NFL Scouting Combine: Feb 27–Mar 2 (12 Viewers)

[St. Widge]

Ok. However its about 2” shorter than desired for left tackle.

Sure. But my point is that Fuaga doesn't seem to have an issue with it and his arms are only 1/2 inch shorter. Beyond that, I really think arm length is an overrated measurement for Tackles. Yes, having really long arms can be an advantage and having really short arms can be a disadvantage, but in the end it's really all about technique and power. I mean, arm length doesn't mean much if you keep a guy's hands off of you. Guys with shorter arms are the outlier at OT, but it doesn't mean they can't play it. It's going to be unusual for them to be elite, but it can happen with great technique and power.

At any rate, the point is that I don't care about his arm length when he hasn't shown to be a dominant LT at the college level anyway.

 

[WhoDat?DrewDat]

OR you can draft Jeanty and then use the later picks on players who grade out better than the remaining RBs. For example, there's more WRs with a grade over 6.3 than there are RBs, thus giving you a better likelihood of landing an excellent RB and a good WR. You have to allow value to dictate your board.

Yes you have to follow your board but you're also gonna have inherit values based on positions. The numbers will tell you finding a contributor at RB later in the drafts is significantly more likely than other positions. Tracy being the 166th pick in last years draft and falling only 100 yards short of Barkley in the same offense is a fantastic example.

(it's also another example of RBs being ceiling raisers and not floor raisers)

If you consistently drafting higher rated players you're more likely than hit on better players more often. You undermine this ability by saying, "we know he's the best but let's draft something else and hope we can get 70% of the player we passed on later on." That's a recipe for disaster. Untethered BPA is the wisest approach

Nobody in the entire league drafts with untethered BPA. It's nice in theory but it's not realistic. You'd end up double dipping in positions you only play one at a time like MLB, C, QB, etc.

 

[WhoDat?DrewDat]

Speaking of short arms. Tyler Warren having the shortest arms of any of the tight ends surprised me

This combined with him being a natural body catcher scares me.

 

[Eeyore]

Because they didn't work out

I didn't catch Warren and Loveland's workouts. I'll check YouTube.

 

[livefromDC]

Yes you have to follow your board but you're also gonna have inherit values based on positions. The numbers will tell you finding a contributor at RB later in the drafts is significantly more likely than other positions.


Nobody in the entire league drafts with untethered BPA. It's nice in theory but it's not realistic. You'd end up double dipping in positions you only play one at a time like MLB, C, QB, etc.

We disagree completely on that first point. RBs drafted early have a high hit margin too. RB is just one of the easier positions in the NFL.

And double dipping is not a bad thing if you're hitting on good players which is whats morel likely to happen if you ignore constantly evolving needs and focus on accumulating the best players. Good players are more useful currency for improving teams than bad players. Having 2 great RBs and 1 good RB is a better problem to have than having 1 great RB, 1 good RB, and 1 bad guard that you drafted because you "needed" one. Now you have a player that no one wants and you still have that same need. At least if you had drafted that great RB, you could trade him for picks or for the guard you need, but no you decided to arbitrarily limit the draft pool but ignoring some of the best players available because they're at a position you devalued based on an illogical strategy.

 

[WhoDat?DrewDat]

We disagree completely on that first point. RBs drafted early have a high hit margin too. RB is just one of the easier positions in the NFL.

I'm not saying high round RBs don't hit. I'm saying later round RBs hit at a significantly higher pace than the rest of the positions.

And double dipping is not a bad thing if you're hitting on good players which is whats morel likely to happen if you ignore constantly evolving needs and focus on accumulating the best players. Good players are more useful currency for improving teams than bad players. Having 2 great RBs and 1 good RB is a better problem to have than having 1 great RB, 1 good RB, and 1 bad guard that you drafted because you "needed" one.

Bad guard? Huh? Why would you draft a bad guard? What if said guard is an all pro? pro bowl? Why are you devaluing player B for no reason?

These discussions are in such bad faith it's actually crazy. If you can't tell where i'm coming from at this point then nothing I say will be worth either of our times.

