FOX8 Sean Fazende’s take on Rattler/Haener backup QB situation (9 Viewers)

[CowtownSaint]

That's a totally different discussion. I am staying within the topic base on the podcast.

Fair enough brother

 

[Vision]

Because Rattler showed significantly more poise and playmaking ability early in those games with a patchwork offensive line than Haener did in the 1st half Sunday with our starting offensive line.

If you couldn't see how badly Haener was rattled and pressing, I don't know what to tell you...

Ben Dinucci is only fairly credible and he reported that first half was awful.

 

[Vision]

I felt real bad for Haener when they cut to him just after the half and he had that "1000 yard stare" and Rattler had his helmet on. I also thought that Haener had outplayed Rattler before the start of the game Sunday. I just think the moment was too big for Haener. Rattler has more moxie than Haener does and he rose up to the moment.

Going into Sunday I felt Jake was still QB2, but I think Rattler's performance earned him the backup job outright.

Haener is still on his rookie contract, it's not over yet for him, but he squandered his best opportunity Sunday. While I do feel bad for him. Rattler has more upside and seems to be learning to adjust to the NFL game faster than Haener.

Rattler struggled in his 3 starts but it still looked like football. I didn't know if I was watching the Saints or Joe dirt movie that first half. It was like your kid very first karate tournament and everyone he fought been in it 15 years.

 

[boutte]

Because Rattler showed significantly more poise and playmaking ability early in those games with a patchwork offensive line than Haener did in the 1st half Sunday with our starting offensive line.

If you couldn't see how badly Haener was rattled and pressing, I don't know what to tell you...

If you can't see that he had about a second and a half to throw the and still get crushed every time they called a pass I don't know what to tell YOU. Nobody (including Rattler) could have succeeded in that situation.

 

[Pocket Hercules]

If you can't see that he had about a second and a half to throw the and still get crushed every time they called a pass I don't know what to tell YOU. Nobody (including Rattler) could have succeeded in that situation.

The line didn't pass protect any better in the 2nd half. It might have even been worse.

 

[SystemShock]

I saw it and I agree. It really wasn't fair to Haener. If you really think about it, he was the number 2. You would think he gets first dips as the starter once Carr was injured. Rattler started 3 games and struggled. Haener got the opportunity to start this game and was beached at half time. How is Rattler able to have 3 games and allowed to struggle but Haener only had 2 quarters? But Haener is the clean up man for all the games. This type of dynamics is unusual and unfair for both quarterbacks. And I do feel for Haener.

I can only speculate why Rattler started over Haener those 3 games (we don't know for sure); the first time Carr went down, the o-line was decimated and Rattler had shown more mobility and pocket awareness.

As for Haener being pulled at the half, the games Rattler started, Allen was the coach.
The last game, Rizzi was the coach.

 

[boutte]

The line didn't pass protect any better in the 2nd half. It might have even been worse.

You're wrong.

 

[tyler735]

If you can't see that he had about a second and a half to throw the and still get crushed every time they called a pass I don't know what to tell YOU. Nobody (including Rattler) could have succeeded in that situation.

I mean Haener's time to throw was like .3 of a second longer than Rattler in that game (it was something like 2.8 seconds to throw for Rattler and 3.1 seconds to throw for Haener), so I don't think that data supports your narrative. Spencer was also under consistent pressure and navigated out of pressure with subtle pocket movements and made plays throwing the ball rather than taking sacks. Jake Haener caused at least 2 of the 3 sacks by taking hilariously big drop backs on his play action attempts making it easy for the edge rusher to get to him. He was even getting called out for it by the announcers during the game.

 

[kcirdor]

we literally were gifted 6 points because the line sucked so bad Rattler was getting "roughed". Those same plays in the first half Haener dove under the ground. That is truly the difference b/w the QBs. One is scared, the other isn't.

 

[boutte]

I mean Haener's time to throw was like .3 of a second longer than Rattler in that game (it was something like 2.8 seconds to throw for Rattler and 3.1 seconds to throw for Haener), so I don't think that data supports your narrative. Spencer was also under consistent pressure and navigated out of pressure with subtle pocket movements and made plays throwing the ball rather than taking sacks. Jake Haener caused at least 2 of the 3 sacks by taking hilariously big drop backs on his play action attempts making it easy for the edge rusher to get to him. He was even getting called out for it by the announcers during the game.

Yeah, Rattler was the better QB. I'm not arguing that. I'm arguing that writing off a 2nd yr QB in his first start and had nothing to work with after a bad half game is idiotic.

