Real Estate Agents and Builders to stop using the terms “master bedroom” and “master bathroom” (2 Viewers)

gavinj

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Is the word “master” offensive because it may have a racist and/or sexist connotation?

It’s honestly something I’ve never thought about.
 
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We get closer and closer to Orwellian thoughtcrime every day.
"
We get closer and closer to Orwellian thoughtcrime every day.
when I work in remodel construction, if a portajohn (I wonder the origins of that) is not outside, I will ask the homeowner if they mind if I use the powder room. I wonder what the origins of that are. I suppose I could say, "do you mind if I use your 1/2 bath?"
 

guidomerkinsrules

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" when I work in remodel construction, if a portajohn (I wonder the origins of that) is not outside, I will ask the homeowner if they mind if I use the powder room. I wonder what the origins of that are. I suppose I could say, "do you mind if I use your 1/2 bath?"
it's the room where you snort coke
you didn't know that?
 

KiwiSaint

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We'll have plenty of triggered white snowflakes left.
I don't think of myself as a snowflake (of course, who would admit to being one), but I have to say that all these reactions...eliminating words, advertising characters, statues, etc. is putting me in a frame of mind that says "screw 'em". It's definitely not making me more sympathetic to a minority viewpoint. I'm about as moderate as they come with what I think are rational views and thoughts. So if I'm feeling put off by these events, I'm sure there are others feeling the same way.
 

guidomerkinsrules

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I don't think of myself as a snowflake (of course, who would admit to being one), but I have to say that all these reactions...eliminating words, advertising characters, statues, etc. is putting me in a frame of mind that says "screw 'em". It's definitely not making me more sympathetic to a minority viewpoint. I'm about as moderate as they come with what I think are rational views and thoughts. So if I'm feeling put off by these events, I'm sure there are others feeling the same way.
So you’re imagining that BLM, and the Houston realtors association and Quaker Oats are all in cahoots somehow to cancel statues and words so that they can finally...
so they can....
what do you imagine is the nefarious goal here?
 

Det. Brees

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Well are we going to remove Mr. and Mrs. Mister is derived from Master and Mrs. is Mistress.
 
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gavinj

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Well are we going to remove Mr. and Mrs. Mister is derived from Master and Mrs. is Mistress.
This is the best argument for calling a “master bedroom” something else. If you were an agent showing a house to a female buyer, would you call it a “Mister Bedroom?” Maybe follow it up with “this will really come in handy if your Dad comes to visit or if you ever get married.”
 

DaveXA

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sure, at the same time - i've heard some version of 'it's not my job to teach you how to undo racism" from many including my wife (not directed at me, directed at the people trying to get her on diversity panels, and said mostly out of frustration than any real animus)
and i've also heard plenty of 'it's not time to ask your black friends to burden themselves with you betterment - they have enough on their plate at the moment
Code Switch tackled this a bit in their episode "Why Now, White People?"

and i REALLY get where you're coming from with the 'not really my place' angle
BUT
pull back far enough and that's essentially approaching approaching african americans and saying, "tell me how to stop hitting you"

in this instance racism is not their disease to cure, it's ours
now obviously they have a vested interest in the cure (like they would have a vested interest in not being punched), but the burden of stopping falls to us
so maybe the conversation is something like:
Wypipo: point me to the racism
AA: *points*
Wypipo: cool, if you want to point out the load bearing parts so we can bring this down quickly, cool - but if you want to just kick it over there while we work at this, then also cool
I want to say that part of the thinking behind my thread/question goes back to who is driving the reconciliation process. It doesn't really matter to me whether it's me (white guy) or black individuals. I just want to be part of the solution. I can't bring healing on my own, and neither can I force it to happen. But I'm looking for a way to open the door in a way that reconciliation is possible.

If I'm driving the process, I'm worried that a black person would view me as yet another white guy controlling the narrative, which I don't want to happen. At the same time, whites often are responsible for racist policies and attitudes. And many may not even realize the racist nature of their actions. Which is part of why I think dialogue is important. I don't think just saying stop being racist is enough. And I don't just stopping being racist is enough. I think building a sense of community and shared sacrifice would pave a way forward, but i don't know how to get there on my own. And really, I can't. There has to be mutual interest in that community and wanting to leave the past behind.

I think this is hard, because building trust is hard.

