Is Rattler your guy next year? (1 Viewer)

[St. Widge]

Rattler has done enough to make you feel like he was a good investment. There’s real growth there and he looks better.

Problem is, because of the injuries and issues with coaching, we’re not getting a real clear picture of him. So drafting another QB is not out of the question if one falls or if the team really falls in love with one.

Yep. I like Rattler and I think he still has a shot to be the guy, but if the new HC really likes one of the QBs in this draft, I have no issue with them drafting one and having another young QB to hope on. It's much better to have too many QBs than too few.

I don't really like either of the top guys, Sanders and Ward, but maybe one of the lower rated guys have more potential than I see. For instance, I never really get what was seen in Carson Beck and now he has an injury, but maybe he's better than I think he is? Or maybe someone sees how to fix Jalen Milroe if he declares for the draft? I think both have huge question marks, but if they take a shot at one of them in the right round, I would understand taking the shot. If you hit, the upside is huge and the down side of a miss is relatively low.

 

[St. Widge]

I'm not a "cap guru" but wouldn't restructuring Carr's contract mean keeping him another year (or having more dead money after he is gone)?

If so I just say pay him to be the starter next year and then let him walk/retire.

Stop kicking the can, eat the bad contracts.

It wouldn't mean keeping him another year past next year if we don't want to, but it would mean more dead cap when he leaves. The problem is that there may not be any other option but to restructure him this year in order to get under the cap. I think Tripplet had a way to do it in theory, but he didn't even seem sure it was possible, and I think it required some guys to rework their deals and take less money. I mean, we have to get around $60 million off of the cap and there are only so many options to do that.

 

[Rouxble]

I'm not a "cap guru" but wouldn't restructuring Carr's contract mean keeping him another year (or having more dead money after he is gone)?

If so I just say pay him to be the starter next year and then let him walk/retire.

Stop kicking the can, eat the bad contracts.

In theory, you could restructure his contract and then do a post June 1 cut. It would create more dead money after he is gone.

For example, a full restructure would reduce his cap hit by about $31m, making it easy to carry his hit until June 1.

With a post June 1 release, that hit would further drop about $1m.

Next year, we would have a $31m larger dead money hit ($60m instead of $29m) due to the restructure.

The whole plan involves paying Carr $40m to play somewhere else, so I don't consider it very likely.

 

[ELLIASJWILLIAMS]

Assuming we move on from Derek, is Rattler your guy next year? On Twitter, there appears to be mixed reviews of him.

Nope. Derek is still better right now and I wouldn’t restructure him. I would however love to see Rattler with a full year/offseason in a pro system.

I saw a guy that improved in some ways in between starts but also a guy who needs to work on quite a few things.

Any signs of taking to coaching are going to be good for him

 

[rsmith2783]

Decided to watch the game against the Raiders again this morning (I know lol). I wanted to go through all of Rattlers throws again to form a more detailed opinion on how he played.

1st drive

Utilized his legs for a big 25+ yard run. Had a beautiful 24 yard throw to Juwan Johnson perfectly placed over a LB, but was dropped. Would have had the Saints in the redzone and likely able to come away with points that drive. Even with the drop, they were in Field Goal range and a false start penalty took them out of range.

2nd drive

Well executed pass to Kendre Miller in the flat for about 15 yards. Double pass trick play with perfect execution to Foster Moreau for a 30 yard touchdown.

3rd drive

Holding penalty sets offense back on 1st play. 25 yard throw on 2nd and 18 to overcome the holding penalty. Another penalty (illegal shift) setting the Saints back. Rattler with a 40 yard touchdown pass to Juwan Johnson negated by a (very soft) holding penalty. Without the penalty the Saints likely challenge the spot as it looks like Juwan crossed the goal line before being touched. Penalty knocked the Saints out of field goal range yet again.

4th drive

A few nice short completions to move down the field. Followed by a 22 yard throw with pressure in his face to Kevin Austin to put the Saints in the redzone. Illegal formation penalty (again) forces the Saints back. Still came away with a field goal to end the drive going into half time.

5th drive (start of 2nd half)

Rattler completes pass for first down to Juwan Johnson despite missed block by our OL allowing free rusher. Next play hits Kevin Austin in the hands for what would have been a 12 yard catch into Raider territory, but ended up as a bad drop. 2 plays later another 12 yard pass was dropped, this time, by Juwan Johnson. The drops killed the drive and at the very least took us out of field goal range.

