Saints are flying Kafka and Weaver in for 2nd interviews [Interviews completed] (8 Viewers)

[St. Widge]

I get what you're saying, but in most careers, if your boss doesn't renew your contract, most people interpret that as being fired. I've been warming up to the idea of Mike, but he was fired for all practical purposes, even if we all agree that Jerry is an idiot.

So do you think a player got fired if a team lets him become a free agent instead of signing him to a new contract?

 

[3ParStillDriver]

So do you think a player got fired if a team lets him become a free agent instead of signing him to a new contract?

Not everything is that cut and dry but the answer is generally yes.

McCarthy is a slightly different story though. Jones wanted him to supposedly train his replacement. If you were going to do your job for the next 10+ years but someone said to train your replacement, you would have a very clear understanding that you are not the future and the boss does not want you in the future.

 

[ELLIASJWILLIAMS]

I get what you're saying, but in most careers, if your boss doesn't renew your contract, most people interpret that as being fired. I've been warming up to the idea of Mike, but he was fired for all practical purposes, even if we all agree that Jerry is an idiot.
Also, they need to scrap the Rooney rule at this point; it's just becoming a mockery of the original intent. Owners are going to hire who they want, and if they have biases, sitting down with the next Mike Tomlin will not change your views on minorities. I mean, one franchisee said he was too hip-hop.

I'm not most people, I interpret Bobby Slowik as an example of firing, I interpret unable to come to terms on a contract as unable to come to terms on a contract. your need to warm up to McCarthey is likely why you interpret what happened to him as a firing, it supports how you feel about him as an option.

I agree the Rooney rule is a sham, I hate it. Just ends up w/ minorites being called forward on sham interviews just to check off a box.

 

[3ParStillDriver]

I'm not most people, I interpret Bobby Slowik as an example of firing, I interpret unable to come to terms on a contract as unable to come to terms on a contract. your need to warm up to McCarthey is likely why you interpret what happened to him as a firing, it supports how you feel about him as an option.

I agree the Rooney rule is a sham, I hate it. Just ends up w/ minorites being called forward on sham interviews just to check off a box.

Heres an article around McCarthy and Jones contract negotiations really went. https://www.lonestarlive.com/cowboy...owboys-wound-up-parting-with-their-coach.html

It sure sounds like Jones wasn't keen on the idea of bringing McCarthy back. But rather Jones mind seemed made up prior to the season that he was going to let McCarthy ride off nice and quietly but give him one last chance to prove he's worth keeping.

Knowing a few Cowboys fans, they felt the loss in the playoffs last year was a coaching blunder and haven't been keen. Inf act I was sitting with one last weekend drinking a few beers, and he wasn't a fan of McCarthy. Said he didn't believe McCarthy would ever get them to the superbowl, but also doesn't believe Jones will hire someone who can and that McCarthy was sadly likely to be one of his last decent hires.

And I kinda felt that a lot because of hiring Dennis Allen my belief in Loomis has been shakin.

 

[St. Geezy]

Heres an article around McCarthy and Jones contract negotiations really went. https://www.lonestarlive.com/cowboy...owboys-wound-up-parting-with-their-coach.html

It sure sounds like Jones wasn't keen on the idea of bringing McCarthy back. But rather Jones mind seemed made up prior to the season that he was going to let McCarthy ride off nice and quietly but give him one last go to prove he's worth keeping.

Yeah I think it’s one of those things where Jones simply became bored with McCarthy. Stale relationship.

Really hard to judge any coach coming from that organization. They’re in a tough spot with possibly the toughest boss there is to work for in the league and a boss that thinks he knows how to win title but doesn’t.

 

[3ParStillDriver]

Yeah I think it’s one of those things where Jones simply became bored with McCarthy. Stale relationship.

Really hard to judge any coach coming from that organization. They’re in a tough spot with possibly the toughest boss there is to work for in the league and a boss that thinks he knows how to win title but doesn’t.

I don't think its hard. I mean if you recall watching McCarthy in his last few years with Green Bay vs his years in Dallas he's extremely consistent. In the season he looked great and in the playoffs it suddenly becomes amateur hour for some reason. It soured his relationship with Jones, Rodgers (but it seems every relationship with Rodgers sours) but also some Green Bay officials, which is why they let McCarthy go. And I honestly don't understand what changed with him, because it wasn't always so. Green Bay under him was hot in the early 2010's. Perhaps it was still the case and Rodgers being in his prime overcame it? Just wild speculation at that point. But I believe we can say for certainty its been very consistent for the past 10 years.

