Give Drew credit for admitting the deep throws have been missing. (1 Viewer)

tk421Saint

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Watch the Bears with Mitch Trubisky (previous) or Andy Dalton (now) for 5 minutes and you can understand very fast why dink and dunk will never land you in the top 10 of any team in the NFL. If you have a dink and dunk person that is not more accurate than an Olympic archer or a future HOFer, you are in trouble and looking for your next QB.
 

Bill

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Watch the Bears with Mitch Trubisky (previous) or Andy Dalton (now) for 5 minutes and you can understand very fast why dink and dunk will never land you in the top 10 of any team in the NFL. If you have a dink and dunk person that is not more accurate than an Olympic archer or a future HOFer, you are in trouble and looking for your next QB.
The 'new' style of NFL quarterbacking also seems to favor having a guy who can scramble and pick up first downs with his legs. But no one ever says, "If only Drew Brees had some wheels."
True, the position seems to be evolving in that direction, but obviously being able to hit that diaper from 20 yards was Drew's forte' and we were able to have a lot of success due to his accuracy, intelligence, and game management. Was it Brees' time to hang up the cleats? Most definitely. Was he the reason we couldn't get over the last few hurdles of the playoffs recently? I personally don't think so.

While I'm sad for Drew that he never was able to hoist another Lombardi, I'm glad that we had a good shot at it the number of times that we did. And I believe that Drew had something to do with our being in that mix. If Jameis can do the same as our quarterback, I will be equally happy for him and us! :9:
 

demented

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Being able to throw the deep ball and 'stretching the field' is certainly an important weapon for an offense to possess and display.
But let's not play down the valuable aspects of a 'dink & dunk' offense either. Throwing a bomb for a quick score does nothing to wear down an opposing defense nor does it run a lot of clock. True, a 10-15 play drive needs a lot of great execution by your offense in order to reach the goal of scoring points. But when a QB is as efficient at completing such long drives for points as Drew was, this style of offense basically sets up a team for success in the last quarter of a game simply due to expending the defense of the opponent; while at the same time giving yours a chance to stay fresh to the end.

I get it, the bombs are exciting and make for an impressive highlight reel after the game. I love them as well! But if these flashy long passes aren't connecting in a game (for whatever reason), it just becomes a quick series with no points... and possibly no 'W'.

It's all about scoring points. I totally agree that having the ability to launch 60+ yard rainbows can keep our opponents guessing, but 'ball control' is equally important in order to have a successful offense. On Sunday Jameis and his team showed the ability to do both as they romped over the Packers. But having the right balance on offense is still the key. We saw that demonstrated very well on the field in Jacksonville. I really want to see that good balance throughout the season! :9:

You can't execute ball control offense against a top 10 defense without being able to convincingly throw a deep ball. If the other team can squeeze down and in then your ability to dink and dunk goes away. I completely agree that dominating a team by controlling the ball is a much better tactic than scoring quick, but you still need to be able to go over the top or your scheme will fall apart. You can judge a teams respect for your outside game by charting the number of snaps they take in cover 2, 1, 0. If the other team is in cover 1 as their base then you're getting no respect.
 

Saintshizzle

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The 'new' style of NFL quarterbacking also seems to favor having a guy who can scramble and pick up first downs with his legs. But no one ever says, "If only Drew Brees had some wheels."
True, the position seems to be evolving in that direction, but obviously being able to hit that diaper from 20 yards was Drew's forte' and we were able to have a lot of success due to his accuracy, intelligence, and game management. Was it Brees' time to hang up the cleats? Most definitely. Was he the reason we couldn't get over the last few hurdles of the playoffs recently? I personally don't think so.

While I'm sad for Drew that he never was able to hoist another Lombardi, I'm glad that we had a good shot at it the number of times that we did. And I believe that Drew had something to do with our being in that mix. If Jameis can do the same as our quarterback, I will be equally happy for him and us! :9:
Good Post, but you are severely underplaying the need to stretch the field, even the threat of such.

But I hope even if Jameis wins us a couple of trophies, we learn from the hero worship and recognize when he has lost it, to the point that we cant finish the job. Let's not drag it out 3 extra years again.
 
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Brandon13

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We certainly weren't completely shut down because the bombs were rare.
I think our record bears that out. And regarding the postseason woes the last few years, there were a lot of other breakdowns leading to the losses that had nothing to do with Drew's lack of arm strength. Football is still a team game that requires everyone to execute their assignments properly in order to be successful.

I personally never viewed the Saints offense as being 'handcuffed' due to Drew. But obviously many fans did.
I can only imagine how many other teams wished to have the level of success we had with Brees the last 5 years or so. :scratch:
I think the general narrative that it was more consequential in the playoffs when playing against tougher defenses is correct. We had such little room for error in the playoffs with the dink and dunk stuff, with it we lacked the ability to keep the defenses honest and had little to no ability to "get it all back" in one pass play. It was an aspect missing from our offense and I do think it was a problem.
 

