Saints are really lacking talent (38 Viewers)

[la. champ1]

Can’t whiff on as many drafts as we have whiffed on and expect everything to be all fine and dandy, especially once the few good guys you did draft (or acquired in free agency) are injured. A very toxic combo led us here, and it has been magnified by poor leadership.

This is just unacceptable, and it’s time to take a look at our scouting department in addition to our coaching. The whole house is a mess.

Man that’s a lot of misses.

 

[dvdman]

The unproductive draft picks make those injuries even more critical.

With all due respect your back-ups are never on the same level as your starters. You can only survive so many starters being out before it takes its toll on your play. The Saints have easily exceeded that now. Look I’m not defending their poor execution and the numerous mistakes but only stating the obvious. The Saints team prior to the McCoy injury and the others the followed was pretty darn good. You can’t just always plug in so many key players and expect not to see a serious decline in play,

 

[Bill]

A healthy 22 I think can hang in there with anyone in the league.

Beyond that it’s night and day.

With a roster full of healthy starters it's possible that we could have competed with anyone in the league. Not that we would have won every game, but we would have had a good chance to come out victorious in every one of them. Of course no team gets through their schedule without some key players getting hurt. Some for a game; some for multiple games; and some for the season. With each new missing player, the ability to perform at your peak is reduced. With each additional starter lost to injury, the less likely you are to beat the opponent you are facing.

'Next Man Up!' IS A LIE!!! There is no way the backup player sitting on the bench will be as good as the starter who got injured. If he was just as good, he would be starting for you or for someone else. I'm not sure what Saints fans are thinking when they claim/assume that it shouldn't matter who or how many are missing from the starting lineup in regard to being able to win football games.

Hey, I'm as aggravated as anyone about this never-ending parade of sidelined and IR'd starters that seems to happen to a crippling degree year in and year out. But it only gets more frustrating when people say that the performance should be the same because "every team has injuries" and "those teams" still stay in the hunt. I personally feel that 'Who' you lose to injuries can be as critical as 'How many' you lose to injuries. And we have certainly lost some players who would rank very high in the 'Importance to the Team' category.

Yes, it's probably time for Allen (and possibly others) to hit the bricks. But at the same time I can't help but wonder what the season would be looking like right now if the avalanche of injuries had not begun in earnest in Week 3. We could possibly be in the same death spiral even without the loss of so many important starters on our roster. Or maybe not. All I know is that after the dominating victory over Dallas in Week 2, it was hard to find a thread about firing anybody within the Saints organization. Losing generally equals chaos. And chaos knows no reason.

 

[Saint-CJ]

Lacking talent or talent development? I haven’t read all the replies but coaches need to develop picks

 

[Infoman]

This team drafts profiles, prototypes, and projects…. It’s been mainly that way since Sean left. They don’t draft what they see on tape as pure football players very often. They also value where they picked the player, loyalty to the player, and money invested in the player…. Over what the player actually brings to the field right now.

It’s a big reason we got to this point…

 

[SirLoinSaint64]

Impact from the DL. Speed at LB. Safety play has been bad. Howden has not progressed from last year. CB's are not good tacklers. Olave and Shaheed are supremely talented but not NFL durable. Kamara has absolutely no help at RB. The TE's have the ability to move the chains but are not utilized properly. Hergel can not be worse than Saldiveri.. Give the young man a chance.

 

[meily]

Impact from the DL. Speed at LB. Safety play has been bad. Howden has not progressed from last year. CB's are not good tacklers. Olave and Shaheed are supremely talented but not NFL durable. Kamara has absolutely no help at RB. The TE's have the ability to move the chains but are not utilized properly. Hergel can not be worse than Saldiveri.. Give the young man a chance.

We have an impact player at every level of the defense but we have no real depth is one or more of those players go down, we need another draft and FA to add to the depth of this team.

 

[AARPSaint]

We have an impact player at every level of the defense but we have no real depth is one or more of those players go down, we need another draft and FA to add to the depth of this team.

Jordan, Davis, and Mathieu. All three levels of the defense. The DL has actually remained pretty healthy SO FAR. All three starting LBs have missed games. The safeties have missed time, and Harris is on IR. Depth can only extend so far.

 

[saintsmarchin]

Cam had a long career it's time to hang it up and that's no knock on the guy.. he was a legit beast for us for years but it's time

Chase Young is as advertised everything but a motor. Congrats on the Lambo frame.

Granderson has a lot of heart, wish you could combine him and chase into one player

DTs are pretty solid

Pete is good but injured

Lattimore looks worn out all the effort he's put in with no payoff

Alontae is pretty good
Kool-aid is still finding his way

Adebo regressed to Fred Thomas

Safeties are good when healthy but Mathieu is soon to hang it up.

