Bears hire Ben Johnson as HC to 13M/yr ; former/Saints HC Dennis Allen is Bears DC, former/Saints asst Declan Doyle is Bears OC (2 Viewers)

[sfidc3]

I think we need to evolve as fans, to automatically assume, that to win consistently requires both great players and coaches. When a great coach fails. It’s usually his players regresssed. Coaches don’t really regress. So logically, if Chicago loads him up with talent, he will 100% succeed. It’s ok that you don’t want him here, with he Rizzi, and Aaron Glenn to the Jets. The fans get what they wanted, a complete purge of Sean Payton’s coaches from the team. Let’s see if Mickey can rebuild without any help from the Sean Payton tree. My advise, hire Mike and let him bring in his regime. Otherwise, Mickey will be on the firing line.

I couldn't disagree more....Coaches are human, they regress as well....the game passes them by, they have success for awhile but fail to adjust as the league does....

I think Jim Mora is a perfect example of this and there are plenty others....heck you could argue Belicheck is as well.....

I don't care where the HC comes from or what tree he is from, my 1st choice is Brady....

IMO the great coaches who last are able to build good team culture with accountability and always adapt whatever system they implement to fit the best players strengths, something that CSP is really good at....and there are precious few of them....

 

[Saint KayBee]

But again though, what if we are doing these interviews and the “not safe” hires are indeed showing us that they are not safe? Why does everyone just assume all of these interviews are going 1000% perfectly?

What if we are making calls around the league to people they have worked with before and are coming away unimpressed?

What if we are asking them simple questions that they don’t have a plan for?

What if we don’t like the demeanor of a candidate and have a hard time seeing them leading the organization, representing it in front of the media, etc.?

We just don’t know. All fans are going by literally is stat sheets of stacked teams these guys happened to be coaching.

I liked this and your last post in this train of thought, even as someone who has sought the virtue/benefit of lesser-regarded candidates.

I think oftentimes, fans are overdialed on their own team’s things — paying close attention to your rooting interest is generally a good thing — but some people emerged from this season ready to be pessimistic about everything the team is attempting to do to right the course. I try to remember that the players, the front office, and all the coaching candidates are people, first. I wanna see this team win, so I’m learning what I can about the guys they’re considering as coaches, so I can go into the hire/approach to the season ready to cheer, not ready to sneer.

 

[CowtownSaint]

People brining up MM being canned in Green Bay like Rodger’s didn’t have 100% a hand in it like the true butt crevasse he is.

 

[Hedon James]

But again though, what if we are doing these interviews and the “not safe” hires are indeed showing us that they are not safe? Why does everyone just assume all of these interviews are going 1000% perfectly?

What if we are making calls around the league to people they have worked with before and are coming away unimpressed?

What if we are asking them simple questions that they don’t have a plan for?

What if we don’t like the demeanor of a candidate and have a hard time seeing them leading the organization, representing it in front of the media, etc.?

We just don’t know. All fans are going by literally is stat sheets of stacked teams these guys happened to be coaching.

You ask ”what if”, and I say jeezus, I sure hope they’re doing all that! And then some! I choose to believe 2nd interviews, in person, are happening for a reason?!

I didn't concoct criteria to support a given conclusion. I'm hoping it's the exact opposite...let the candidate be determined by the criteria. Forget ”safe”......think Lombardi! I can't be anymore clear than that. If you're picking up anything else from my perspective, you're reading too much into it.

 

[St. Geezy]

You ask ”what if”, and I say jeezus, I sure hope they’re doing all that! And then some! I choose to believe 2nd interviews, in person, are happening for a reason?!

I didn't concoct criteria to support a given conclusion. I'm hoping it's the exact opposite...let the candidate be determined by the criteria. Forget ”safe”......think Lombardi! I can't be anymore clear than that. If you're picking up anything else from my perspective, you're reading too much into it.

I’m just saying and trying to demonstrate to you that your definition of not safe or going for the Lombardi may be skewed by a candidate you’re rooting for that the team may have vetted out and have realized they don’t particularly like for reasons outside of merely wanting to play it safe.

