Athleticism over Talent (1 Viewer)

[SigFreudianSlip]

@Taker597 oh wow.
I’d take a flyer late on Bennett (after 5th) but do not think he has anywhere near the ceiling/potential that AR does. I could be very wrong tho.

 

[Taker597]

@Taker597 oh wow.
I’d take a flyer late on Bennett (after 5th) but do not think he has anywhere near the ceiling/potential that AR does. I could be very wrong tho.

We all could be very wrong. So, it's really weird to make a stance and thinking that only one type of QB succeed in the NFL is objectively wrong. Athleticism = Talent.


Especially, before he is even drafted. It's easy to make an assumption when he gets drafted, because we can evaluate the support system.

 

[warriors93]

The NFL and the majority of threads on this board seem to value athleticism over talent at the QB position. This is why the product has become awful and only a few good teams worth watching.

The fact Anthony Eichardson is somehow even in play for the #1 overall after the combine is a crazy. The #1 objective for a QB is to get the ball in the offensive players hands accurately and quickly. Yet the everyone is obsessed with “arm talent” and 40s for a QB. It’s crazy that the “traditional” QBs are being ripped apart for not being tall enough or athletic enough or can’t throw an 80 yr bomb off their back foot. Yet the same people are in love with the athletic QB with big arm that can’t hit the broad side of the barn or one read QBs. Those traits can’t be taught in the NFL. Consistency can be taught from repetition but not the others.

Next are we gonna want our lineman to run 40s? We have lost sight on what a qb is supposed to be good at. If Lamar Jackson and Jalen hurts are the new NFL standard then count me out. However I don’t think that will be the case, as the QBs with success (SB appearances) are good QBs first and foremost and athletic secondary.

* END RANT*

Athletic quarterbacks aren't ruining the league. Bad QB's in general, and terrible evaluation of the position is ruining the league. If you can squeeze a few good years out of a dual threat, more power to you. So many bad "traditional" guys have busted out of the league real quick. It's a tough position to find the right guy, the right fit. If you don't like athletic guys, cool, but they aren't the problem.

 

[boutte]

I just read the first page so I don't know what's been said.
The most important things a QB needs are smarts, poise, toughness, a competitive nature, skill and physical talent.
In that order.

What a lot of these guys are missing is skill. It's not their fault though. The blame goes to their coaches before they got to the NFL. Do you think Michael Vick's coaches in H.S. or college gave carp if he wasn't such a good passer? (He did have some spectacular games in the NFL though.)

Remember RG III?

 

[Crawdaddys]

Going back in time, I remember this one athletic QB that did develop his passing game in such that he did have a long successful career. Randall Cunningham. Didn't hurt having Randy Moss and Chris Carter to throw to.

 

[Lazarus]

Going back in time, I remember this one athletic QB that did develop his passing game in such that he did have a long successful career. Randall Cunningham. Didn't hurt having Randy Moss and Chris Carter to throw to.

Loved Cunningham , He is the perfect example of how to blend athleticism and pocket passing really great dude super smart If anyone could know Richardson would develop like Cunningham they would be all over him

 

[SigFreudianSlip]

Loved Cunningham , He is the perfect example of how to blend athleticism and pocket passing really great dude super smart If anyone could know Richardson would develop like Cunningham they would be all over him

He’s a great dude, my stepmom took ballet with him while he was at UNLV, got to know him pretty well.

 

[Trey W.]

The issue I have with athleticism over talent is in this league injuries are dang near a guarantee. There have been numerous players drafted high because of amazing athleticism only to fade out of the league and vanish whether because that’s all they relied on, injuries, bad personalities, or just couldn’t mentally process the NFL game because they never had to develop the mental aspect of the game.

Jamarcus Russel, Josh Gordon, kevin white, RG3, Vince Young, every LB we drafted under Ditka (except Fields), and so many others had amazing athleticism but little talent and never developed the work ethic to obtain talent.

Not always but most of the time, players with talent can over come injuries, mental lapses, bad decisions. Because to get talent you have to work for it, rarely is talent god given, it’s time, blood, sweat, and tears poured into developing it. That’s what made Drew so good, he was short, not super strong, and had to develop accuracy, timing, body control, to over come his shortages. Putting in that time and dedication made him great. Players born with pure athleticism don’t feel the need to put in that time because they’ve been able to dominate with sheer ability their whole life and haven’t developed the work mentality it takes to be great at the highest level.

If you can luck out and find a player that has both, then sit back and be amazed.