Bill

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You can't execute ball control offense against a top 10 defense without being able to convincingly throw a deep ball. If the other team can squeeze down and in then your ability to dink and dunk goes away. I completely agree that dominating a team by controlling the ball is a much better tactic than scoring quick, but you still need to be able to go over the top or your scheme will fall apart. You can judge a teams respect for your outside game by charting the number of snaps they take in cover 2, 1, 0. If the other team is in cover 1 as their base then you're getting no respect.
I agree that it was Drew's time to retire. The Covid year of 2020 was a sad ending to his career for more reasons than the playoff loss to the Bucs.
Starting the season Drew said that he felt better (physically) than he had in years. He convinced the coaching staff that he was ready to take the Saints deep into a playoff run. Things almost worked out as planned. We'll never know if we might have gotten the #1 Seed if Brees doesn't get busted up during the season and missed some games, nor do we know if benching him would have made for a more successful season.

I don't know how true the rumor is about how we could have suited up Tom Brady in the black & gold for 2020, but I do believe the Saints organization felt that we could get the job done with Drew at the helm and was happy that we were in position to do just that despite the setbacks to Drew and the offense.

Sean Payton once said that winning the Superbowl isn't easy and that a lot of things have to go right to accomplish that feat. With all of our issues (which all teams have every year) our team had a great run and came up a few plays short of getting to the NFC Championship game with another Superbowl on the line. We didn't get it done and Tampa Bay did. We can only hope that our new 'Jameis-led' offense will have better success and we will maintain the level of dominance we've enjoyed for most of Sean's tenure as our head coach. Personally I believe our success has as much to do with our staff as it does with our players. But I wouldn't have traded the thrill of having #9 in a Saints jersey for most of that time.

But like most folks here, I'm ready for the new start and hope that we will see many more successful seasons in the years ahead!
 
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Bill

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Good Post, but you are severely underplaying the need to stretch the field, even the threat of such.

But I hope even if Jameis wins us a couple of trophies, we learn from the hero worship and recognize when he has lost it, to the point that we cant finish the job. Let's not drag it out 3 extra years again.
Maybe (just maybe) if Cook didn't fumble away our realistic shot at beating the Bucs last January, the last 3 years wouldn't have seemed like such a "drag".
Somehow I think that Winston would admit that he did gain some valuable knowledge about learning the Saints playbook & running the Saints offense while he waited for his shot to start. And now that we are here, I've put the past behind and I'm right with you happy to see what the new kid on the block will do for us going forward. We all have reason to be excited about the future of our team. Our front office is still one of the best in the league and we will likely remain one of the top teams in the NFL for as long as they are calling the shots!
 

texasjefe

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Bombs away. Deep balls. Balls deep.

Gimme that old NFL Films slo-mo of a spiraling bomb in the air all day.
 

Booker

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The 2018 Dallas game seemed to create the template on how to stop "late career" Drew Brees. He was having an MVP quality season to that point, but had also noticeably become more conservative with his play. They got really grabby with the receivers within 20 yards and didn't worry about anything downfield, and it suffocated the offense.

The Rams were able to copy that game plan, and take the grabbyness to the next level later that year, and we've seen it in games we've struggled in since. Not every team had the personnel or coaching to do this -- it helped to have a fast linebacking crew that could help defend the underneath passing game (see Tampa in the playoffs last year) -- but in the playoffs you're going to run into these teams more often than in the regular season.
 

Bill

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Bombs away. Deep balls. Balls deep.

Gimme that old NFL Films slo-mo of a spiraling bomb in the air all day.
How fondly I remember those NFL films! :9:
 

CincyShoe

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Back to Back 15 play drives for TD's....(first time since 2000??? or so in the NFL) suggests JW executed a pretty good impression of Brees' Dunk and Dink Offense. Hope it continues.

But also the Deep Bomb to Harris to pile on was lovely as well.
 

Bill

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The 2018 Dallas game seemed to create the template on how to stop "late career" Drew Brees. He was having an MVP quality season to that point, but had also noticeably become more conservative with his play. They got really grabby with the receivers within 20 yards and didn't worry about anything downfield, and it suffocated the offense.

The Rams were able to copy that game plan, and take the grabbyness to the next level later that year, and we've seen it in games we've struggled in since. Not every team had the personnel or coaching to do this -- it helped to have a fast linebacking crew that could help defend the underneath passing game (see Tampa in the playoffs last year) -- but in the playoffs you're going to run into these teams more often than in the regular season.
Yep, it becomes harder for any team to beat an opponent who has 'figured you out'... or is able to get away with murder by the officials.
No argument there.
 

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Shizzle, Drew's play didn't lose the Vikings or the Rams. And the pressure on Drew because two years,(last year and the year before) in a row they used the bull rush up the middle on us and we couldn't stop it from collapsing the pocket, thus Drew had no chance to do anything. You can pretend you were right all this time. But the long ball doesn't really matter since we couldn't stop them when they put their ends rushing on our guards. Last year was the only year where the lack of arm strength actually came into play because he could barely move with half his ribs broken. Same with Taysom, Sean crafted a playbook that worked for him and we went 3 and 1, same for Teddy and he went 5-0.

Even with the long ball Sunday, our receivers could not get open. only 5 passes went to a Wide out.

I agree with some of this. I think against Minny, SP made a huge mistake not dialing up more runs, let our G's bully their DE's, instead of going all pass happy.....but, the reason Minny could do that is they had no fear of the deep ball and pressure up the middle has always been DB's kryptonite....
 

sfidc3

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He did the minimum against GB.

I honestly don't know how anyone could come to that conclusion about Jamies after the GB beatdown. Nobody knows what will happen going forward but if you don't feel good about Jamies performance against GB?

Disappointing to hear from another Saints fan....
 

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