The true picture or an anomaly ? ( Derek Carr) (4 Viewers)

[Trey W.]

I’ve said it before in other threads and I’ll say it again, DC looks better in a up tempo, not having to think so much style offense. I think SF’s offensive scheme will help DC a lot. They run a lot of underneath routes, crossing patterns, and quick throws which will help DC.

When we ran option routes and long developing plays is when DC seemed to be at his worse. I don’t know if he and the WR’s weren’t on the same page or what but option routes are were where most of his horrible throws came from.

If Kubiack brings an SF scheme here, I think DC could excel. Olave is a skilled route runner (Aiyuk), Shaheed could play the Debo roll, AK is similar in skill to CMC, and Johnson is a lot like Juan Jennings. We don’t have a Kittle unless you compare Taysom to him which he may excel in.

 

[jahsoul357]

I’ll make my judgement after next season. But I’d be willing to bet whatever y’all want he performs better this year.

This is me here. I want to see how a full season works out because truth be told, we beat teams that we should have but that Rams game; that's the thorn in my side.

I think a lot of y’all forgot Carr played a lot of games with fractured ribs

A pass because of injuries? Not here....LOL

He will be at the mercy of the OL, he played better when we were able to keep him clean.

Also, it will be interesting to see if they can convert him from a guy who makes calls at the line to a guy who executes the play as called. In the Vikings game I watched earlier, the commentator talked about how Kubiak’s calls had built in answers for what the defense threw at the QB. Carr allegedly hated that about McDaniels’ system, but more of that was probably just hatred for McDaniels (seems to be a common occurrence).

Seeing what we saw from Carr this season, I do believe that he needed more time in McDaniel's system BUT considering I've also read that it is a lot different that the offenses that he is used to. All receivers are "live" and there are no "progressions" as we know it to be. Everything is based on what the QB sees from the defense, making the right read, and then being able to execute based on what happens post snap. I think a lot of people misconstrued some of the comments made about who determines where the ball goes. From what I understand about that offense (and reading McDaniels 2016 playbook...nuts), the defense always determines where the ball goes in the pass game.

 

[Elvis]

I think a lot of y’all forgot Carr played a lot of games with fractured ribs

If he was too hurt to play, Jameis should have played. I didn't accept the injury excuse when Jameis was playing hurt and I don't accept it when Carr was playing hurt.

 

[jahsoul357]

If he was too hurt to play, Jameis should have played. I didn't accept the injury excuse when Jameis was playing hurt and I don't accept it when Carr was playing hurt.

Yep. I knew Week 2 last season that he shouldn't have been out there. The play where he got stripped from behind; in 2021, he would have taken that for 10+ yards. He had to live that decision to go out there in as bad shape as he did and he got none of the excuses that Carr did for being hurt by most, while having a more severe injury..lol.

 

[Elvis]

Yep. I knew Week 2 last season that he shouldn't have been out there. The play where he got stripped from behind; in 2021, he would have taken that for 10+ yards. He had to live that decision to go out there in as bad shape as he did and he got none of the excuses that Carr did for being hurt by most, while having a more severe injury..lol.

I think there were a lot of people that excused Jameis for his play while he was injured and it was a point of contention around here. Same with Carr this year. I know sports are competitive and you never want your backup to see the field, but I think both of them selfishly hurt the team while playing with those injuries. Drew did that a couple of times as well, but I think he earned a bit more rope than these guys had.

 

[solarbear88]

It's going to be a long frustrating 2 years.

 

[BelowZero]

If Derek Carr was a rookie, then I’d be hopeful after the last four or five weeks of the season. But he’s a 10+ year vet…

QBs historically struggle in their first season with a new team (not always, Manning being a very good example of this, but it's uncommon enough to be referred to as an exception.), and given the circumstances around Carr (not great OLine, lack of chemistry with super young WRs, non-existent run game, iffy playcalling, etc.), I think it's only fair to give him another season before coming to a strong conclusion on his play with the Saints thus far.

If Stafford can look as good as he has with a QB-friendly system, then I think Carr can be just as good - if not slightly better. Hinges on it being the correct system though, of course.

 

[jahsoul357]

I think there were a lot of people that excused Jameis for his play while he was injured and it was a point of contention around here. Same with Carr this year. I know sports are competitive and you never want your backup to see the field, but I think both of them selfishly hurt the team while playing with those injuries. Drew did that a couple of times as well, but I think he earned a bit more rope than these guys had.

Yep. Jameis playing hurt most definitely cost us the Bucs games and it would have been better for him hold off a few games to start the season. Yeah, we got that glorious comeback week 1 but the first 3 quarters were ugly. He was limited most of the offseason and then only played 1 series in the pre-season while having new teammates and learning Sneaky Pete's offense (this wasn't discussed), but it was clear that he was still recovering. That's why I said, I rock with Jameis but playing hurt last season didn't just hurt the team Week 2 but also, because of "reasons," tore down what was built in 2021. You gotta know the risk...

QBs historically struggle in their first season with a new team (not always, Manning being a very good example of this, but it's uncommon enough to be referred to as an exception.), and given the circumstances around Carr (not great OLine, lack of chemistry with super young WRs, non-existent run game, iffy playcalling, etc.), I think it's only fair to give him another season before coming to a strong conclusion on his play with the Saints thus far.