 

[lapaz]

So let’s point to one success story lol. How about Trey lance? Jordan love? Zach Wilson? Justin Fields? Do I need to go on? The most important trait is vision, anticipation, and accuracy, along with pocket awareness. Great if he’s mobile too that’s just even more upside.

To be fair the list of failed QBs is much longer than the list of successful QBs. I think what has been shown is that you can be a successful QB as either a pocket passer or as a mobile QB. Pocket passers need to process fast and be accurate. Running QBs need to have elite escapability, be very athletic and have fair accuracy. Pocket passers will have much longer careers, but they usually take longer to develop, and that means they’ll also cost a lot more over their careers. Running QBs may get to their 2nd contract and probably start declining towards the end of their 2nd contract, but they don’t take as long to develop. A team could use the strategy of picking mobile QBs and only keeping them through their 1st contract. There is more than 1 way to win.

I personally prefer QBs in the Brees and Burrow mold that are mobile, but use their legs sparingly. That type emphasizes accuracy and quick processing. I think those types of QBs will win more Superbowls.

 

[HattiesburgWhoDat]

The NFL and the majority of threads on this board seem to value athleticism over talent at the QB position. This is why the product has become awful and only a few good teams worth watching.

The fact Anthony Eichardson is somehow even in play for the #1 overall after the combine is a crazy. The #1 objective for a QB is to get the ball in the offensive players hands accurately and quickly. Yet the everyone is obsessed with “arm talent” and 40s for a QB. It’s crazy that the “traditional” QBs are being ripped apart for not being tall enough or athletic enough or can’t throw an 80 yr bomb off their back foot. Yet the same people are in love with the athletic QB with big arm that can’t hit the broad side of the barn or one read QBs. Those traits can’t be taught in the NFL. Consistency can be taught from repetition but not the others.

Next are we gonna want our lineman to run 40s? We have lost sight on what a qb is supposed to be good at. If Lamar Jackson and Jalen hurts are the new NFL standard then count me out. However I don’t think that will be the case, as the QBs with success (SB appearances) are good QBs first and foremost and athletic secondary.

* END RANT*

To me a QB needs:

#1 - Smarts (ability to change plays at LOS and read defenses)
#2 - Accuracy
#3 - Arm strength
#4 - Ability to move IN the pocket

Then you can start looking at athletic ability. Without #1 & #2 what good is a QB? He's a glorified RB.

 

[Outbackjack]

No undertones to see here, folks.

No, but good try forcing it in.

Pretty much e dry where has shown his closest comp to be Allen

 

[Snakehead]

To be fair the list of failed QBs is much longer than the list of successful QBs. I think what has been shown is that you can be a successful QB as either a pocket passer or as a mobile QB. Pocket passers need to process fast and be accurate. Running QBs need to have elite escapability, be very athletic and have fair accuracy. Pocket passers will have much longer careers, but they usually take longer to develop, and that means they’ll also cost a lot more over their careers. Running QBs may get to their 2nd contract and probably start declining towards the end of their 2nd contract, but they don’t take as long to develop. A team could use the strategy of picking mobile QBs and only keeping them through their 1st contract. There is more than 1 way to win.

I personally prefer QBs in the Brees and Burrow mold that are mobile, but use their legs sparingly. That type emphasizes accuracy and quick processing. I think those types of QBs will win more Superbowls.

Exactly. I think people forget how good of an athlete Brees was and Burrow is. Burrow almost quit football to play basketball.

As for the athletic/running QBs, teams could essentially do what the Ravens are about to do. Just draft the best QB that fits the mold every 5 years and let the previous one hit FA, but on the Franchise Tag to ensure they get something. Rinse repeat.

This was the strategy the Colts had at RB understanding that you shouldn't give RBs a 2nd contract, just draft the best one every 4-5 years, example Marshall Faulk and Edge.

 

[greg8710]

This board is a microcosm of society. Every Andy supported and Winston detractor was labeled racist or clueless. I mean people on here still thinking Winston is a starting QB. I don’t get it. If you don’t like the mobile, spread college offense QB you’re anti black QBs.

Patrick Mahomes is the very rare combo of both high QB IQ and athleticism. Allen is close but he leaves a lot to be desired as a passer imo. His great is great but he has some lows too often. Hurts is running a high school/college offense. He will be the new Lamar. Great stats but will never win bc you can’t win on the biggest stages with that type of QB play. I mean it took an unreal defensive season for the eagles and still couldn’t pull it off.

Every GM and fan would love the combo of Brady/Hurts. That guy would be unstoppable. Just not sure he exists or ever will.

No one wants to accept this

 

[HattiesburgWhoDat]

Brees never got an MVP lol

And that was criminal