Underhill on Payton (1 Viewer)

[60minutes]

Wait, what?

Ian and Underhill’s reports were very different. As you said, one was way more sensationalist than the other.

We don’t know for certain if Ian’s report is wrong yet, but at this point in time, it is most certainly sensationalist/clickbait.

“Ian is not a bad reporter…he is just someone who jumps the gun…with a tad more sensationalism.” is also a pretty generous description of him.

That “reporter” has literally been reporting that Payton was leaving since 2015 (multiple reports across multiple years).

The point I am making is that the information, at its core, is the same. There has been complete silence coming from Payton and no one knows exactly what that means. And as I said before, it is not just the media. There are other people Sean is normally in contact with who do not know. I certainly agree that the delivery between Nick and Ian is different, thus the reference to the sensationalism on the part of the latter.

But even Nick admitted he thought about writing an article about what was going on prior to today and resisted because he understands what happens when you put pen to paper. Once you write that story, you are kind of making a statement even if you are not trying to make a statement. If I came here and said, Sean has not met with coaches as he does right after the season ends or that he has gone radio silent, it could open a can of worms. So, sometimes, you just sit and wait. Nick has restraint. Ian does and this is why I said he jumps the gun. But his reporting, at least in this specific case, is not wrong.

And I stand by my statement that Nick would say that Ian is not a bad reporter. Or rather he would defend Ian, surprising as that might sound.

 

[60minutes]

Jumping the gun without the facts and reporting a story just to get click bait is the very definition of a bad reporter.

I guess I misinterpreted your post.

"Jumping the gun," at least in this instance, does not mean that he does not have facts. Again, Nick has stated that he almost wrote an article about the fact that no one knows what Sean is doing. And he was not the only local reporter who debated on whether or not to address it. Heck, there was one instance in which I almost stated something similarly a week or so ago. Ian does not sit on anything because his job is to break big stories. Nick has a long-term view of things and shows more restraint as do some of the other reporters. Plus, they understand how New Orleans Saints fans will feel such a story in a away that someone like Ian does not care about or has to care about as the love/loyalties do not exist.

The strange thing is, I am not even a big fan of Ian. I do not dislike the guy but I do not consider him a friend or anything. But in this case, he is not making this story up. Maybe when you cry wolf, people always think that is always the case (although in many instances, it is more of that tendency to run with information that gets him and others in situations where the story is either misleading or wrong). But truth be told, there are people who have wondered about what Sean is doing and it is not just those in the media who speculate each year about what he is doing. Sean was exhausted last season. I find it remarkable how much he was able to get the team to focus through every challenge and setback, especially in the final weeks. I even wondered if he would mail it in but the sense was they felt like they could stay make a run in the playoffs if they could get in. He never stopped coaching, but after a long season there was almost a relief--not of being happy the season had ended but just that change to recharge. There is a normal course of action that occurs at the end of each season. This year, Sean diverted from the normal routine. Sean decided to go on vacation to "get away." Those things didn't necessarily raise eyebrows but just how silent he has been. And I know "silent" here feels a bit ambiguous, which is why I likened it in another thread to two years ago when no one knew what Drew would do because he just took time away to reflect. In fact, many assumed he would retire. Ultimately, he came back. It is very likely that Sean comes back. To be sure, the national media loves this story because it elicits a certain kind of attention. And some will speculate -- they will go beyond the reality is people not knowing what Sean will do -- to suggest that he wants to coach elsewhere or this or that. The broadcast interest in him is real but this is not the first year that interest has been there. He is not coaching another team this year other than the Saints. He is or was just a man tired and, really and truly, you have to think about the last three or four seasons of heartbreak and then with the craziness of this season. I wish Ian had not chosen to write about it (if only for the speculation it causes) but I can also say Sean is smart and, to some degree, doesn't mind having his name constantly swirl. There are indications that he will be back, that things should pick up with meetings and certain off-season preparations, and this will be forgotten as attention turns toward getting this team ready for next season.

 

[Loco Hornet Fan]

The point I am making is that the information, at its core, is the same. There has been complete silence coming from Payton and no one knows exactly what that means. And as I said before, it is not just the media. There are other people Sean is normally in contact with who do not know. I certainly agree that the delivery between Nick and Ian is different, thus the reference to the sensationalism on the part of the latter.

But even Nick admitted he thought about writing an article about what was going on prior to today and resisted because he understands what happens when you put pen to paper. Once you write that story, you are kind of making a statement even if you are not trying to make a statement. If I came here and said, Sean has not met with coaches as he does right after the season ends or that he has gone radio silent, it could open a can of worms. So, sometimes, you just sit and wait. Nick has restraint. Ian does and this is why I said he jumps the gun. But his reporting, at least in this specific case, is not wrong.

And I stand by my statement that Nick would say that Ian is not a bad reporter. Or rather he would defend Ian, surprising as that might sound.

I mean, Ian has “reported” this AT LEAST 4 times since 2015. At what point do we finally say casually “jumping the gun” crosses the line into bad reporting? We seriously haven’t gotten there by now?