I'll summarize it one last time. Draft Jeanty if you have him BPA. Nobody has a problem with it, im sure he will be a great player in the league. (Is it the best way to build a team? probably not but that's fine) If the FO has another player in an actual position of need/position of higher value, similarly graded that's also great because RBs can be found later in the draft at a significantly higher clip. Oh and we have a top 5 paid RB in his prime on the roster.

 

[livefromDC]

I'm not saying high round RBs don't hit. I'm saying later round RBs hit at a significantly higher pace than the rest of the positions.

Bad guard? Huh? Why would you draft a bad guard? What if said guard is an all pro? pro bowl? Why are you devaluing player B for no reason?

These discussions are in such bad faith it's actually crazy. If you can't tell where i'm coming from at this point then nothing I say will be worth either of our times.

I'll summarize it one last time. Draft Jeanty if you have him BPA. Nobody has a problem with it, im sure he will be a great player in the league. (Is it the best way to build a team? probably not but that's fine) If the FO has another player in an actual position of need/position of higher value, similarly graded that's also great because RBs can be found later in the draft at a significantly higher clip.

Because it's happen before. I'm just saying the potential value later is no reason to pass on the BPA now and passing on BPA because you're trying to think about need is not a good look either. Whether it's a guard (Ruiz), DE (Davenport), tackle (Penning), CB (Stanley Jean Baptiste), or whatever, we know how it playes out when BPA takes a back seat to a perceived need. I don't think this fabled tied value happens nearly as much as people want to believe. When I look back on those drafts, I don't remember thinking, "ooh it's a toss up between Payton Turner and _____" That's not what happened with NONE of those picks. It was the Saints targeting a position over player value. It's not a good strategy because drafting positions don't mean you will fill the position. Drafting the best player meanwhile leads to improving the over all roster which leads to options for filling positions.

And it's crazy that with all the recent examples from the Saints of how this hasn't worked, the Saints have an Offensive and Defensive line full of first and 2nd round picks, people still want to blindly just pick based on position. SMH.

Saying you're going to draft a RB later is no more effective than saying you're going to build the trenches with your first round picks. It depends on the players available and drafting the best one when you're on the clock. Planning to take this position early or that position later is just not a good strategy because you won't know who's there. Get them when they're in front of you. That's all you can do.

 

[WhoDat?DrewDat]

Because it's happen before. I'm just saying the potential value later is no reason to pass on the BPA now and passing on BPA because you're trying to think about need is not a good look either. Whether it's a guard (Ruiz), DE (Davenport), tackle (Penning), CB (Stanley Jean Baptiste), or whatever, we know how it playes out when BPA takes a back seat to a perceived need.

Oh come on this is just absolutely ridiculous. You continue to argue in bad faith. All of your examples are drafting for potential. Literally has nothing to do with our current situation.

We didn't reach on Ruiz because it was a position of need, in fact he played center at Michigan and he was a first round prospect on everyone's board. So if anything the FO picked their BPA and it didn't work out. Davenport and Jean were overdrafted due to potential and has absolutely nothing to do with the conversation we are having.

We aren't talking about reaching for a different position no matter the player grade. Again you continue to argue in bad faith.

I don't think this fabled tied value happens nearly as much as people want to believe. When I look back on those drafts, I don't remember thinking, "ooh it's a toss up between Payton Turner and _____" That's not what happened with NONE of those picks. It was the Saints targeting a position over player value. It's not a good strategy because drafting positions don't mean you will fill the position.

Again you're either not reading any responses or you're choosing to argue in bad faith. Turner was a REACH of epic proportions. Nobody wanted that. We are saying if there's another position that you have graded at an equal level you can go elsewhere since they have higher positional value.

Fuaga being a great example. Not a sexy pick but now we should have our LT spot locked down for the next decade.

Drafting the best player meanwhile leads to improving the over all roster which leads to options for filling positions.

And it's crazy that with all the recent examples from the Saints of how this hasn't worked, the Saints have an Offensive and Defensive line full of first and 2nd round picks, people still want to blindly just pick based on position. SMH.

You are completely mixing the conversation. Nobody is saying you need to draft X position because it's the most valuable no matter who the pick is. You're arguing with yourself on that one.

