Rizzi today made another strong case to be the next HC. (merged) (10 Viewers)

[504gks]

Yeah that comparison is only because they both are loud and emotional. I've said this before. Campbell has had and enormous amount of help. If you look into it. They have had 19 top 100 draft picks in the last 5 yrs including a #2,#3,and a #7. That includes their own picks and the ones they got in the Stafford trade. And they got Goff in that trade. Campbel has 2 of thebest coordinators in the league. 1 he hired in Glenn and Johnson who was on the staff when he got there. He also has a great GM and scouting dept, in Holmes and Hudspeth, Lohman and Joseph.

I'm not saying Campbel is not a god coach, he does seem to be , but he had a LOT of help AND luck

we never would have made those trades

 

[504gks]

Going back to what you originally said:

“The Panthers from the last few weeks that are at least competitive.”

Maybe you meant something other than the way it comes across, but I’m pointing out that the Saints have also been competitive the last few weeks, and certainly if you’re using the Panthers as the barometer. Do you really not think the Saints have been competitive the last few weeks but the Panthers have?

Washington missed 3 60 yrd TD passes by inches-couldve been a blow out

 

[Snakehead]

Exactly, We got a glimpse of what KK could do with not the greatest talent on O. Look at the resurgence of AK. That's all do to KK's system. Look at how much Penning improved, that's all do to KK's system and Benton and Dennison , 2 coaches KK hired. He's had 7 starters miss 33 games on offense and that's before Taysom went down.

To me the biggest reason to try a yr or 2 with Rizzi is that he keeps the whole offensive staff. I'd rather not have all the offensive players have to go through learning 3 systems in 3 yrs

Agreed. People have such a short memory. Earlier this year we were cheering the KK hiring as one of the top OC candidates who knows the Shanahan/Kubiac system, been exposed to it in different places, had one of the best (his father) as a consultant and brought in some of the best offensive line/zone scheme coaches possible. The first two games were bonkers when we had all of the starters. Then the wheels fell off between injuries and DA's ineptness as a HC.

Insert Rizzi, a coach the players love. It's evident since he's been HC, but all anyone has to do is look back since he joined the team as STC/Asst HC, the players have always responded to him. KK's Week 1/2 offense fits Rizzi's personality and leadership style. If Rizzi is retained, most if not all of the offensive staff would probably be retained as him and ML would allow them to continue to build on what they have. Defense is TBD.

KK doesn't strike me as a HC, he seems more like a Coordinator. He's the type of OC a HC like Rizzi needs, someone who is going to stick and develop his system over time with experience and personnel upgrades. Rizzi would have to find the same type of DC, someone who is a Coordinator. Is that guy Woods? Who knows, does he want to install a new defense since he's running what's left of DA's defense right now? I'm not sure. Looking across the league, it is going back to more balanced with an emphasis on the running game. We have to get more physical. If we stay with Rizzi and KK on offense, the offense is going to be physical so a defense to match would make sense. We had an identity in the Brees/Payton Era and it was offense, we also had and identity in the Dome Patrol Era. If the FO wants to win the fanbase back, should embrace our past, merge it with the current/future. Bring back the Dome Patrol mindset on defense, the league is at a point where it will flourish. Allow KK to build a juggernaut physical offense to impose their will on the opponent and allow Rizzi to coach Rizzball which from what I see, he wants to be physical, explosive, aggressive and exiting while leveraging the 3rd part of the game, Special Teams.

 

[Snakehead]

Its true. The problem for the last 15 yrs is all the 7win seasons. Never get an obvious high pick. We never move back and get more picks

The Steelers have never had a losing season under Tomlin which means they never pick high. We don't have to pick high to build a team.

 

[DavidM]

Washington missed 3 60 yrd TD passes by inches-couldve been a blow out

Can make that case with every team at this point in the season. Every team is a few plays away from more wins or more losses.

 

[DavidM]

We played 2 win teams, Las Vegas doesnt think we are very good(14 pt dogs). I think they pickrd us as 7 win team before the season

We played the teams on the schedule and the results show that Rizzi has lifted the team from when Allen departed. That’s it. That’s the point. It’s not an argument to just anoint him the next head coach, it’s taking a moment to appreciate the job he’s done.

I don’t care about Vegas and odds.

