Opinion ESPN’s Bill Barnwell rates the Saints as least desirable job for HC candidates [mod edit] (19 Viewers)

[parlorcitysaint]

On the other hand, Barnwell has ALWAYS hated the Saints.

Doesn't mean he isn't right.

He's pretty much saying exactly what I've been saying since before the last draft. I had zero confidence in Dennis Allen, and I knew that trading back in the draft as much as we could would give a new head coach more capitol to build the team he wanted in a single draft.

Instead, we kept chopping wood and let DA hose us out of a prospective better replacement for him.

Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me.

 

[Hubig]

The next Saints coach will have a far easier time competing in the NFC south than NFC north, even if the Lions lose both coordinators.

 

[St. Widge]

The article and placement of our opening is no surprise. Having said that, while most of us wanted Allen gone a long time ago, I always felt that Loomis giving him a much longer leash than many of us wanted (on top of pulling out all of the stops to remain competitive) could turn out to be a strong reason that a HC candidate might give us a longer look. I still feel that way.

In all likelihood, next year will be a struggle regardless of who we hire. The silver lining is that our new coach will know that he and his staff will be given time and every resource we have available to right the ship. That might potentially be enough to sway a top candidate. If not, there is no harm in rolling with Rizzi for another year.

I agree with most of this except rolling with Rizzi for another year only puts you another year behind on rebuilding the team. Rizzi on a one year deal means no players will respect him because they know he's just a glorified interim coach. Plus, he will not be looking at building a long term team but instead looking at the best team he can have for one year. That means a year where a new HC is not building his roster and implementing his system. Whoever it is that gets the job, including Rizzi, needs to get a long term contract and a fair shot to build his roster and his system.

I don't think Rizzi is the answer and I'm pretty certain we can get a better HC, but if it turns out it's not true you have to give Rizzi a chance to succeed with a long term contract and a chance to build his own roster.

Personally, I think worst case scenario for the Saints is Aaron Glenn. He wouldn't be in my top 3 or 4 picks for the HC job, but I also think he could end up being a very good HC and possibly the best considering his leadership skills and the credibility he has as a former NFL player. I only push him down because he's a D-Coordinator and I really want to hire an offensive head coach since it's easier to hire a great DC for long term than a great OC for long term.

 

[texasjefe]

9. New Orleans Saints​

Pros: Ownership, division
Cons: Roster, salary cap

The Saints are roughly where the Raiders were in 2011, when they were holding on for dear life with the league's worst cap situation in the hopes of being competitive. That team had an excuse: They were attempting to win another Super Bowl for Al Davis while the legendary owner was still alive, which was made more difficult by some of the key decisions Davis was making, including hiring Hue Jackson to be the new coach.

The Saints don't have that excuse or really any reason to operate the way they have over the past few years now that Drew Brees and Sean Payton have both left town. This season has continued the slide down the drain for New Orleans, which followed the firing of longtime Payton assistant Pete Carmichael during the offseason by dismissing coach Dennis Allen in midyear. Darren Rizzi has gone 3-3 as the interim coach, but this organization desperately needs to accept that the glory days aren't coming back until it gets a fresh start.

The reflexive criticism of Barnwell ignores the big elephant in the room.

Loomis is an omnipotent and incompetent GM, given a lifetime anointment by our long-deceased owner.

Loomis' "emperor with no clothes" roster and cap mis-management, injurious medical environment, and a crystallized fan-adversarial ego are baked in for whoever the next coach will be.

The Saints under Loomis are locked in to long-term mediocrity. They'll never lose enough or have enough assets or have the will to go get a franchise QB they can build around. Loomis' smoke and mirrors no longer builds a contending roster around a HoF QB, it just distracts from an overpaid, unbalanced, depthless roster with nothing close to a franchise QB.

Here we are at the end of the 4th dreadful season in a row. Where we are as a fanbase is that we are actually aroused that we might get as high as an 8th round pick. Saints can't muster a winning record with the worst record in a bad division.