 

[Hedon James]

I’m just saying and trying to demonstrate to you that your definition of not safe or going for the Lombardi may be skewed by a candidate you’re rooting for that the team may have vetted out and have realized they don’t particularly like for reasons outside of merely wanting to play it safe.

only problem with that theory is that I honestly don't have a preferred candidate that I'm rooting for. I see pros and cons with each. I'm hoping for a repeat of 2006. My reaction back then was "Sean Payton....seriously? Didn't he have OC play-calling duties stripped back in the Giants days?" But Saints saw or heard something that NONE of us knew about. A ballsy call, when MM would've been the "safe" choice of familiarity, at that time. With big risk, comes big reward (or big failure).

I want Saints to be thinking "SB coach", not "rebuild coach". I'm not in that room and I honestly don't have a favorite....yet. I'm hoping to get inspired by the Saints process and final announcement. I don't want a guy who simply professes he can "compete for championships". I want the cocky bastage who raises the bar, of his own volition, to "win the Lombardi". I don't know who that is....yet(?). I'm hoping he makes himself OBVIOUS to the hiring process.

 

[Rexman100]

only problem with that theory is that I honestly don't have a preferred candidate that I'm rooting for. I see pros and cons with each. I'm hoping for a repeat of 2006. My reaction back then was "Sean Payton....seriously? Didn't he have OC play-calling duties stripped back in the Giants days?" But Saints saw or heard something that NONE of us knew about. A ballsy call, when MM would've been the "safe" choice of familiarity, at that time. With big risk, comes big reward (or big failure).

I want Saints to be thinking "SB coach", not "rebuild coach". I'm not in that room and I honestly don't have a favorite....yet. I'm hoping to get inspired by the Saints process and final announcement. I don't want a guy who simply professes he can "compete for championships". I want the cocky bastage who raises the bar, of his own volition, to "win the Lombardi". I don't know who that is....yet(?). I'm hoping he makes himself OBVIOUS to the hiring process.

A coach winning a second Lombardi has a higher % chance to winning another one than a first time coach winning one. You aren’t winning the Super Bowl without going to the playoffs. The more you get to the playoffs the better chance that you have to winning a Lombardi. Big Mike will give us plenty playoff appearances. Regardless who the coach is, and elite Qb is required in order to advance in the playoffs.

 

[DSnfla]

My question is - why do people think they know more about what it takes to win a Super Bowl or think they know better about each and every candidate?

Seriously, why are people so confident in these “never been a HC” coordinators that for all we know are bombing interviews or showing their inexperience in these sit downs are better options?

What if I told you that Joe Brady, Kellen Moore, or whoever is viewed as somewhat immature and may not be able to command a locker room? What if one of the candidates have concerns being raised and/or is getting absolutely destroyed by his references from past co-workers?

Not saying that true or not, just saying what qualifies people here to be so confident that McCarthy ISN’T the best solution today when there is very little actual evidence that the other guys are?

To me it seems more of an intrigue of the unknown/shiny new toy syndrome than anything actually concrete. Couple that with the general hate and distrust for anything the front office does these days, and here we are. Suddenly everyone thinks hotshot young coordinators with no HC experience and without access to their interviews are better options.

Not directing this specifically at you, but in general. People are acting like they are in the room with these interviews and have access to all data that goes into these decisions.

Yeah, it's funny. I don't think they know how GMs think. They don't hire a HC because the guy goes to a blackboard and draws up a bunch of plays and says "This is what I do better than anyone else" They 1st get as many opinions from trusted sources they can. Then it's a leader they look for and a guy that they can trust their opinion. Also I don't think they look for the flash in the pan kind of guy. If it's a 1st time HC they want someone that has had some success for a few yrs.

If it's a guy that has been a HC before they want to know what went wrong and what went right and what they would do differently

 

[DSnfla]

McCarthy hasn't done anything worth of note in the last 7 years coaching and always loses to super bowl competing teams in that same time span. You're going back 15 years to make him sound worthy. And let's not forget, McCarthy got canned 4 games into his last season with the Packers then Lafleur takes over the same team next year and completely turned it around. Ouch.

