COVID-19 Outbreak Information Updates (Reboot) [over 150.000,000 US cases (est.), 6,422,520 US hospitilizations, 1,148,691 US deaths.] (1 Viewer)

[SWJJ]

My kids were already graduated and attending college when this all started. Tell me, were the remote learning classes handled via Zoom? Or were the assignments just handed out, a reading assignment given to explain the lesson, and the child was left to either figuring it out on their own or having a parent help?

There was massive inconsistencies from state to state, district to district, school to school, and class to class.

There was some all zoom/virtual, there was some all self-lead paper hand outs, and there was some attempts at a hybrid systems, including hybrid in-person/virtual to reduce the numbers of students resent at any one time.

 

[St. Widge]

That implies that you (hopefully) believe that these are just understood to be good things that we as a society should do.

That is my position. And, yes, I get the desire to call out/punish those who politicized this in the first place. But, at some point, someone has to be the adult and put an end to the political bickering. I realize that I am being a bit of an idealist thinking that it's possible to raise the level of discourse in this country, but the continued practice of "picking a team" in politics and supporting that team is polarizing and dehumanizing. And, I think it leads to situations where public health and the welfare and education of children become questions of politics and not questions of just good government. Do I think one team is by far worse than the other? Sure, but it shouldn't be about siding with one "team" or another. It should be about good individuals who will do the right things to form a government that makes things better for people, not two political parties that only seek to hold power for their team. Until that cycle is broken, every issue will be polarizing and decided on political advantage rather than what is "good."

I don't pretend to know the solution to raise the level of decency and discourse in government, but I think it begins with not speaking of it as "politics" or having opinion pieces on how one party or the other should use a specific topic to their advantage in the mid-terms or the next Presidential election. These parties mean next to nothing anyway. Most people in either party probably don't support half of the party platform, or know the platform for that matter. They only support them because it's their team that they identify with for social reasons more than anything about ideology. And that type of picking sides has to end for society to progress.

 

[DaveXA]

A HUGE part of the problems have been poor leadership in education. There are absolutely different skills and strategies in being an effective and engaging classroom teacher, and being an effective and engaging virtual teacher. These skills were not considered in many cases when deciding which teachers would do what type of education. To follow up with that very little energy and efforts were made to teach these skills, and many teachers felt like they had little to no support with learning these skills, student and parent accountability, technical troubles, or even emotional/mental health issues.

You are absolutely 100% correct when you say it's not black and white, we could have done a lot of things differently, and better, but taking the position that "closing schools was a mistake" is completely inaccurate and narrowminded.

Agreed. My daughter, from her experience, said that the teachers had very little interaction with the students via Zoom and it felt like communication was almost entirely one direction. Part of the issue is kids didn't know how to participate fully compared to in class. I don't know if the teachers didn't have the resources or lacked training for remote teaching, but it was definitely a big change and I don't think they ever really adjusted fully to remote teaching. Your point about the different dynamics for teachers needing skills that are appropriate for remote teaching is well taken. I would have liked school boards and schools to have done more to help teachers adjust.

That said, teachers themselves are dealing with an incredible amount of stress and they get paid diddly to do a crap ton of work. They are criminally underpaid.

 

[Paul]

That is my position. And, yes, I get the desire to call out/punish those who politicized this in the first place. But, at some point, someone has to be the adult and put an end to the political bickering. I realize that I am being a bit of an idealist thinking that it's possible to raise the level of discourse in this country, but the continued practice of "picking a team" in politics and supporting that team is polarizing and dehumanizing. And, I think it leads to situations where public health and the welfare and education of children become questions of politics and not questions of just good government. Do I think one team is by far worse than the other? Sure, but it shouldn't be about siding with one "team" or another. It should be about good individuals who will do the right things to form a government that makes things better for people, not two political parties that only seek to hold power for their team. Until that cycle is broken, every issue will be polarizing and decided on political advantage rather than what is "good."

I don't pretend to know the solution to raise the level of decency and discourse in government, but I think it begins with not speaking of it as "politics" or having opinion pieces on how one party or the other should use a specific topic to their advantage in the mid-terms or the next Presidential election. These parties mean next to nothing anyway. Most people in either party probably don't support half of the party platform, or know the platform for that matter. They only support them because it's their team that they identify with for social reasons more than anything about ideology. And that type of picking sides has to end for society to progress.

What an awesome post. Thank you.

 

[buzd]

Free gov't supplied Covid tests available through USPS today.

COVID Home Tests | USPS

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special.usps.com

 

[SaintRob]

Free gov't supplied Covid tests available through USPS today.