6th drive

First play was a 21 yard throw to MVS which was dropped by MVS. Rattler could have thrown a split second earlier, but also a good WR comes down with that catch. Bad throw by Rattler on his next throw ends the drive. 1st drive through 6 drives that any sort of blame could be placed on Rattler for not coming away with points.

7th drive

Missed block forces Rattler to rush pass for incompletion. Next play more missed blocks by OL, but Rattler evades the rush and throws 9 yard pass to CEH, but he drops it. Creating a 3rd and 10 instead of 3 and 1. Rattler sacked on the next play ending the drive. Jamal Williams missed his block creating the sack.

8th drive

Rattler with a 10 yard throw to Moreau after avoiding pressure, but it was dropped. Throw was a bit low, but very catchable. On 4th down, Rattler makes a play with his legs to pick up the 1st down. Rattler avoids the rush again and completes a 15 yard pass on the run to Cedrick Wilson, but a holding penalty wipes away the play and forces a 2nd and 16. Next play Rattler threw a pass off Cedrick Wilson’s hands which was deflected for an interception. High throw from Rattler ball placement could have been better.

9th drive

Rattler sacked on first play. Not enough urgency from Rattler to get rid of the ball. Next play ton of pressure nobody open, leading to quick throwaway from Rattler. Next throw contested catch attempt to Juwan Johnson that falls incomplete. Johnson rounds his route and half arses it out of his break. I fault Johnson on this one and not Rattler. Could have gotten us close to a first down on the play. Instead led to a punt.

10th drive

Screen for minimal gain. Short completion for another short gain. Rattler sacked. Missed block and pocket collapsed before anyone could get open. Led to punt.

11th drive

Short completion to start drive. Rattler makes play with his legs to pick up 1st down. Dropped pass to CEH. Pass was behind CEH could have been better throw by Rattler. Beautiful 19 yard throw to Pettis move the Saints into Raiders territory. Throw to MVS dropped as he was trying to secure the throw. Big throw to Juwan Johnson to pick up first down on 3rd and 13. Nice throw to Juwan Johnson to get us to the Raiders 4 yard line, but OPI by Johnson. Next play was an interception by Rattler. Tried to force a throw into tight coverage. Saints were down 15 with 50 seconds left.


By my count there were 9 passes that were dropped by receivers in this game. Thats including any pass that hit the intended receiver in the hands. Of those 9 passes I’d say 3 of them could have been thrown better by Rattler and would have been very difficult catches. In other words, at least 6 positive plays were negated by dropped passes from our players.

Now onto penalties. 7 penalties negated positive plays. 3 holding penalties. 1 of them negated a 40 yard (touchdown?) on what was a very soft holding call. Thought the other holding penalties were legit. Then we had 3 drives with either False Start, Illegal Shift, or Illegal Formation penalties. Another big play was negated by an OPI. Could easily argue that dumb penalties cost us 3-4 potential scoring drives with where we were on the field when the penalties occurred.

I thought Rattler’s first half was excellent. He battled through a ton of adversity with his teammates consistently letting him down and finished with just 2 incompletions (1 drop and 1 throwaway pass). Without the drop, he would have had around 200 yards passing and rushing in the first half alone. The 2nd half the miscues got worse from the team. Rattler played well still up until the 4th quarter when we were down multiple scores. His throws started to get a little more spotty and he was forcing some throws.

Overall, I thought Rattler’s was the least of our concerns on offense yesterday. He still is far from a finished product, but I thought he showed enough to keep his name in the running to be our QB of the future going into 2025. I don’t think we will be in position to add a QB in the draft that has more talent than Rattler and an open competition with Carr going into next offseason seems like the most likely scenario. Whether it’s Carr or Rattler next year we clearly need more reliable pass catching options.

Very nice breakdown. Those sacks, penalties and drops did not help out at all. If anything, we're seeing what he needs to work on as far as facing the blitz, rushing throws, etc.
I'd love to see Brees be his mentor.

 

[texasjefe]

I like Rattler's passing talent and mobility. I'm glad they drafted him and I'm glad he'll be at camp next year. If he can get out of next week healthy, he'll have his first full offseason to process and develop. Is he the future? Unknown.

