What to expect moving forward (1 Viewer)

[RJS]

Lattimore could have played week 14 … he’s done w DA and the whole situation. I think it’s bad what the front office (Loomis) is doing to him through Duncan on his way out the door. I’m guessing Underhill wouldn’t write a piece like that so he wasn’t asked.

I don't know what to make of this information. If he was truly healthy for the last 5 weeks but sat out because of a beef with DA, I have a problem with that. At some point the player has a responsibility to be a professional and a teammate to the other guys in the locker room. He signed a contract with the Saints, not DA.

If he wanted to force his way out after the season, so be it. Quitting in the middle of the year while collecting the checks isn't the answer.

 

[SaintRob]

Duncan’s stuff is coming from Loomis

The guys that have been here and won know what it takes to win from a standpoint of preparation, motivation , planning etc and they know it’s not there over the last two years. They know we can’t beat good teams and advance in the playoffs w DA.

The new guys don’t know. This is all they know.

Lattimore could have played week 14 … he’s done w DA and the whole situation. I think it’s bad what the front office (Loomis) is doing to him through Duncan on his way out the door. I’m guessing Underhill wouldn’t write a piece like that so he wasn’t asked.

Carr clapped back at the coaches but after the Texans game he stopped and when he got frustrated later he put Olave on blast which P'Oed off a lot of guys including MT and ML.

Dennis Allen has a reputation for being a weasel and he hasn’t done anything to help himself since he was hired.

But like I said - his job was never in jeopardy. DA has leaked to national media that he was safe and has been doing that all year.

Loomis isn’t about to fire DA who he completely controls and hire some guy to tell him how they do things in Detroit or wherever.

There isn’t really an owner to hold anyone accountable. It just is what it is.

This is sobering.

Between this and the reports of meetings starting late, busses off schedule, players not using their surfaces to review the playbook, lack of attention to detail, even the parking issues, the state of the franchise really disappointing.

 

[Lionsaint]

I don't know what to make of this information. If he was truly healthy for the last 5 weeks but sat out because of a beef with DA, I have a problem with that. At some point the player has a responsibility to be a professional and a teammate to the other guys in the locker room. He signed a contract with the Saints, not DA.

If he wanted to force his way out after the season, so be it. Quitting in the middle of the year while collecting the checks isn't the answer.

I agree. Lattimore is the best corner we ever had. Probably the second best current defensive player behind Demario. Although maybe he should get the nod over Demario because of his age.. I digress. My point is he brings a TON of value to this organization. But if he QUIT on the team then he needs to go. I wouldn’t blame a single player for wanting to leave after the season is over. But if they quit during the season I don’t want them here.

Edit: Just wanted to add, and maybe it’s my homerism for the Saints or because I like Lattimore as player, I just don’t buy this rumor despite the evidence. He always seemed like a competitor and someone that gave 1000% no matter what. I just don’t believe he would sit out if he was healthy just because he had beef with the coaching staff.

 

[rlemieux]

Duncan’s stuff is coming from Loomis

The guys that have been here and won know what it takes to win from a standpoint of preparation, motivation , planning etc and they know it’s not there over the last two years. They know we can’t beat good teams and advance in the playoffs w DA.

The new guys don’t know. This is all they know.

Lattimore could have played week 14 … he’s done w DA and the whole situation. I think it’s bad what the front office (Loomis) is doing to him through Duncan on his way out the door. I’m guessing Underhill wouldn’t write a piece like that so he wasn’t asked.

Carr clapped back at the coaches but after the Texans game he stopped and when he got frustrated later he put Olave on blast which P'Oed off a lot of guys including MT and ML.

Dennis Allen has a reputation for being a weasel and he hasn’t done anything to help himself since he was hired.

But like I said - his job was never in jeopardy. DA has leaked to national media that he was safe and has been doing that all year.

Loomis isn’t about to fire DA who he completely controls and hire some guy to tell him how they do things in Detroit or wherever.

There isn’t really an owner to hold anyone accountable. It just is what it is.