Ya'll may think Vrabel is the Daddy we need. All I see there is us now using the Tennessee Oilers as our new muse, after doing it the Raider way for the past 4 years. Just more distraction to cover up the Loomis ego.

Go get us a head coach who will increase scoring.
Go get us a new name in coaching. Give us mere pleebs a reason to party again with football.

 

[SweetT]

All a new HC has to do, is be better than the wood chopper, and ML will keep him employed. Shouldn’t be hard to do

 

[Super]

I do t think any assistant would turn down a NFL HC job anywhere. It is the Pinnacle of their profession, regardless of where it is.

 

[ELLIASJWILLIAMS]

I agree with most of this except rolling with Rizzi for another year only puts you another year behind on rebuilding the team. Rizzi on a one year deal means no players will respect him because they know he's just a glorified interim coach. Plus, he will not be looking at building a long term team but instead looking at the best team he can have for one year. That means a year where a new HC is not building his roster and implementing his system. Whoever it is that gets the job, including Rizzi, needs to get a long term contract and a fair shot to build his roster and his system.

I don't think Rizzi is the answer and I'm pretty certain we can get a better HC, but if it turns out it's not true you have to give Rizzi a chance to succeed with a long term contract and a chance to build his own roster.

Personally, I think worst case scenario for the Saints is Aaron Glenn. He wouldn't be in my top 3 or 4 picks for the HC job, but I also think he could end up being a very good HC and possibly the best considering his leadership skills and the credibility he has as a former NFL player. I only push him down because he's a D-Coordinator and I really want to hire an offensive head coach since it's easier to hire a great DC for long term than a great OC for long term.

How does being on a one year deal stop guys from respecting you, when being on a 8 game contract hasn't stopped players from respecting him?

 

[texasjefe]

Here's the rest of Barnwell's comments. Not pretty for the Loomis' body of work in the post-Drew era.

It seems as if there are two paths to take, and those paths might require two different kinds of coaches. One would be the path the Saints have taken over the past few years since Brees' retirement in 2021, the idea they can compete for a division title and host a playoff game if things break their way. While acknowledging they have been brutalized by injuries this season, it's more difficult to make that case than ever before. Cornerback Marshon Lattimore is gone, and offensive tackle Ryan Ramczyk is expected to retire because of a knee injury. Defensive end Cameron Jordan has five sacks over the past two seasons. Safety Tyrann Mathieu has looked a step slower this season. After a hot start to the season, running back Alvin Kamara has averaged 3.9 yards per carry and scored three touchdowns since Week 3. Tight end/offensive playmaker Taysom Hill tore his ACL earlier this month. These guys aren't likely to get better in 2025.

And there isn't as much as the Saints would hope to serve as the core of the next generation. Wideout Chris Olave has dealt with concussions this season. First-round picks Taliese Fuaga and Trevor Penning are works in progress at tackle as opposed to immediate solutions, with Penning's fifth-year option looming as a difficult call. Kool-Aid McKinstry has taken his lumps as a rookie corner, which isn't concerning, but Alontae Taylor has given up more expected points added (EPA) than any cornerback in the league. Paulson Adebo, another corner, broke his leg in October. The Saints have dropped from seventh in EPA allowed per play a year ago to 20th this season.


The other path would be to accept reality and begin a difficult rebuild. It'll take two years to get the bad contracts off the long-abused Saints' cap sheet, and what happens over that time span won't be pretty. This Mickey Loomis-led front office had an all-timer of a draft in 2017, but the results since then have been mixed. It remains to be seen if ownership lets Loomis and assistant GM Jeff Ireland handle the rebuild when it does come. The Benson family has been willing to pay massive bonuses up front year after year as part of restructures for the Saints to keep their cap afloat and shown plenty of patience as the organization tries to rebuild a post-Brees identity. Unfortunately, it might have been too much patience.