I do believe that Jake Haener does not have the skillset or talent to have a place on the Saints offseason roster.

 

[St.Dan]

for the one hundred millionth time, because of the salary cap, we can NOT move on from Carr this season.

Let's stop already.

^^This It's a bit like working retail and you have no choice but to tell everyone who comes up to you who asks for a certain item that you've run out until the truck comes!

Yesterday's game essentially ended the moment Fuaga got called for holding on the would-be TD pass to Juwan Johnson. On top of the injuries and roster deficiencies noted on here for months, it's mental mistakes that have prevented this team from achieving anything this year. But on that play, we should have seen the reason Rattler is the guy who needs to be coached-up for the future. We have Carr for one more year due to the cap situation, plus I see no deserving upper-round grade for any QB coming out this year. Any "hits" in this draft class will be at least a mild surprise going forward.

 

[AARPSaint]

How many games have the Saints won this year with Carr playing?
How many games have the Saints won this year with Carr not playing?
I know: quarterback quality and team records don’t necessarily correlate, but zero wins is a rather significant consideration.

Tyler’s helpful breakdown shows that Rattler has potential and that his supporting cast has failed him time after time after time. We’re stuck with Carr for the time being, but that’s a far better option than Rattler at this point. I’m seeing an actual competition between Carr and Rattler for the starting quarterback with Carr winning, and Rattler perhaps being the successor in a few years.

 

[saintfan-n-alexla]

Qb isn’t a pressing need be it Carr, Rattler or X

Until we fix the other issues qb won’t get us anywhere

Brees couldn’t win with a poor defense and his defense’s were arguably better than current

The last 2 weeks have been horrible defensively

The oline and WR core as bad as they are outshine what the defense has been showing

 

[Elvis]

The reason we need to be hearing about interviews soon is for this reason. We really need to get a jump on roster moves that suit the next coach. If Carr knows he’s not going to play, he may want to get out and go to a team where he can start. That could help with both his contract structure and no trade clause.

That said, Rattler hasn’t proven he can be the guy either. He belongs in the league, but I’m not sure he can be more than a bottom 10 starting QB until I see more. If we choose to start him it’ll be a good indicator that we’re rebuilding even if those words aren’t spoken by the front office.

 

[WhoDat?DrewDat]

Next 2-3 seasons are a wash anyway so might as well.

 

[St. Widge]

The reason we need to be hearing about interviews soon is for this reason. We really need to get a jump on roster moves that suit the next coach. If Carr knows he’s not going to play, he may want to get out and go to a team where he can start. That could help with both his contract structure and no trade clause.

That said, Rattler hasn’t proven he can be the guy either. He belongs in the league, but I’m not sure he can be more than a bottom 10 starting QB until I see more. If we choose to start him it’ll be a good indicator that we’re rebuilding even if those words aren’t spoken by the front office.

Problem is that you certainly want to talk to, and possibly hire, guys that are still in the playoffs and that's hard to do while they are still in the playoffs. But, don't we have until June 1 before we really have to make any roster moves and get under the cap?

 

[Vision]

Assuming we move on from Derek, is Rattler your guy next year? On Twitter, there appears to be mixed reviews of him.

Rattler probably locks up QB2 next year. QB1 is Carr or someone not here yet.

 

[SAINTSFAN]

Why is everyone so down on Carr? I never understand this empty frustration directed at him. His numbers are very good. As of now Carr gives us the best chance to win. Even drafting a quarterback, Carr is still the best options.

Does he give you a chance to win? What has his career proven? This team should be rebuilding anyway. We are too old and devoid of talent due to abysmal salary cap management by a GM who has zero accountability.

 

[Elvis]

Problem is that you certainly want to talk to, and possibly hire, guys that are still in the playoffs and that's hard to do while they are still in the playoffs. But, don't we have until June 1 before we really have to make any roster moves and get under the cap?

We can start with college guys now. The team needs a new vision for the future. NFL understudies are great, but innovation is coming from college and they know the next generation of football players better than the old coaches in the nfl do. Not saying to not eventually hire a coordinator from another team, just to get started. Ron Rivera has already scheduled an interview with the Jets. I just want to see some movement.

And we have only until March 17th to get under the cap.