COVID Home Tests | USPS

COVID Home Tests | USPS

special.usps.com

Those are the ones that implant a chip in your head. Not enough people got the shot, so now they're having you implant it yourself.

 

[bonnjer]

Those are the ones that implant a chip in your head. Not enough people got the shot, so now they're having you implant it yourself.

Mine just needs fine tuning so I can get the best reception.

 

[sammymvpknight]

The assumption of a faster, tighter window of 'exposure to no longer contagious' may need a second look as well.

The state is not requiring masks in classrooms and very few students are wearing them. The state does not require a negative test to return after the shortened isolation (5 calendar days after positive test) or quarantine (5 days after close contact/exposure) but does require the students returning (even those who declared a positive result) to wear a mask for an additional 5 calendar days.

Declaring exposure at home or symptoms or testing results? Totally honor system. All of it. Like the virus no longer acts like a virus,

So was the school policy the root cause of the mental health issues or did it simply reveal the issue sooner rather than later?

For me its the latter. Those issues were there just hiding in plain sight while the world turned. Now, they are evident and can be addressed accordingly.

I dont think that several weeks ( or months in some cases ) of virtual school had an impact like you say unless those children were already predisposed to having some issues. For whatever reason.

Sort of like how COVID

So was the school policy the root cause of the mental health issues or did it simply reveal the issue sooner rather than later?

For me its the latter. Those issues were there just hiding in plain sight while the world turned. Now, they are evident and can be addressed accordingly.

I dont think that several weeks ( or months in some cases ) of virtual school had an impact like you say unless those children were already predisposed to having some issues. For whatever reason.

I’m going to haven’t disagree with you. We can’t say “COVID didn’t cause morbidity and mortality…those obese, sick people were already predisposed to morbidity and mortality”. Even if isolation isn’t the ONLY factor, that doesn’t mean you can outright dismiss it as A factor.

 

[sammymvpknight]

So was the school policy the root cause of the mental health issues or did it simply reveal the issue sooner rather than later?

For me its the latter. Those issues were there just hiding in plain sight while the world turned. Now, they are evident and can be addressed accordingly.

I dont think that several weeks ( or months in some cases ) of virtual school had an impact like you say unless those children were already predisposed to having some issues. For whatever reason.

I’m going to have to disagree with you. We can’t say “COVID didn’t cause morbidity and mortality…those obese, sick people were already predisposed to morbidity and mortality”. Even if isolation isn’t the ONLY factor, that doesn’t mean you can outright dismiss it as A factor.

 

[SaintJ]

Apparently COVID also causes repetitive behaviors.

 

[SWJJ]

Anyone trying to paint the mental health aspect of school closings down as unique to students, and not a part of the greater overall collective trauma we are all suffering, is simply pushing propaganda.

The American Psychological Association has produced massive amounts of materials about this being a "collective trauma event."

While obviously some populations are effected more than others, K-12 students are not in the top 3 (Healthcare workers, Elderly, and COVID death survivors) and suicide rates are up in every statistical category.


Trying to frame mental health issues of children as specific to school's closing is just denying science, or purposefully mis-representing data to justify a cognitive bias.


Supporting scholarly articles:

What Is COVID Anxiety Syndrome?

COVID anxiety syndrome involves excessive checking, avoidance, cleaning, and other anxious behaviors related to the pandemic. Learn how to stay alert not anxious.

www.verywellmind.com

OITE Blog - NIH office of Intramural Research | The Coronavirus Pandemic is a Collective Trauma Experience

NIH Office of Intramural Training and Educations Blog

oitecareersblog.od.nih.gov

What Is Collective Trauma?

As the COVID-19 pandemic sweeps the globe, we often hear the term “collective trauma." So, what is it and how is it impacting us?

www.psychologytoday.com

The impact of the COVID-19 pandemic on suicide rates - PubMed

Multiple lines of evidence indicate that the coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19) pandemic has profound psychological and social effects. The psychological sequelae of the pandemic will probably persist for months and years to come. Studies indicate that the COVID-19 pandemic is associated with...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

As COVID-19 cases increase, so does trauma among health providers

Research from countries where COVID-19 cases spiked months ago shows that U.S. front-line health-care providers are likely to experience more collective trauma and PTSD.

www.apa.org

 

[gboudx]

Those are the ones that implant a chip in your head. Not enough people got the shot, so now they're having you implant it yourself.

Spread the word on how to remove it.

 

[bonnjer]

Looks like Louisiana hospitalizations are holding steady just below the 2200 mark for the last 5 days or so. Still 800 or so below the delta peak. Would seem that we're just about through the worst of it. Fingers crossed.