Maybe he’s right this time, but I think he’s way past getting the benefit of the doubt.

And has Underhill actually ever defended Rapoport, or is that just speculation? I haven’t seen Underhill do that, but I could be wrong.

 

[StudioSaint]

"Jumping the gun," at least in this instance, does not mean that he does not have facts. Again, Nick has stated that he almost wrote an article about the fact that no one knows what Sean is doing. And he was not the only local reporter who debated on whether or not to address it. Heck, there was one instance in which I almost stated something similarly a week or so ago. Ian does not sit on anything because his job is to break big stories. Nick has a long-term view of things and shows more restraint as do some of the other reporters. Plus, they understand how New Orleans Saints fans will feel such a story in a away that someone like Ian does not care about or has to care about as the love/loyalties do not exist.

The strange thing is, I am not even a big fan of Ian. I do not dislike the guy but I do not consider him a friend or anything. But in this case, he is not making this story up. Maybe when you cry wolf, people always think that is always the case (although in many instances, it is more of that tendency to run with information that gets him and others in situations where the story is either misleading or wrong). But truth be told, there are people who have wondered about what Sean is doing and it is not just those in the media who speculate each year about what he is doing. Sean was exhausted last season. I find it remarkable how much he was able to get the team to focus through every challenge and setback, especially in the final weeks. I even wondered if he would mail it in but the sense was they felt like they could stay make a run in the playoffs if they could get in. He never stopped coaching, but after a long season there was almost a relief--not of being happy the season had ended but just that change to recharge. There is a normal course of action that occurs at the end of each season. This year, Sean diverted from the normal routine. Sean decided to go on vacation to "get away." Those things didn't necessarily raise eyebrows but just how silent he has been. And I know "silent" here feels a bit ambiguous, which is why I likened it in another thread to two years ago when no one knew what Drew would do because he just took time away to reflect. In fact, many assumed he would retire. Ultimately, he came back. It is very likely that Sean comes back. To be sure, the national media loves this story because it elicits a certain kind of attention. And some will speculate -- they will go beyond the reality is people not knowing what Sean will do -- to suggest that he wants to coach elsewhere or this or that. The broadcast interest in him is real but this is not the first year that interest has been there. He is not coaching another team this year other than the Saints. He is or was just a man tired and, really and truly, you have to think about the last three or four seasons of heartbreak and then with the craziness of this season. I wish Ian had not chosen to write about it (if only for the speculation it causes) but I can also say Sean is smart and, to some degree, doesn't mind having his name constantly swirl. There are indications that he will be back, that things should pick up with meetings and certain off-season preparations, and this will be forgotten as attention turns toward getting this team ready for next season.

With as much time and energy as you're putting into defending Rapoport, me thinks Rapoport has been your inside source all this time. It makes sense, since you have claimed to have information about other teams that someone inside the Saints organization wouldn't necessarily have.

Also, Ian doesn't seem as concerned about his reputation as a reporter as you seem to be.

 

[Poison]

With as much time and energy as you're putting into defending Rapoport, me thinks Rapoport has been your inside source all this time. It makes sense, since you have claimed to have information about other teams that someone inside the Saints organization wouldn't necessarily have.

Also, Ian doesn't seem as concerned about his reputation as a reporter as you seem to be.

60minutes has been on this forum for a long time and has consistently been a source of reliable information when it comes to the team. Whether in this instance you like the content of that information (I don't; I want Payton to see out his contract and hope that he ultimately will), it doesn't diminish the fact that as at today's date there are some legitimate questions being asked about his future in the league on the basis of seemingly credible information that has now been reported by several media outlets.

 

[TomThomster7]

This was a hellish season on everyone, including the fans. You can't help but think there is also aggravation from how his team is treated by the league office. That would wear down anyone, it is constantly double standards when it comes to the Saints. Covid ruined a game and now the NFL seems to not care about covid come playoff time. That is incredibly upsetting IMO.

But this is nothing but rambling from a nutty conspiracy theorist.

 

[Saint Jack]

I’m not doubting that we’re near the end of Payton’s career. He’s been in the League for 16 years and you’re starting to have to go back to the 60s and 70s to see someone with the same longevity with one team (besides Belechick).
I have a hard time believing he’ll leave town this soon without any notice.

 

[60minutes]

I mean, Ian has “reported” this AT LEAST 4 times since 2015. At what point do we finally say casually “jumping the gun” crosses the line into bad reporting? We seriously haven’t gotten there by now?

Maybe he’s right this time, but I think he’s way past getting the benefit of the doubt.

And has Underhill actually ever defended Rapoport, or is that just speculation? I haven’t seen Underhill do that, but I could be wrong.

4 times = 3 in a 1 week period - Dec. 27, 2015 and Jan. 3/4 2016 PLUS yesterday’s report. So, in essence, you have two reports—the first at the end of 2015/beginning of 2016 when speculation was rampant across league that Payton was leaving (Niners and Dolphins were big two with Giants also *reportedly* interested) until he announced on Jan. 6 2016 that he was going to be here as long as the team would have him. And the other is this latest report. It is not as if there are 4 reports spread over 4 different seasons. Now honestly, “committed” is not necessarily the word I would use because I think it is a bit charged, and I have repeatedly said Ian’s reporting can be sensationalistic. But yesterday’s report is not inaccurate.