 

[boutte]

Because Rattler showed significantly more poise and playmaking ability early in those games with a patchwork offensive line than Haener did in the 1st half Sunday with our starting offensive line.

If you couldn't see how badly Haener was rattled and pressing, I don't know what to tell you...

Our "starting O Line didn't any better than back-ups. They got a little better in the second half but not what you would call good or even mediocre.

 

[Pocket Hercules]

Our "starting O Line didn't any better than back-ups. They got a little better in the second half but not what you would call good or even mediocre.

They were definitely awful all game long, and slightly worse in the 2nd half if anything. But I take your point that they didn't play much (if any) better than the PS-level units we were throwing out there during Rattler's first three starts. Having said that, Rattler has definitively outplayed Haener this year, and should be starting when Carr can't go - period. Again, not writing Jake off for the future, but he's had his chances this year and didn't take advantage.

 

[jasonsw]

Exactly. This is pro football, not the church softball league. When it’s obvious you act on it, feelings be damned.

And a lot of people keep talking about it being “fair” for Haener to get his start since Ratter did. But I don’t think that NFL HCs or even players define “fair” the same way fans or kids at recess do.

It’s a cut throat, win now business and why starters lose jobs when injured, fan favorites get benched or traded when salary and production don’t align, and why camp beasts usually never do much more than play special teams.

It's amazing how people think Haener was treated unfairly on Sunday. Dude was playing like Ian Book.

I think many would of been upset if he wasn't removed after being ineffective

 

[DSnfla]

I'm always amazed how people can only look at the surface and don't take in the context of what happened. I'm not saying that Haener played well or that Rattler didn't play better and you make a QB change hoping for a spark. But lets really look at what happened. The OL play in the 1st half was bloody awful no matter that we had all the starters playing, in fact some of the OL that SR had in his starts played better. They played MUCH better in the 2nd half and that had nothing to do with QB play

I'll be the first to say yes Rattler played better than Haener and should start if Carr can't go.
Let's also look at some things. 3rd and 3, Haener throws a very good pass and Wilson makes a great catch for a 1st @ the Wash 40 and Patrick gets a highly debatable holding call and no 1st, then Penning can't handle a spin move and Ruiz let's his man inside JH tries to move up in the pocket and as no place to go and gets sacked, that's a 40yd swing.

2nd qtr at our own 32 2nd and 4 Haener throws a 20yd pass to MVS that goes right thru both his hands and he drops it, next play Haener throws a pick and the refs miss a facemask call. Also MVS dropped a 2nd Haener pass later in the 1st half.
Make no mistake, Haener could have and should have played better
I'll be the first to say yes Rattler played better than Haener and should start if Carr can't go.
Don't believe me? Even Rizzi mentioned those 2 plays and their impact on the 1st half in his presser.

Spencer Rattler played well. Let's take a look. He made a great pass in the 1st drive down the field while getting hit and low and behold MVS says I can catch this football unlike I did in the 1st half.

2nd drive 3-10 he gets sacked and they call Wash for a hands to the face and we get a drive sustaining 1st. Same drive ball @ the Wash 32 they call Wash for roughing the passer. Kendre Miller loses 6 and 2 passes in a row batted down and we settle for a FG

3rd drive, very good pass to Foster also aided by another roughing the QB call the ball goes from the 8 to the 45 almost a 30yd gain. He also had a short pass dropped by Miller. Then he had an INT dropped by #4. then a throw away and we kick a FG.

Last drive , we get the ball on our 44. Great running by Miller and some good passes by Rattler even though the refs missed and offsides AND a D holding. Great play calling by Klint Kubiak except for 1 too many run. Ran all the clock out so great time mgt. Rattler throws a good pass to get the TD.

In conclusion, yes JH could have played better. He also could have some help if the OL played like they did in the 2nd half they even run blocked way much better someone must have reamed them at halftime . Also not have a drive killing penalty that was suspect to kill the 1st drive and MVS catching a pass that was right in his hands that would have kept the drive alive more than likely the pick would not have happened. Those plays change the whole 1st half It would have kept Wash's offense off the field and would have generated points
SR played well but he had help that JH did not. MUCH better OL play both in the run and pass. He also had quite a few drive saving penalties help out and some luck that his pass was dropped by the Wash defender that was right in his hands . There is more than what you see on the surface if you take the time to look

 

[texasjefe]

19-0, Rattler.