what improvements will need to be made to our offensive line (besides staying healthy). Like I said, if we could score 42 points a game with a healthy roster and Carr with Kubiak someone tell me why we can’t do that with Moore?

 

[Semper]

clown reactions from people I have on ignore are always the most delightful ones

I have never understood the ignore thing. It’s a forum you come to discuss the Saints with other people. Is it you only want to hear from people who echo your opinion?

 

[jasonsw]