 

[DaveXA]

They were keying on whoever was the RB and he still had a very good 2nd half. And they only got 6 points in the 2nd half and we were getting to Daniels. And Wash also scre#%ed the pooch in a couple games too.Sorry Momentum was way on our side. Our chances were better in OT

That's just like your opinion, which is fine. We just disagree.

 

[BoNcHiE]

Sunday was a mirage.

Not Spencer Rattler's play. That was real. But to say that game bolstered Rizzi to be HC is to ignore the three wide-open TD passes Jayden Daniels inexplicably missed and another missed FG. The defense was terrible on Sunday. Jayden Daniels started that game 18 for 20.

That was a blow-out that turned into a close game due to an incredible amount of luck...and we still lost. That kind of luck doesn't last, and it's something you have to take into account when analyzing Rizzi and his abilities to lead this team going forward.

Are kickers really going to keep kicking for like 35% against us? Will Rizzie get to play Jameis Winston and Drew Lock every few games? Are good QBs going to have multiple big misses every week to keep us in games? Can we make a mid-game QB switch every week to catch teams off guard?

You can't count on any of that stuff. All I care about is whether Rizzi is the right guy to rebuild the roster and coach up fresh talent. I'm not convinced at all.

 

[Infoman]

Okay...

Many of us didn't fall for that banana in the tail pipe...

 

[DavidM]

Sunday was a mirage.

Not Spencer Rattler's play. That was real. But to say that game bolstered Rizzi to be HC is to ignore the three wide-open TD passes Jayden Daniels inexplicably missed and another missed FG. The defense was terrible on Sunday. Jayden Daniels started that game 18 for 20.

That was a blow-out that turned into a close game due to an incredible amount of luck...and we still lost. That kind of luck doesn't last, and it's something you have to take into account when analyzing Rizzi and his abilities to lead this team going forward.

Are kickers really going to keep kicking for like 35% against us? Will Rizzie get to play Jameis Winston and Drew Lock every few games? Are good QBs going to have multiple big misses every week to keep us in games? Can we make a mid-game QB switch every week to catch teams off guard?

You can't count on any of that stuff. All I care about is whether Rizzi is the right guy to rebuild the roster and coach up fresh talent. I'm not convinced at all.

I agree that the game doesn’t boost Rizzi to heir apparent but I think there are some other considerations to take into account.

Rizzi inherited a decimated roster and he’s having to work with that.

The Saints had some miscues too Sunday, and a big part of winning games is overcoming your mistakes and capitalizing on your opponent’s mistakes. Sure, if the Commanders don’t miss on some deep shots, we’re having a different conversation. If Juwan doesn’t drop the 2 pt pass, we’re having a different conversation. If the offense didn’t have some early miscues, or if Kubiak attacks the Commanders differently early on, we’re having a different conversation. If Rizzi had gone with Rattler from the start, we’re having a different conversation. Everything that happens culminates into the flow of the game and outcome we’re left discussing.

To that last point, it’s fair to criticize Rizzi’s decision to start Haener but it’s the kind of personnel decision where some guesswork is involved. We can fault him for getting it wrong initially but then should appreciate that he made the move at halftime, especially for all the “keep doing what you’re doing” backlash that was heaped on Allen.

I haven’t seen enough to know if Rizzi is the right guy but then none of us really know if he is or isn’t. Back to something where a certain amount of guesswork is involved. I’ve bought into the hype about Ben Johnson and what he’s done with the Lions’ offense, but predicting successful head coaches is obviously difficult, no matter how confident any of us believe we are about the best direction to go. A lot of people didn’t feel good about Payton when he was hired; was it Martz or Kubiak (maybe both) who were popular candidates back then?

I hope the Saints have an open and earnest coaching search, and that top candidates are interested in the job. I do think Rizzi is doing what he can to make a case to be considered in that, which is all he can do.

 

[sfidc3]

Do what other stuff? Almost all of the successful HC were OC's or DC's before the took a HC position. I think the issue is that an OC can have 1 yr of being an OC and have success and he gets hired as a HC . Brady is a prime example. He had maybe the greatest college offense in history and he was CO OC at LSU and was not the primary play caller for 1 yr and he gets the Car OC job, He bombs there and goes to Buff as QB coach with maybe the best QB in the league. The OC get's fired and Brady gets promoted. He does well but he's got Allen for a QB. Now he's a hot HC prospect.

