The ridiculous violence in N.O. (3 Viewers)

[SaintBrad]

Im all up for making parent a responsible. Whoevers parents of that 13 year old are, need to go to jail, for being awful parents. Furthermore, the law needs to back off on telling people how to raise their children. Children learn at a very early age that the parents can't physically stop you or punish you. Its sounds greay and all, but when your son is 10, knowing you cant whoop him good to get set him straight from fear/respect while being surrounded by bad apples who instigate trouble, often enough peer pressure wins over.

 

[bornnraisedwhodat]

It's hard to argue poverty when kids from middle class families are doing this too. I think poverty is only a peripheral issue. The causes are complex and varies from person to person.

I think a lack of morality, low value of life and a loss of identity due to the breakdown of family support has as much to do with what's happening than financial circumstances.

This right here. The value of life is almost non existent. I cant figure out the route cause.

This goes beyond poverty. I grew up fairly poor, not dirt poor, but fairly poor. A lot of my friends were poor also, but every household varied.

Some of the poor families I know were still rock solid citizens, kids did well in school, parents instilled morals and values, etc.

Other families were is disarray, dad gone, mama hitting the club scene every night, dog cussing the kids everyday treating them like dirt. I remember a friend of mine always used to say he wished he could live with us. I always think about that and wonder what his life became of (havent seen him in 2 decades).


But I do think it starts with parenting. The problem is we are seing the 2nd and 3rd generations from the crack era. The crack babies and families who suffered though it, are not parents, shoot even grand parents.

Crack was one of the worst things to happen to America. It's still having a great affect on society even though it's usage is way way way down. The damage has been done.

And, as you said, good old family and moral values are gone. I see kids talk back to their parents, dog cuss teachers, curse in front of adults in public. They just dont care.

 

[krushing]

And we wonder why police get rough and start stopping the wrong folks sometimes. What a mess!!. The cops are damned if they do and damned if they don't. When 13-16 year olds are killing folks and armed to the teeth, law enforcement officers are in a lose-lose situation. If folks in these rough neighborhoods want help, they are going to have to willing give up a few "civil liberties" until the violence can be curbed. It's a horrible situation for the innocent who are stuck there. Police could profile me, pull me over everyday and question me if I lived there, if I thought it would help get these killers off the streets.

 

[bornnraisedwhodat]

no it is certainly not an excuse but there is a difference between giving an excuse and identifying the root of the problem. I think there is a mindset in a lot of our poverty stricken areas that you get out in one of three ways: Sports, Music or Crime. You don't make it in the first two unless you are elite. There is a another way but I don't think it is always visible to theses kids.

Bornraised, this has been eating at me too so I am glad you posted. It is very sad about your nephew but if he was surrounded by positive influence and still went bad, then he is the exception not the rule. There will always be exceptions I'm afraid.

Yeah, I think my cousin was just bad. I think he was a sociopath. Didnt seem to have it all there. The scary thing is I am seeing a lot of kids with those same characteristics. "Dead eyes"

As far your post above. Some of that is true. Many feel trapped and feel the only way to get it is to take it by any means.

But the trip part about it is MANY OF THEM DONT WANT TO ESCAPE. They dont want to leave the hood. They think this is life. They truly believe this is how life is supposed to go. So many kids I talk to talk about jail as if its a right of passage. Death is amost a guarantee so they figure enjoy life while they can. It's a real real screwed up way of thinking that has surpassed pure socio-economics.




As far as how to fix it? I just dont know. Holding parents responsible is a big part of it, but how do you tackle that? There are bad parents everywhere. Education is a big part too, but some of these kids just simply dont care about school, and just make it hard for the other kids. Some parents are even scared of thier kids. (My cousin actually pulled a gun out on his father, sad). And you can go the Police State route, have police on every block, but I am not a fan of that situation. It's still violence. Your still imprisoned in your home, and Im not inclined to believe the policement are immune to the same sociopathis tendencies that the thugs in the street are too. And a police state doesnt fix the root of the problem.

Maybe, eventually the bad will eliminate themselves. Unfortunetly in the process innocent lives like little 5 year old Brianna die.

 

[krushing]

I was listening to WWL this morning on my way to work and the host made the comment that yes, we need a long term solution, but we can't wait 15-20yrs for a long term solution to work. We need change today. What can be done today? I totally agree with him.

I think the thing people ignore about the long term solution of education is that the current drug dealers and thugs will also be working on the youth for the next 25 years also. You have to get this folks off the streets and away from the kids as you provide alternatives. Make these areas like militarized zones for a couple years and the thugs will leave and disburse. Increase education and recreation for decent folks at the same time. It's going to take a massive effort. education alone "ain't going get it done. People's in those neighborhoods are going to have to welcome and work with police and they are going to have to accept extreme measures and a few police incidedents as they clear this mess up. Or they can just keep killing each other and blaming everyone else for their problems.