 

[Arathrael]

They did remote learning for a year and a half. That's a long, long time for them. My daughter dealt with depression and grief from losing a teacher (Covid victim) she was very close to. She actually dreaded going back to school, yet was confused because she wanted to go to school and be with her friends. That's no small thing.

None if this is black and white and we need to find a healthy balance going forward.

Right.

The problem with a lot of the "closing schools was not and is never the correct decision" arguments is they assume that leaving schools open would have had zero consequences.

As it was, with the measures we did take, teachers died as you mention, and children lost caregivers (e.g. this study estimated 'that from April 1, 2020, through June 30, 2021, >140 000 children in the United States experienced the death of a parent or grandparent caregiver).

Given that we know now that children do get Covid and can pass it on, and we've seen transmission very clearly through schools in the UK, the idea that we could have simply kept schools open without any further consequences, especially ones of that nature, and that would have also avoided any of the impacts we saw from closing them, clearly doesn't hold up. Any argument against closing schools has to weigh up the consequences of not closing schools, which also includes considering the quality of the education that can be provided during a pandemic with teachers and children being ill and isolating.

A lot of the arguments that just assert we could have opened schools back then are just revisionism or misrepresentations of reality. E.g. the nymag article linked earlier simply asserted that 'it was becoming reasonably clear in spring 2020 that schools could be reopened safely' - except its evidence for that is a link to a May 11 2020 opinion article in the Washington Post from an economics professor that actually argues that the trade-offs of reopening school need to be assessed, explicitly argues that it wasn't black-and-white, notes that opening schools might be 'one of the least risky institutions to open' and that early data on transmission from children and in schools was encouraging but also notes that it was based on small-scale early data (which it very much was) and suggested using 'Summer-camp season' to assess the impact of bringing young people together in terms of spread of the virus, with restrictions on group sizes, extensive health monitoring, no kids with cold symptoms, and repeated testing of adults throughout, to see if a road-map to reopening schools safely could be established. That's evidence that we didn't know whether it was safe to reopen schools then and needed to find out!

A lot of the continuing arguments also seem to be overly dependent on 2020 data, which goes both ways; we didn't have vaccination then, but we also weren't dealing with Alpha/Delta/Omicron/whatever might come along next then either.

The very frustrating thing I see is individuals and groups campaigning against school closures (and more broadly, against lockdowns in general) while also campaigning against mitigations and public health measures that can enable schools to remain open and avoid lockdowns, like masking, vaccination, and even investing in improved ventilation and air filtration, etc. The argument seems to be just, "Schools have to stay open, so they can stay open, and it'll just be fine, we don't have to do anything at any point no matter what, end of discussion."

There's absolutely arguments to be made about prioritising keeping schools open, but that has to include taking the appropriate measures in the prevailing circumstances to enable that to happen. While any individual measure, like closing schools, or bars and restaurants, or limiting capacity in venues, will have a limited impacted on ongoing spread in and of themselves, prioritising means we choose which of those we take as appropriate for the situation. It doesn't mean we do none of them and expect that to work no matter what.

And generally, it's incredibly frustrating to see measures, even ones like assessing and improving air ventilation in schools and adding filtration that would also be beneficial in general (it's hard to see an argument against cleaner air for children), simply not being taken seriously. E.g. the UK government is providing 7,000 air filters to schools... now, two years into the pandemic. England has over 24,000 schools, and each of those has many classrooms as you'd expect. You do the maths.

We get that healthy balance in the future by doing the work to enable it. Not through token efforts and wishful thinking.

 

[SWJJ]

...Excellent long post...

We get that healthy balance in the future by doing the work to enable it. Not through token efforts and wishful thinking.

Great post, and in an effort at fairness I wanted to comment about your last line.

Doing nothing and thinking it would have not had significantly worse outcomes is absolutely wishful thinking.


So that leaves the token efforts. This is where we have allowed the pandemic to become politicized. So many (especially at the state level) of the decisions to make mitigation efforts were based more in making people "feel" safe than it was based on the efforts actually making people safe.

So many mitigation enforcements were so arbitrary.

Examples: wearing mask in a restaurant from the door to the table vs wearing one once you are at the table
Drinking in a bar at 9 pm vs 11 pm
Surface sanitizations
Workplace shutdowns
Closing public spaces (like basketball courts)


As it became more and more apparent that some of our mitigation efforts are in vein or wholly unnecessary we should have dialed them back, but we refused to admit any thing that may be construed as "an overreaction." I get hindsight is 20/20 but when we refused to dial back restrictions and mitigation requires as we understood the novel virus better, it made it more likely people who push back and oppose all advice.