 

[HogsNSaints]

I am an Arky guy living in Oklahoma and constantly traveling to Dallas 2.5 hours away, so 90% of my work dealings are with Cowboys fans. I have not spoken to a single one, in about 100 football discussions - that wanted the team to retain Mike McCarthy. I am aware that’s a “for what it’s worth” blurb. But, sharing my own experience. And it was a sentiment that I agreed with. Site his SB 15 years ago, that is fine. Ever since then, he’s been a perennial underachiever.

 

[St. Widge]

I don't think its hard. I mean if you recall watching McCarthy in his last few years with Green Bay vs his years in Dallas he's extremely consistent. In the season he looked great and in the playoffs it suddenly becomes amateur hour for some reason.

I mean, the man got to 4 NFC Championship Games and one Super Bowl in Green Bay. I'd say that's pretty far above amateur hour in the playoffs unless you have unreasonably high standards.

 

[St. Widge]

I am an Arky guy living in Oklahoma and constantly traveling to Dallas 2.5 hours away, so 90% of my work dealings are with Cowboys fans. I have not spoken to a single one, in about 100 football discussions - that wanted the team to retain Mike McCarthy. I am aware that’s a “for what it’s worth” blurb. But, sharing my own experience. And it was a sentiment that I agreed with. Site his SB 15 years ago, that is fine. Ever since then, he’s been a perennial underachiever.

The last thing I care about is the opinion of fans regarding their HC. And somewhere below that is the opinion of Cowboys fans.

 

[St. Geezy]

I don't think its hard. I mean if you recall watching McCarthy in his last few years with Green Bay vs his years in Dallas he's extremely consistent. In the season he looked great and in the playoffs it suddenly becomes amateur hour for some reason. It soured his relationship with Jones, Rodgers (but it seems every relationship with Rodgers sources) but also some Green Bay officials, which is why they let McCarthy go.

Gotta dig deeper. GB constantly found themselves in championship games playing in awful weather at home against great defenses or on the road playing against great SF defenses. Losing multiple OT games and/or last second field goal games.

Lady Luck just kept going against them at the worst moments or they kept running into the exact wrong team that was on a SB mission.

Sound familiar? Remind you of another head coach that I’m sure you’d still take to this day because you know he’d at least get you in position consistently?

 

[3ParStillDriver]

I mean, the man got to 4 NFC Championship Games and one Super Bowl in Green Bay. I'd say that's pretty far above amateur hour in the playoffs unless you have unreasonably high standards.

You've made that point many times and I've addressed already to a point that you know what the response will be, so I don't understand why you persist. Either way, the original post was updated already preemptively responding to this, guessing that this would be brought up.

 

[HogsNSaints]

The last thing I care about is the opinion of fans regarding their HC. And somewhere below that is the opinion of Cowboys fans.

I think it’s spotty and subject to what fans you are talking to, but when hardcore fans that know their stuff don’t want the guy - a) they’ve watched more of their teams’ performances than me, b) they know more background detail than me, etc… They share the same sentiment that the man is not getting all of the juice out of the berry.. And knowing the talent on that roster last year, it was pretty clear that he didn’t..

GB fired him for the same thing.

 

[St. Widge]

You've made that point many times and I've addressed already to a point that you know what the response will be, so I don't understand why you persist. Either way, the original post was updated already preemptively responding to this, guessing that this would be brought up.

I persist because it's true and you keep saying he struggled in the playoffs.

 

[RaginCajun83]

So did either one interview today?

 

[St. Widge]

I think it’s spotty and subject to what fans you are talking to, but when hardcore fans that know their stuff don’t want the guy - a) they’ve watched more of their teams’ performances than me, b) they know more background detail than me, etc… They share the same sentiment that the man is not getting all of the juice out of the berry.. And knowing the talent on that roster last year, it was pretty clear that he didn’t..

GB fired him for the same thing.

Hard core fans are just as suspectible to emotion and unreasonable expectations as casuals. Maybe even more so. And Cowboy fans in particular tend to have unreasonable expectations because they had one of the few dynasties to exist in the NFL and they think it is their right to have another one and any coach that does not establish a dynasty in Dallas is terrible.

Similar things are true about Green Bay fans who are spoiled to have consecutive great QBs and a history of winning Championships.

I'm not saying McCarthy is the best coach in the league and he's not top 5. I'm not even saying he's definitely the right HC for the Saints. But, he's a very good coach with a very high win percentage over his career and lots of success in the playoffs including one Super Bowl. But, none of that is going to matter to Cowboy fans, especially the older and more hardcore ones, because that success did not happen in Dallas and to them it's either win several Super Bowls in a short period of time or you aren't good enough to coach the Cowboys. Some of our fans have become like that, although without any real justification given our history.