Saying you're going to draft a RB later is no more effective than saying you're going to build the trenches with your first round picks. It depends on the players available and drafting the best one when you're on the clock. Planning to take this position early or that position later is just not a good strategy because you won't know who's there. Get them when they're in front of you. That's all you can do.

We can agree on this. I've already said all of that in my response to you if you're even reading that. But if you think there's zero positional value FOs use in drafting, you're wrong.

Certain positions are just more valuable and if there's a player of equal value (again this is on your scouting department) teams will draft accordingly. If you have Jeanty far and away a better prospect then you pick him at 9. If your scouts have a similar grade on someone on the DLine and you feel the draft is deep at RB, then you go that route.

 

[Snakehead]

I'm not saying high round RBs don't hit. I'm saying later round RBs hit at a significantly higher pace than the rest of the positions.

Bad guard? Huh? Why would you draft a bad guard? What if said guard is an all pro? pro bowl? Why are you devaluing player B for no reason?

These discussions are in such bad faith it's actually crazy. If you can't tell where i'm coming from at this point then nothing I say will be worth either of our times.

I'll summarize it one last time. Draft Jeanty if you have him BPA. Nobody has a problem with it, im sure he will be a great player in the league. (Is it the best way to build a team? probably not but that's fine) If the FO has another player in an actual position of need/position of higher value, similarly graded that's also great because RBs can be found later in the draft at a significantly higher clip. Oh and we have a top 5 paid RB in his prime on the roster.

It's b/c there are more RBs drafted in the later rounds. 1st Round RBs hit pretty dang high lately.

 

[WhoDat?DrewDat]

It's b/c there are more RBs drafted in the later rounds.

They also hit significantly higher than other positions. You're more likely to find a RB that can get you 1k yards in the 4th than you are a 10 sack edge rusher.

 

[StudioSaint]

8 defensive players who moved up Saints’ draft board after impressing at the Combine

The 2025 Scouting Combine is officially underway, and several prospects gave already impressed the New Orleans Saints.

whodatdish.com

Not referring to you MikeF. The misleading headlines that internet gossipers put on their internet gossip are out of control. I didn't see anywhere in that article that anyone with the Saints, or even with inside info into the Saints, was quoted as saying the Saints moved those players up their draft board.

Maybe I missed it.

 

[StudioSaint]

Because it's happen before. I'm just saying the potential value later is no reason to pass on the BPA now and passing on BPA because you're trying to think about need is not a good look either. Whether it's a guard (Ruiz), DE (Davenport), tackle (Penning), CB (Stanley Jean Baptiste), or whatever, we know how it playes out when BPA takes a back seat to a perceived need. I don't think this fabled tied value happens nearly as much as people want to believe. When I look back on those drafts, I don't remember thinking, "ooh it's a toss up between Payton Turner and _____" That's not what happened with NONE of those picks. It was the Saints targeting a position over player value. It's not a good strategy because drafting positions don't mean you will fill the position. Drafting the best player meanwhile leads to improving the over all roster which leads to options for filling positions.

And it's crazy that with all the recent examples from the Saints of how this hasn't worked, the Saints have an Offensive and Defensive line full of first and 2nd round picks, people still want to blindly just pick based on position. SMH.

Saying you're going to draft a RB later is no more effective than saying you're going to build the trenches with your first round picks. It depends on the players available and drafting the best one when you're on the clock. Planning to take this position early or that position later is just not a good strategy because you won't know who's there. Get them when they're in front of you. That's all you can do.

I agree. If a team wants to target a specific position then they need to make sure that position is BPA when they pick so they are getting maximum value and chances of the player working. That means a team has to be open to trading up or down to align the position of need with BPA (which to means top players available regardless of position). Trading up is usually the best way to go, because the team knows the player you want will be available. When they trade down, they aren't certain the player they want will be available when their pick comes up, unless they only trade back one spot.

 

[WhoDat?DrewDat]

3 Cone >>>

 

[TruSaint]

3 Cone >>>

3 cone is so much more important than 40 yd dash IMO

 

[WhoDat?DrewDat]

3 cone is so much more important than 40 yd dash IMO

Agility drills for OL being my favorite.