Israel (now broader Mid East discussion) (11 Viewers)

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DaveXA said:
Well, all due respect, you're wrong. I'm no fan of Biden and this isn't a political statement, but his official position as late as January of this year was that Palestinians should return to all areas of Gaza. This was part of phase 1 of their cease-fire and hostage exchange deal.
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Wrong about what?

You do realize that official PR statements can and do differ from actions ALL the time.

If a US leader says they don’t agree with what Israel doing what they’re doing, yet they at the same time give them billions in weapons to keep doing it, those words come across pretty empty…
 
Heathen Saint said:
Wrong about what?

You do realize that official PR statements can and do differ from actions ALL the time.

If a US leader says they don’t agree with what Israel doing what they’re doing, yet they at the same time give them billions in weapons to keep doing it, those words come across pretty empty…
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I do realize that. I also do realize that Israel is still formally an ally, and until that changes, the US is going to support them regardless who our political leaders are. I feel terrible for those suffering, and most don't have a choice, but the leadership in both Gaza and Israel leaves a lot to be desired.

We've already been over all of this in the thread though. So not gonna rehash all of that. I think most Americans have zero interest in the US doing anything in Gaza, so that's ultimately going to be a loser issue for the President, as it should be. Gaza should belong to the Palestinians, and I do believe that had Biden remained, he would have tried to keep pressure on Bibi to allow the Palestinians to return. Trump clearly isn't going to do that.
 
DaveXA said:
I do realize that. I also do realize that Israel is still formally an ally, and until that changes, the US is going to support them regardless who our political leaders are. I feel terrible for those suffering, and most don't have a choice, but the leadership in both Gaza and Israel leaves a lot to be desired.
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Well, there's much here that I most definitely don't agree with.

But let's back up a few steps -- I feel you didn't really address my previous statement.

I'm not asking about what Biden's PR team put out. I'm not asking about who the US' strategic allies are.

If you recall, my original statement was that "Biden supplied the never ending funds for missiles and other munitions needed to help Israel complete their slaughter and razing of Gaza".

You stated that I am wrong.

So once more, I'm asking you how my statement above is wrong.

DaveXA said:
We've already been over all of this in the thread though. So not gonna rehash all of that. I think most Americans have zero interest in the US doing anything in Gaza, so that's ultimately going to be a loser issue for the President, as it should be.
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I think that most Americans have been conditioned to have to worry about making ends meet and surviving themselves, so they've become a bit indifferent to what poor middle eastern country we're bombing annually.

It may be a 'loser issue' for the president - but it's probably not going to have a very big impact on his numbers or support for reasons stated above. Especially considering there are more religious extremists who believe in bringing forth the 'restoration' supporting this president as compared to the former.


DaveXA said:
Gaza should belong to the Palestinians, and I do believe that had Biden remained, he would have tried to keep pressure on Bibi to allow the Palestinians to return. Trump clearly isn't going to do that.
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I appreciate that you're an engaged participant in these conversations, but I'd be lying if I didn't express how shocked hearing something like this makes me.

Someone contributing to the active destruction of not only all of one's homeland but the active slaughter of their citizens advocating later for the return of these citizens (to what....rubble?) is not noble in any shape, form, or way.

I don't buy for one minute that the previous president was some poor participant in something he had no control over. Not only is that narrative completely untrue, it's empirically the opposite. Which means he's 100% complicit. As is the trash heap that is now the current President.

It does not matter if we are allies. Being allies with a nation isn't a free pass for atrocity, or for apathy - despite what many here disturbingly seem to think.

It's like saying that if we were allies of Russia, their slaughter of Ukrainians is "sad, and we don't agree with it..but they are allies and supporting allies is nothing new".
 
DaveXA said:
To me, the problem with a lot of the posts showing the suffering of children is that it's couched in propaganda and heavily slanted reporting and that detracts from the suffering. Also, after seeing enough of those posts, people become desensitized to it.
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I'm still waiting on evidence of this claim, Dave.

If people become 'desensitized' and even worse - apathetic to seeing children killed, that says a lot more about them than it does the one bringing it to attention.
 
HoustonGold said:
No charges? Guess the NFL was afraid of a Freedom of Speech lawsuit? Kind of strange.

www.wwltv.com

Lifetime NFL ban but no criminal charges for performer who raised Gaza flag during Super Bowl halftime show

Roc Nation, the entertainment company which produced the halftime show, said the act “was neither planned nor part of the production and was never in any rehearsal.”
www.wwltv.com www.wwltv.com
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Why would there be charges though? What would they charge him with? I don't agree with what he did, but I don't think it warranted a response.
 

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