This is the same erratic illogical line of thinking people made when they thought Dennis Allen would be a solid choice for head coach.

So I guess you don't give Dungy any credit for building the team Gruden won the SB with? Let's look before the 2018 season, in 17 after going 4-1 he lost Rodgers for the season but the yr before he went to the NFCCG

 

[DSnfla]

Agree with your outlook Geezy. And I did preface my comments with "I'm not opposed to MM".

I'm opposed to the "safe hire", the "we could do worse than...." hire. I want to see a swing for the cheap seats in the upper deck. And that commentary is directed to my fellow fans of my favorite sports team. I've said this also...we're not in the room and we don't get to have access to the process, so we're entirely reliant on team executives to get it right. I like that we seem to have a 6-man committee to vette the process; but that's tempered by the knowledge that all members of that committee are ML hires....so I'm a little concerned about "groupthink". Are we really getting consideration from 6 different outlooks/perspectives? Maybe? Or are we getting the perspective of 5 guys who mostly agree with ML?

But I digress....there's a lot of talk on these forums about the "safe hire". They're entitled to that opinion, and I understand that opinion. I just disagree with "safe hire" philosophy. Eye on the Lombardi should be the criteria, not "safe". That is ALL I'm saying. Y'all can argue who THAT guy is, because I don't know. And I don't have access to the process to make an informed opinion. I'm just hoping that Saints are looking to hire the next SB HC in Saints history; not just a guy to restore competitiveness. That's my opinion...

Using your own euphemism. You want a guy to be your main cleanup hitter that has been hitting .400 in AA ball for a yr or 2? AND if he is hitting .222 for a yr you're going to say " He'll get it done next yr"

 

[Hedon James]

You worded my exact line of thinking better then I ever could have. I do feel strongly that McCarthy is not that guy. But I also recognize he'll make us competitive enough to not be a bad team any longer.

You're entitled to that opinion, but sincerely wondering why you feel McCarthy isn't that guy?

I don't know that he is, or isn't, but I think he COULD be?! He's done it before. His resume, coaching trajectory, and career winning percentage is almost identical to CSPs. I can understand the "paired with a HOF QB" argument. But McCarthy didn't have a HOF QB in Dallas, and still somehow put together 3(?) back-to-back 12 win seasons, IN SPITE OF JERRY JONES' MEDDLING! I can't attribute those successes to JJ....that was MM coming to Dallas. The dude is a playoff caliber coach despite JJ being in the way. Honestly, I think that's his strongest bullet point on his resume. What could MM do if left to coach the team without JJ standing over his shoulder? Because that's the situation he'd be signing up for in NO.

If Rattler is who we hope he is, MM has his next QB to develop. If Rattler isn't who we hope he is, we've got Dak Prescott 2.0 in the building. MM has been successful with both those QB types before. You may be right, and MM isn't "that guy". But I don't see the reason he isn't. What do you see that I may be missing?

I do believe that MM has the highest floor of all the candidates we know the Saints are interviewing. What I don't know is whether he has the highest ceiling. I don't have access to the hiring committee, so I have to trust that IF MM is the hire, they saw him as the highest ceiling also. And I'll be fine with that. At the risk of sounding like a broken record, and repeating the same thing over & over......I hope the hiring criteria is NOT "the highest floor"; that's the "safe hire", and we just fired the last "safe hire" HC. I want the "highest ceiling" guy. Apparently that was CSP in 2006, and I'd say that was a tremendous call. Do it again....fuhgeddabout "safe"....go for the Lombardi-potential!

 

[SonOfNOLA]

 

[RaginSaint93]

Just hope the Bears don’t have to make him interim head coach

 

[Snakehead]

Well the next time we play the Bears and Moore is the HC, I hope we have a running QB.

 

[SonOfNOLA]

Two ex Saints coaches are Bears coordinators. Former Saints offensive assistant Declan Doyle hired as Bears OC