And I agree with LC, I'm really looking to hear from our black posters to chime in on how, or whether reconciliation is possible. I certainly think it is, but I'm optimistic like that.
 

Loose Cannon

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If I'm driving the process, I'm worried that a black person would view me as yet another white guy controlling the narrative, which I don't want to happen.
This is exactly how I feel about it. And @guidomerkinsrules made some good points in his post. But I don't necessarily fully agree with his take. I mean I always try to improve myself in terms of being educated on racial and societal issues and to be better and more understanding about it. Ten years ago I would have thought getting rid of Dixie was PC run amock. I think I have a good handle on how to improve my own worldview, but I don't know that I'm comfortable telling others how to do that in their own lives. That's the part I'd leave to the people that we want to lift up.
 

kizzy821

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sure, at the same time - i've heard some version of 'it's not my job to teach you how to undo racism" from many including my wife (not directed at me, directed at the people trying to get her on diversity panels, and said mostly out of frustration than any real animus)
and i've also heard plenty of 'it's not time to ask your black friends to burden themselves with you betterment - they have enough on their plate at the moment
Code Switch tackled this a bit in their episode "Why Now, White People?"

and i REALLY get where you're coming from with the 'not really my place' angle
BUT
pull back far enough and that's essentially approaching approaching african americans and saying, "tell me how to stop hitting you"

in this instance racism is not their disease to cure, it's ours
now obviously they have a vested interest in the cure (like they would have a vested interest in not being punched), but the burden of stopping falls to us
so maybe the conversation is something like:
Wypipo: point me to the racism
AA: *points*
Wypipo: cool, if you want to point out the load bearing parts so we can bring this down quickly, cool - but if you want to just kick it over there while we work at this, then also cool
This might help.

But seriously, I believe the issue is best cured with people changing the way they think. It's a massive undertaking.

Jane Elliott says that if you're white and were born in America, you're racist.

If I assume that's true, how can something ingrained in you from birth be reversed. Like, how do we destroy the ego? How do you humble and reprogram it? How often do people fully reject what they've been taught to believe? And how many times over can it be achieved?

Bluntly speaking, white people have to stop thinking (and acting like) a lack of melanin makes them superior. Or that an abundance of melanin makes one inferior. Such a simple concept to grasp. So why haven't we accomplished it in all these years?

We have to stop raising little humans who grow up and perpetrate racism. Obliterate that part of the ego before it gets a chance to blossom.

That's how most social constructs persevere or die out over time.

But then you're faced with the question of WHY. Why would you change the way you think. What apparent benefit is there to accepting you're no better than anyone else? What personal motivation is there for anyone to ever do that.

I think it's commendable that people ask how they can help, but it's sort of like showing up after a bomb has gone off, and asking the survivors to create a checklist of things you can do to assist them.

I'm jaded, cynical - whatever you want to call it and I have little faith in people's desire and ability to change. So I know there are posters who can provide a much better answer than me. Maybe a list of solutions and actions to take.

But for as many of these conversations I've seen on this board over the years, I have to believe suggestions have already been offered. Yet, we are still asking.

It's like the George Floyd murder itself. How many times have we told you that this is happening. How many times have you seen it. Yet it's taken until now for some people to REALLY see it. How many more generations will pass before the next batch of people see it.

As an aside, the moves by different organizations and industries to take action - without specifically being asked - let's me know that people have some inkling of the right thing to do. At the very least, they know where the starting line is.
 

Marty_Graw

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" when I work in remodel construction, if a portajohn (I wonder the origins of that) is not outside, I will ask the homeowner if they mind if I use the powder room. I wonder what the origins of that are. I suppose I could say, "do you mind if I use your 1/2 bath?"
I still chuckle at the term "water closet" for our toilet in the room now formerly known as master bathroom.
 

Loose Cannon

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As an aside, the moves by different organizations and industries to take action - without specifically being asked - let's me know that people have some inkling of the right thing to do. At the very least, they know where the starting line is.
Great post all around. As a cynical butt crevasse like you, I'm always very skeptical of organizations/industries promoting the efforts they're taking for social justice. The CEOs of these companies put out nice touchy feely ads about social justice or the environment or whatever then turn around and continue to abuse their workforce and the environment, and support policies and politicians that are antithetical to the commercials their marketing teams make look so nice.
 

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