 

[CHI-TOWNSAINT]

Never thought I'd say this, but if I had the chance to leave NO, I would. I have a daughter turning three next month and I worry for her all the time when thinking of the future here(NO).

 

[iron error]

Its just mind boggling to me when you see 5 years olds who are as sweet as can be and realize that in a few years they (many, not all) will be on the way to an lifestyle lacking in morality. The only reality that you can assume at this point is that for various reasons they are being exposed to immoral acts that are taking away their innocence.

 

[iron error]

Yeah, I think my cousin was just bad. I think he was a sociopath. Didnt seem to have it all there. The scary thing is I am seeing a lot of kids with those same characteristics. "Dead eyes".

Unfortunately there are those few that would go bad regardless of what country or continent or era of history they live in.

The concern for New Orleans is it is environmental...family and community and societal norms exacerbated by technology and access.

 

[bornnraisedwhodat]

Never thought I'd say this, but if I had the chance to leave NO, I would. I have a daughter turning three next month and I worry for her all the time when thinking of the future here(NO).

Cant blame ya for it.

I love N.O. I moved because of my job, not crime or anything like that. I would love to move back but I would def have to make a lot more money due to the quality of life drop off.

And I dont have kids, so I can only imagine.


That sad part is if you took away the crime, N.O. would be top notch, untouchable. So many productive people would return and make the city even greater.

 

[DaveXA]

ok, I won't argue about the flexibility of morals and lets say I agree that the bold portion of your post is indeed the root of the problem, I will still counter that if you concentrate limited resources toward fixing these things in poverty areas before middle class areas, you will see results far faster. My point is, there may not be a rule set in stone about the relationship between the things you identify and poverty, but there paths run parallel enough that it certainly cannot be ignored.

I'm not saying poverty has no bearing at all, it's just not a root cause IMO. There are tons of examples of people who are happy in spite of their poverty. It's a difficult life sometimes, but so is life in any other financial situation. I've experienced the good, the bad and the ugly and that never determined my outlook on life.

I do think a lack of education has more to do with the loss of our kids to crime than poverty, and some of that lack of education can be linked to bad schools in poor areas. I lived in Washington DC for a short time and my kids were in a public school there and the school was terrible. I can see why kids in the inner cities of our country suffer from neglect. Thing is, the school had all of the equipment and facilities necessary, but the many of teachers were awful and didn't give the kids any homework. We were teaching our kids more than they were learning in school, which in some ways isn't all bad. I'd rather them learn from us anyway.

I consider us fortunate that they are now in schools where the teachers are more proactive for the most part.

I'll say this much. The causes of crime are varied and often complex. People are not all wired the same and will sometimes be bad regardless of upbringing. Others will be bad if they are neglected. Still others will be bad if they are spoiled. There's no single culprit and there is no silver bullet.

The best way to fight crime IMO is for whole communities to commit to caring and valuing their youth by getting involved in community service. One person or family can't do it alone.

 

[Swampy Saint]

I'd be OK with a police officer on my corner.

me too

 

[antipop]

Im all up for making parent a responsible. Whoevers parents of that 13 year old are, need to go to jail, for being awful parents. Furthermore, the law needs to back off on telling people how to raise their children.

you want the law to stop telling people how to raise their children and then punish them if they do it wrong??

and i have not received the pamphlet from the government on how to raise my son....it's been 9 years, should i be concerned??

 

[Swampy Saint]

Never thought I'd say this, but if I had the chance to leave NO, I would. I have a daughter turning three next month and I worry for her all the time when thinking of the future here(NO).

Since I've been reading your posts, I've always assumed you lived in Chicago.

I get your point though. I live in B.R. now and the crime is out of control here too. Murder in broad daylight, murder everyday and getting closer and closer to our neighborhood. The for sale signs are everywhere around us.

I regularly second guess my decision about moving back here. I kinda wish I would have bought a place in the boonies.

 

[lades]

The violence is why my wife and I left 12 years ago. We both will always consider New Orleans home and would move back tomorrow if the crime and violence was reasonable, but that will never happen. So we live in a beautiful and peaceful place up in the mountains of North Carolina where crime is almost nonexistent and people have no concept of real violence, and visit New Orleans whenever we can.

 

[DaveXA]

The violence is why my wife and I left 12 years ago. We both will always consider New Orleans home and would move back tomorrow if the crime and violence was reasonable, but that will never happen. So we live in a beautiful and peaceful place up in the mountains of North Carolina where crime is almost nonexistent and people have no concept of real violence, and visit New Orleans whenever we can.

Therein lies the rub. If people just give up and leave, it exacerbates an already bad situation. When you add up all the people doing what you did, it's no wonder things are getting worse. People want to leave cuz the crime is so bad, but would stay if it were better, but leaving only makes things worse.

There's no good solution without people committing to the city and stay to make a difference.

It's a tough Catch-22 situation. I understand you and others leaving, but I see the downside of giving up on the city too. What to do? I think the lack of leadership and integrity in the government and police of the city makes it that much harder. The citizens of the city needs to hold their leaders accountable.