 

[St. Widge]

How does being on a one year deal stop guys from respecting you, when being on a 8 game contract hasn't stopped players from respecting him?

Because if you know a guy is gone in a year, you know that your long term future doesn't depend on him. Some guys will still respect him and give full effort, but some would see him as a substitute teacher and that's not a position that generally gains much respect. It held together this year but I'm not sure it works past finishing out a season. Despite what Rizzi said after the Packers game, it looked to me like the guys weren't giving him full effort after they were eliminated from the playoffs and things started to turn bad in the game.

But, the bigger issue is that his decisions will be for the short term and not thinking about the long term future of the team. And the fact that you may waste a year in building your roster since a new coach may want different types of players at different positions. I'd much prefer to use that year building a roster that the new HC wants rather than a year with an interim coaching looking for one year of success so he has a shot to earn an extension.

I also think it would be hard to sign any free agents on more than one year deals. But, that may not be an issue if Loomis continues to trim the cap.

 

[ELLIASJWILLIAMS]

Because if you know a guy is gone in a year, you know that your long term future doesn't depend on him. Some guys will still respect him and give full effort, but some would see him as a substitute teacher and that's not a position that generally gains much respect. It held together this year but I'm not sure it works past finishing out a season. Despite what Rizzi said after the Packers game, it looked to me like the guys weren't giving him full effort after they were eliminated from the playoffs and things started to turn bad in the game.

But, the bigger issue is that his decisions will be for the short term and not thinking about the long term future of the team. And the fact that you may waste a year in building your roster since a new coach may want different types of players at different positions. I'd much prefer to use that year building a roster that the new HC wants rather than a year with an interim coaching looking for one year of success so he has a shot to earn an extension.

I also think it would be hard to sign any free agents on more than one year deals. But, that may not be an issue if Loomis continues to trim the cap.

NFL players make a lot of money but they aren’t dumb. The likelihood of Rizzi getting the job was/is slim, so again I ask, what stops them from not respecting him knowing he’d likely be gone in 8 games? They could have not respected him from the start...unless his respect isn't tied to his HC title, but just to him as a man. So having a one year deal...wouldn't change that..unless you think it would lol.

 

[WhoDat?DrewDat]

I do t think any assistant would turn down a NFL HC job anywhere. It is the Pinnacle of their profession, regardless of where it is.

Ben Johnson literally did that last offseason lol

 

[treeduck]

I was just reading this article.

 

[Clintonrebel]

A

Imagine taking that Bears job and having to face the Lions, Packers, and Vikings twice a year. It could be a long hard fight just to get out of last place in that division. With the right moves here...and some health...we could win this division next year.

Imagine taking that Bears job and having to face the Lions, Packers, and Vikings twice a year. It could be a long hard fight just to get out of last place in that division. With the right moves here...and some health...we could win this division next year.

And freezing your can off for about half the season.

 

[3ParStillDriver]

Not sure if we're the least desirable. The Panthers, Browns and Raiders all contend with us for different reasons. Its definitely debatable and no matter how you slice it, we're definitely top 4 of the least desirable teams.

 

[44slayer]

NFL players make a lot of money but they aren’t dumb. The likelihood of Rizzi getting the job was/is slim, so again I ask, what stops them from not respecting him knowing he’d likely be gone in 8 games? They could have not respected him from the start...unless his respect isn't tied to his HC title, but just to him as a man. So having a one year deal...wouldn't change that..unless you think it would lol.

They may respect him, but you sign any HC to a 1 year contract - nothing about that is going to be taken seriously. Thats the writing on the wall about where you think you are as a franchise. Thats basically saying, see us through the rest of the misery for a year so we can shed salary and fire it up with a high draft pick in 2026.

I dont think Rizzi should even been in the conversation other than as a thank you for seeing this season through. But talk of a 1 year deal seems like pure forum fodder.