This is pretty much the same things I've been told. Loomis had Allen in the "wings" and thought that he was more of the architect than Sean was in the "culture" of the team". He sold Allen on the idea that it would be a seamless transition from Sean to him. Now things aren't going like they thought and you can see from the interviews, player meetings, etc. that Loomis is getting desperate to prove himself right. Loomis and staff are invested in the idea that Allen can be right the ship because they sold it for several years while Sean was still here. Sean doesn't flirt with other teams if the building is completely behind him. This has been years brewing. I use the phrase "pushed out" and maybe that is a little strong but Sean felt it coming. Mickey tabbed Allen as the heir apparent and Sean didn't like that he was now a "place holder" until they deemed Allen ready, which is why he started getting wondering eyes, for a lack of a better term. If your wife is looking to find her next provider and just has you there until she finds something better you'd start looking too. This front office is messy, the makeup is messy and when Tom passed and Gayle took over (even before that when they knew he was getting close) things started to move to the direction Mickey wanted. In Tom's eyes, Sean and Mickey were 1a and 1b, that obviously changed with Gayle and some prior because of Tom's heath and succession plan. Loomis is all in with Allen not because he hired him last year, not because he brought him back this year but because for the last several years Sean was here he fledged his bets that Allen (and he) were the equal to Payton. That's why DA is still here, it's not just a hire. It's moving on from a Hall of Fame coach because you believe he isn't a Hall of Fame coach because of him but because you provided him with the tools he needed to be a Hall of Fame coach (and in some cases that's true, the team of Mickey and Sean worked well together). At this point, even if we start 0-4 next year I still believe that Allen is the coach for AT LEAST one more year.

** One more thing to add. This is too loyal of a fanbase that the bottom line won't be affected. We were fans through paper bags, through much worse records. They only thing that would right the ship would be a complete breakdown of the bottom line and the fans to all out protest, that's just not going to happen. I've said this before, sports is the one and only product where a bad product doesn't equal bad profit margin. Look at Washington. When Snyder purchased the franchise he bought it for 800 million. He just sold it, was pretty much pushed out and had to sale it and still got over 6 BILLION dollars for it.

 

[Saint Jack]

Thanks for your last post and this one. I can understand an organization trying to prove that it's the organization that builds a winning culture. I'm watching The Last Dance and what you described is the Phil Jackson/Jerry Krouse situation and Tim Floyd moving in. The Steelers have and organization with a winning culture and they plug and play HCs who accept their role within the organization. I'm done defending DA, but I won't resort to bashing him like others. Now the players only meeting with ML makes sense, hopefully he went over the vision of the team/organization and that shouldn't change with whoever is in the HC seat, it doesn't with the Steelers. The next HC just needs to be a coach, not someone who wants more power, just someone who wants to coach men.

On a side note, The Last Dance really shows how the politics of a winning franchise can end it quickly.
That’s why you don’t see repeat champions or a Bulls/Lakers/Yankees type of run anymore.

 

[Taker597]

I agree. Lattimore is the best corner we ever had. Probably the second best current defensive player behind Demario. Although maybe he should get the nod over Demario because of his age.. I digress. My point is he brings a TON of value to this organization. But if he QUIT on the team then he needs to go. I wouldn’t blame a single player for wanting to leave after the season is over. But if they quit during the season I don’t want them here.

Edit: Just wanted to add, and maybe it’s my homerism for the Saints or because I like Lattimore as player, I just don’t buy this rumor despite the evidence. He always seemed like a competitor and someone that gave 1000% no matter what. I just don’t believe he would sit out if he was healthy just because he had beef with the coaching staff.

That ultimately won't solve anything but the symptoms.

When we got a head coach that isn't liked around the league. We already saw that Dennis gets turned away trying to hire a new OC. Which may happen again this year? How is Dennis supposed to court FAs? Just grossly overpay them like we used have to do it?

Then, you got your own players that hate him enough to quit and leave. Sooner or later, these young players that's about to hit their prime. They'll figure Dennis out and want to leave.