Did you ever stop and realize that there is a very good reason that the Bills picked Allen to work with the "maybe the best QB in the league"?

And he didn't bomb in Carolina, with that dysfunctional organization he never had a chance.....you also might want to stop and realize that they also promoted him to OC really quickly and seeing the results of that this year.....is because he is really, really good at what he does....we get him then the offensive side of the ball is set, questions become a) is he a leader of men b) can he attract a good DC on the other side of the ball....he's also only 35 so if he works out here as HC we could have him for a very long time.....

We played the teams on the schedule and the results show that Rizzi has lifted the team from when Allen departed. That’s it. That’s the point. It’s not an argument to just anoint him the next head coach, it’s taking a moment to appreciate the job he’s done.

I don’t care about Vegas and odds.

Well said, I find the criticism of Rizzi a little much. Driven by really unrealistic expectations of somehow making the playoffs it seems.....He's done just fine given the circumstances, at least enough to earn an interview....

The team may not be playing consistently well, but the effort is certainly there, to me that means the locker room is in much better shape since he took over....

 

[SirLoinSaint64]

I like Rizzi. He's just not NFL, difference making, Head Coach material.

 

[Booker]

Rizzi has no doubt been a breath of fresh air after two and half years of Dennis Allen, but I think it would be unwise to make another insular hire. I really think the team needs to look outside of itself for some fresh perspective.

 

[BBarnes]

Going back to what you originally said:

“The Panthers from the last few weeks that are at least competitive.”

Maybe you meant something other than the way it comes across, but I’m pointing out that the Saints have also been competitive the last few weeks, and certainly if you’re using the Panthers as the barometer. Do you really not think the Saints have been competitive the last few weeks but the Panthers have?

I never once said the Saints have not been competitive under Rizzi, you brought that up.

I said it's not that good of a comparison because we have played teams with a combined record of 29-39 while they have played a schedule WAYYYYY more difficult in that same time period. Being "COMPETITIVE" against a joke schedule that includes a descending Falcons team and 2 of the top 4 worst teams in the NFL is not something to flex about. The Panthers going from the laughing stock of the NFL this season to almost beating the Chiefs, Eagles, and Tampa in that same stretch is much more impressive.

However, you made a debate out of something completely off topic. Again, all I said in the original post was that if we continue doing what we have been doing "that is how ML likes to do it" then we are headed towards being the 4th place team in the division like the Panthers have been.

Let's just take a breath and accept that we can agree to disagree. I do think the Saints have been competitive under Rizzi it's just not as impressive as what the Panthers have done in that same stretch against much much much harder competition, I do think Rizzi has done what was asked of him, I do think the Saints should hire outside the organization and get some new life and thoughts in the building. My thoughts may not be right at all, I am aware of that as well.

 

[DaveXA]

I never once said the Saints have not been competitive under Rizzi, you brought that up.

I said it's not that good of a comparison because we have played teams with a combined record of 29-39 while they have played a schedule WAYYYYY more difficult in that same time period. Being "COMPETITIVE" against a joke schedule that includes a descending Falcons team and 2 of the top 4 worst teams in the NFL is not something to flex about. The Panthers going from the laughing stock of the NFL this season to almost beating the Chiefs, Eagles, and Tampa in that same stretch is much more impressive.

However, you made a debate out of something completely off topic. Again, all I said in the original post was that if we continue doing what we have been doing "that is how ML likes to do it" then we are headed towards being the 4th place team in the division like the Panthers have been.

Let's just take a breath and accept that we can agree to disagree. I do think the Saints have been competitive under Rizzi it's just not as impressive as what the Panthers have done in that same stretch against much much much harder competition, I do think Rizzi has done what was asked of him, I do think the Saints should hire outside the organization and get some new life and thoughts in the building. My thoughts may not be right at all, I am aware of that as well.

I would just add this, the 2 losses he has were close games against the Commanders and Rams. It's clear the Rams are playing at a very high level since getting their playmakers back. Saints held them scoreless in the first half. Maybe that was a bit of a fluke, but being competitive in every single game has to be worth acknowledging at least.

I don't know that it's enough to earn an interview for the permanent HC position, but it seems prudent to at least give it some consideration.