As for Nick defending Ian, I said he “would” defend him and I said it for a reason.

With as much time and energy as you're putting into defending Rapoport, me thinks Rapoport has been your inside source all this time. It makes sense, since you have claimed to have information about other teams that someone inside the Saints organization wouldn't necessarily have.

Also, Ian doesn't seem as concerned about his reputation as a reporter as you seem to be.

I put time and energy into almost every post. Always have. Just my nature to explain things in detail. But a few things:

1. Ian is not and never has been my source.
2. I do not work inside the Saints organization although it wouldn’t be hard for someone in one organization to have insider info on another. A lot of these individuals are friends and/or former colleagues/employees of one another/other teams so they are able to get info. For example, Jeff Ireland was able to tap his former sources with Miami to get intel on Brian Flores. In addition, a lot of these teams hire each other’s family—so Ted Philips’s son works for the Saints and Mickey Loomis’s daughter ironically does marketing for the Bears.
3. I am not concerned with Ian’s rep. When he has been wrong, I’ve said so. This is an instance where he is not even if I don’t care for the story being written and his delivery.

60minutes has been on this forum for a long time and has consistently been a source of reliable information when it comes to the team. Whether in this instance you like the content of that information (I don't; I want Payton to see out his contract and hope that he ultimately will), it doesn't diminish the fact that as at today's date there are some legitimate questions being asked about his future in the league on the basis of seemingly credible information that has now been reported by several media outlets.

Thanks. I appreciate it. Thing is, I’m not upset because I know it is tiring for Saints fans. Every year almost, same narrative from some corner of the league or another. My only point was that Ian’s report, at least this time, was accurate. At the same time, I wish he had not written it because it does fuel speculation and splash reporting. And at some level, it becomes what Nick suggested is happening—folks trying to interpret Sean’s silence.

I’m not doubting that we’re near the end of Payton’s career. He’s been in the League for 16 years and you’re starting to have to go back to the 60s and 70s to see someone with the same longevity with one team (besides Belechick).
I have a hard time believing he’ll leave town this soon without any notice.

No, he will not leave without notice and reality is I think he is back. He was burnt out, he took some time away. But in doing so, the approach was different than usual and he has not been communicative. So, it has caused people close to him to wonder. But I tend to believe when you are burnt out, and are trying to get your groove back, sometimes it is necessary to switch up the routine. Throughout his career, Sean has mastered reinvention—with small things and approaches. And in the past week, I’ve seen things that give me confidence that not only will he be back but he will be back with more vigor and a vengeance.

 

[RJ in Lafayette]

What makes this story especially alarming is that Payton is the team's de facto general manager when it comes to building a team and making personnel decisions.

Is Payton's apparent angst an indication that he knows the team is in no position to compete because it has no quarterback and, in the words of Aaron Rodgers, Payton has no interest in a rebuild?

Increasingly, the most impactful moment for the New Orleans Saints since their Super Bowl win was Kansas City trading up one spot ahead of the Saints in 2017 to pick Mahomes.

 

[60minutes]

What makes this story especially alarming is that Payton is the team's de facto general manager when it comes to building a team and making personnel decisions.

Is Payton's apparent angst an indication that he knows the team is in no position to compete because it has no quarterback and, in the words of Aaron Rodgers, Payton has no interest in a rebuild?

Increasingly, the most impactful moment for the New Orleans Saints since their Super Bowl win was Kansas City trading up one spot ahead of the Saints in 2017 to pick Mahomes.

I do not think this is the case. I guess in a sense there is some validity to it in the sense that Sean knows he needs a quarterback and he is not interesting in rebuilding. But I think he would tell you both that we do have the team to compete for a SB and just need solid play/stability at QB and that our core is young and in its prime so there is no need for a rebuild. But this is truly more about burnout after Sean spent his wheels throughout the season. I think two things: Sean will return and either through draft, free agency, or trade he will get the QB he believes can lead us to the SB.

As for Mahomes, man, it is crazy in retrospect. But there were crazy things that led up to that draft that literally change the course of history.

 

[woohoosaint]

I'm not in the "Payton is leaving" camp...but he's not exactly addressing the issue via media/social media.

 

[RaginCajun83]

I'm not in the "Payton is leaving" camp...but he's not exactly addressing the issue via media/social media.

He doesn’t need to

 

[NewOrleansBoy]

What I worry is that the constant and increasing pages on this thread and around sports media will somehow actually make what is originally speculated to actually manifest into reality.

 

[BayouSAINTJoe]

This is freaking nuts...there's no credibility in anything that has been reported so far.

Reporter A speculates something
Network B runs story of Reporter As speculation
Network C runs story of multiple outlets (Network B, Reporter A) reporting speculation

This is some BS dredged up to bury the officiating story, that's all this is