So, if you want us to be a farm franchise. Yes, kick him off the team. This is exactly what you're wanting to become. You have your best player standing his ground and trying to save our franchise from pits of being a bottom dweller. We have our franchise saying, "No thanks"

 

[BreesusSaves]

Rebelmax doesn't miss.

 

[MarylandWHODAT]

The New Orleans Raiders......

 

[Artifactual]

I don't know what to make of this information. If he was truly healthy for the last 5 weeks but sat out because of a beef with DA, I have a problem with that. At some point the player has a responsibility to be a professional and a teammate to the other guys in the locker room. He signed a contract with the Saints, not DA.

If he wanted to force his way out after the season, so be it. Quitting in the middle of the year while collecting the checks isn't the answer.

If this is true it's totally unacceptable! According to overthecap.com Lat had a csh payout of $14,500,000 in 2023.

In what world other than American Professional Sports is it acceptable to refuse to do your job while being paid almost a million dollars a week without getting fired?

 

[Taker597]

If this is true it's totally unacceptable! According to overthecap.com Lat had a csh payout of $14,500,000 in 2023.

In what world other than American Professional Sports is it acceptable to refuse to do your job while being paid almost a million dollars a week without getting fired?

He wasn't refusing to play. He was refusing to play hurt which compounded by the fact he didn't want to play for Dennis.

 

[St. Widge]

He wasn't refusing to play. He was refusing to play hurt which compounded by the fact he didn't want to play for Dennis.

I mean, that's really semantics isn't it? All NFL players by the end of the year are more or less playing "hurt". If a player isn't injured and can get on the field while playing better than whoever the replacement is, they should get on the field. They should get on the field to help their teammates if nothing else.

And while I think DA should have been fired, you really can't keep players if they chose to sit out several games just because they don't like the HC regardless of who the head coach is. To the extent this team has any chance of winning the division next year or getting better, that's not going to happen if guys think it's okay to sit out games if they don't feel like playing for DA. They will need guys like Cam Jordan who clearly isn't a fan of DA as HC, but still rallies the guys together to play for each other.

Frankly, had DA been on top of this sooner (and there are rumors that Lattimore did the same thing last year) and shown that stuff like that would not be tolerated, maybe he would have gained the respect of the rest of the team and not gotten into the situation he is in now where it seems that the team does not respect him.

From a more practical point of view, this team isn't going anywhere in the next couple years so having Lattimore on the team is kind of a waste. They might as well get a draft pick for him while they can. Especially if he is likely to sit out half the season if he gets any kind of injury.

 

[EGLSShin]

Duncan’s stuff is coming from Loomis

The guys that have been here and won know what it takes to win from a standpoint of preparation, motivation , planning etc and they know it’s not there over the last two years. They know we can’t beat good teams and advance in the playoffs w DA.

The new guys don’t know. This is all they know.

Lattimore could have played week 14 … he’s done w DA and the whole situation. I think it’s bad what the front office (Loomis) is doing to him through Duncan on his way out the door. I’m guessing Underhill wouldn’t write a piece like that so he wasn’t asked.

Carr clapped back at the coaches but after the Texans game he stopped and when he got frustrated later he put Olave on blast which P'Oed off a lot of guys including MT and ML.

Dennis Allen has a reputation for being a weasel and he hasn’t done anything to help himself since he was hired.

But like I said - his job was never in jeopardy. DA has leaked to national media that he was safe and has been doing that all year.

Loomis isn’t about to fire DA who he completely controls and hire some guy to tell him how they do things in Detroit or wherever.

There isn’t really an owner to hold anyone accountable. It just is what it is.

Lack of accountability from the top is why things are a mess. It goes back to something Kamara said last year about guys in practice screwing up and the lack of attention to detail. Mickey Loomis is going to be judged more harshly over the next few seasons, 2022-2025 than 2006-2021.

It is a what have you done for me lately league, always has, always will be. Not even Bill Belichick was able to skirt "What have you done for me lately."