Oline is young.. takes 3 to 4 years of playing together to really be great, just the truth.. interior is depleted with injuries.

Carr is not a good Xs and Os QB. He's not a tactician.. he's not a pre-snap QB. He doesn't beat blitzs.. he spends to much time looking down field and not taking what the defense gives him. This style of offense was perfect for him until injuries. If no one believes you can run, then play action is trash.

Spencer has all the gifts to be a modern day qb. Just doesn't have experience..hes going to expect more out of players when he becomes a leader... he wants greatness.. he has great pocket awareness.. but as you witnessed Sunday.. hes got little experience and the problem is.. he isn't on any page with other WRs except Bub and Juwan.

In my honest opinion Rattler is the future of this organization and that's perfectly fine with me.

Haener jury is still out.. while I don't see him being great, I don't see him being bad either

Kamara we wasted so many of his good years and expect him to be Adrian Peterson prime, on every play. His body isn't well off now.

We don't have a true #1

To put it to all your attentions our WR core is like this
Shaheed is Devery Henderson
Olave is Stills
Then there's everyone else

TE Waiting on Holkier to develop he is diamond in the rough potential

Juwan is great, doesn't get the ball enough.

Moreau is good for 1 or 2 plays

Taysom Hill just wish he hadn't gotten injured. Possibly would only be a 2 loss team right now.

Klint is an amazing OC if he can run his offense, if the players aren't there he isn't like SP and can adjust the team to their strengths.

DA is a DC and will never be HC material. He comes in with a game plan and does not stray from it.

Zone has cost us so many big plays this year.

 

[No2DC]

Jordan, Davis, and Mathieu. All three levels of the defense. The DL has actually remained pretty healthy SO FAR. All three starting LBs have missed games. The safeties have missed time, and Harris is on IR. Depth can only extend so far.

All three of these guys are past their prime. Latt is the only all-pro caliber guy we have, and he only has a few good years left. I think the secondary is probably our deepest position group, though.

 

[WhoDat?DrewDat]

DTs are pretty solid

Agree with most of what you've said but this. IMO our iDL has been awful. Bresee in particular has been very disappointing for me this year. He currently ranks near the bottom in the NFL in pass rush win rate.

Most if not all of his sacks have been coverage/hustle sacks. He's also been just awful against the run.

PFF has him as the 176/191 iDL with a god awful 37.9 grade. YIKES.

 

[NatureBoy]

The Saints lacked talent with Payton but he was so good that it didn't appear that way.....

Yet his last seasons here yielded about the same record. Does it really matter how you "don't" make the playoffs?

 

[NatureBoy]

I started a thread about the offense that didn't get any traction. Anyway, I'll paste the info below.

After Olave went out, this was the team that was "expected" to control the ball and keep our defense (with a handful of older starters) rested.

WR: Bub Means - 2024 5th round pick

LT: Taliese Fuaga – 2024 1st round pick

LG: Landon Young – 2021 6th round pick

C: Connor McGovern – Former 2019 3rd round pick, 2024 practice squad purge from Jets

RG: Lucas Patrick – Former 2016 UDFA, 2024 low cost free agent signing

RT: Trevor Penning – 2022 1st round pick

TE: Juwan Johnson – 2020 UDFA

WR: Rashid Shaheed – 2022 UDFA

QB: Spencer Rattler – 2024 5th round pick

RB: Alvin Kamara – 2017 3rd round pick

FB: Adam Prentice – Former 2020 UDFA, 2021 waiver claim

I think many expectations were unreasonable. No excuses, facts. We have depth issues.

Notes: Fuaga may be the best player on this list, but he's a rookie. Penning was expected to bust, but now is considered a key part of the line who lacks reps. Rashid is a big play guy, I love him, but I see him as a big play #3 more than a 2. Alvin needs blocking, just like the passing game.

Missing: Carr, McCoy, Ruiz, Olave, Taysom. Add Shaheed to next week's missing list.

We shouldn't expect much.

 

[solarbear88]

Pretty much the title.

Yes we are injured but if you look at this roster from a non biased POV you'll notice we just lack the top end talent to compete.

We have maybe 4 "good" players? 2 being Pro Bowl level?

Not enough to compete week in and week out.

Yeah, to keep my expectations in line I like to just go through the team and give each position group a rating. Most positions groups on this the team are a C; D or worse if you also consider depth and injury history. The only group that really scores above would be CB, but with no pass rush or run defense CB don't win games.