 

[Lionsaint]

This bigger than Lattimore or DA. Or any player or coach. This is about the New Orleans Saints. The Saints are more important than any individual. I don’t care what your issue or beef is, you play to whistle and address afterwards. You dont quit mid game and walk off the field. You don’t quit mid season and refuse to play. This isn’t about being on DA’s side. Or MT’s side. Or Lattimore’s side. Etc. This is about being on the Saints organization side. I dont care who you are, Winston, Taysom, DA, Lattimore, Peat, SP, or Drew Freaking Brees if you quit on the Saints, on your teammates, goodbye. No individual is bigger than the team.

I’ll repeat it again so everyone knows, I thought DA should have been fired for not winning this division and getting us to the playoffs. I completely understand if there are players who don’t like his coaching style or culture. If Lattimore, Cam, Demario or whoever states in the off-season they would like to be traded or released because they don’t like the staff, fine. I support their choice and will add that to my list of reasons why DA should be replaced. Watching Lattimore play while with the Saints and how he is around his teammates I just don’t believe he would quit on them. Can’t believe it. Maybe he does have problems with DA but even if true, he would play in support of his teammates. You can call me blind, homer, sunshine’s pumper, or whatever but I firmly believe he would play if he was capable. That being said, if it comes out that I’m wrong and he did refuse to play, love you Lattimore but you gotta go. Sorry not sorry.

 

[Heathen Saint]

That is truly pathetic. Its gonna go from bad to toxic w/ this fanbase. Once you start winning, you can't ever go back. Just ask LSU fans.

This is true. saw it happen after the Saban years. While we shouldn't expect to be fine w/ DA's culture of complacency, the fans do expect a sometimes unreasonable product.

 

[KaiZenMuse]

Some of this is fact and some is speculation. I will make a distinction below one from another.

Facts :
The Saints have always planned on keeping Dennis Allen as Head Coach and that is the plan today. Regardless of how we do in the last two games that’s the plan.

Did Ian Rappaport just randomly decide to tweet about DA’s fate ? No. Someone asked him to do that. It’s to start controlling the narrative. So that 100 “who’s the next head coach “ stories aren’t written by National media.

Carmichael will get replaced but it’s going to have to be someone inside the building or someone w a personal relationship. No rising star w options would want the Saints OC job.

Why would they keep DA ? Like I’ve said before - Why does a GM have a “coaches show” on WWL ? Why is there this push to get him in the HOF ? There is a contingent in that building that believed Sean got too much positive attention , that Sean got all the credit when in reality they believed they built a winning “program” and they created the culture of success. DA accepted the job before Sean resigned. They announced DA’s hiring the night Alvin Kamara was making news for being arrested in Vegas it was done and buried. Hiring DA gives these people complete control. Personnel , staff .. everything and I think they actually believed in what they were doing.

If they moved on from DA and hired someone -who will undoubtedly want control -and they wanted to change things … if that Head Coach had success it would look like the last 17 years and any success was about Sean and Drew.

Gayle … She made a nice deal. That’s it. They bring her out when they need it. She visits with people they want to charm or if there are cameras around.

Me speculating in a highly informed way :

I would expect guys like Mike T , Alvin K to get moved. This would be crazy but even someone like Lattimore to get traded. These guys aren’t bought in and see what’s happening so they could get moved and the narrative becomes this team had legacy problems in the locker room. DA needs his own guys to succeed. Guys that are bought in to him.

They probably go BPA with a lean to Left Tackle in the draft. That narrative is Carr is a top half veteran QB and we can contend and win the Division if we get him help.

I would say they would move on from Taysom as well but he’s a real fan favorite.



I would expect Jeff Ireland to be in Denver next year. The GM in waiting thing was a Sean play and he’s gone now. He won’t be back next year - I’d wager good money on that. That also gives them cover on the last two drafts. I’m surprised that people believe what they read literally. People thinking Ireland literally chose who we drafted are just naive.


Let’s see how this plays out now.

Holy sheet they really are blowing up the franchise, if true. Hard to believe that the GM could be so inept, yet get so much credit (because of the coaching) for so long.

I don't wanna believe any of this. Does Gayle intend to see the team to another city? fork.