If Stafford can look as good as he has with a QB-friendly system, then I think Carr can be just as good - if not slightly better. Hinges on it being the correct system though, of course.

Are you saying that Manning was an exception to not struggling his first season? He was horrible....LOL. You could see promise and unlike modern QBs, was allowed to grow, but nothing about his rookie season would make him an exception, unless I misread it..lol

 

[Get in the Carr]

Yep. Jameis playing hurt most definitely cost us the Bucs games and it would have been better for him hold off a few games to start the season. Yeah, we got that glorious comeback week 1 but the first 3 quarters were ugly. He was limited most of the offseason and then only played 1 series in the pre-season while having new teammates and learning Sneaky Pete's offense (this wasn't discussed), but it was clear that he was still recovering. That's why I said, I rock with Jameis but playing hurt last season didn't just hurt the team Week 2 but also, because of "reasons," tore down what was built in 2021. You gotta know the risk...

Now that JW will be gone, i hope you still stick around lol

 

[jahsoul357]

Now that JW will be gone, i hope you still stick around lol

Been a fan before JW and I'll be a fan after. But let me say this; the only reason I'm so high on him is because when we picked him up for a coke and a bag of chips, I did actual homework on what the crap he actually does. He good greatly outweighs his bad, but for "reasons" the bad is magnified. The narrative that people built around Carr and not having a defense actually fit Winston's situation with the Bucs more, when you look at points scored in losses..

Plus this overlooked fact:


Their first four years, they nearly statically identical and well as their situations. Carr just had more team success. They both had the coach that drafted them fired after a season (or a few games for Carr). They then get a new HC and he is there for 3 seasons. Their 5th season, they both get a new coach and have to learn a brand new offense. Carr dinking and dunking in Gruden's offense looked statically more favorable than the 1 seasons that Winston got in Arians' "no risk it, no biscuit" that he never got a chance to get a second year in. So while folks don't want to admit it, their feelings (and narratives) around Winston either stems from off the field stuff OR the 2019 season.

With that out the way, being a fan of this team and REALLY watching Drew, I wasn't as critical as most. Neither Winston or Carr have had a stretch of games as bad Drew did to start 2007...lol

 

[Booker]

Carr has always been a streaky quarterback. In his career he’s shown he can play well for stretches, but the opposite is also true, and that’s exactly what we witnessed last year.

 

[SystemShock]

While I think the Saints would've won at least 2 more games with a decent play caller, Carr's 9 previous seasons with the Raiders should answer your question.

 

[NatureBoy]

I think a lot of y’all forgot Carr played a lot of games with fractured ribs

And other assorted head and body injuries. He showed you his ability when he was healthy. Early in the season was a time of transition and a multitude of injuries. I’m going to give him the benefit of doubt and wait to see what happens. Unfortunately, he will have yet another new OC and will be learning another new system, along with his offensive teammates. Hopefully they round in to form early and grow from there. If Kubiak comes, DC should benefit from the implementation of a solid running game.

 

[Get in the Carr]

Been a fan before JW and I'll be a fan after. But let me say this; the only reason I'm so high on him is because when we picked him up for a coke and a bag of chips, I did actual homework on what the crap he actually does. He good greatly outweighs his bad, but for "reasons" the bad is magnified. The narrative that people built around Carr and not having a defense actually fit Winston's situation with the Bucs more, when you look at points scored in losses..

Plus this overlooked fact:


Their first four years, they nearly statically identical and well as their situations. Carr just had more team success. They both had the coach that drafted them fired after a season (or a few games for Carr). They then get a new HC and he is there for 3 seasons. Their 5th season, they both get a new coach and have to learn a brand new offense. Carr dinking and dunking in Gruden's offense looked statically more favorable than the 1 seasons that Winston got in Arians' "no risk it, no biscuit" that he never got a chance to get a second year in. So while folks don't want to admit it, their feelings (and narratives) around Winston either stems from off the field stuff OR the 2019 season.

With that out the way, being a fan of this team and REALLY watching Drew, I wasn't as critical as most. Neither Winston or Carr have had a stretch of games as bad Drew did to start 2007...lol

Allen doesn’t risk it for the biscuit lol.

I get that JW’s style is high risk high reward. If i see that as a casual fan, what do the coaches think? Stats are not everything and that’s why the league will always have humans making the tough decisions. Drew Brees himself would have impeccable numbers stats wise but maybe throw a pick that turned the momentum of the game. The stats and data game will eventually go by the wayside and it will go back to going with their gut and situational awareness. I love numbers but they don’t always tell the whole story. Just like Carr’s
Stats last year. They were actually decent but we know better as fans and the product that was put out

 

[la. champ1]

Do you guys think the Derek Carr we saw the last 4 weeks of the season is a more accurate of an assessment of his ability or the first 13 weeks. In other words do you guys think with the right OC and a better line can expect more of a complete and better qb or is that pie in the sky thinking?

Carr will never be what Brees or Brady were or even what Mahomes is. That being said he’s a better QB than what was shown first 12 weeks or so. Also credit to his toughness he played hurt a or of the season thanks to this o line. With a better line and better play calling and an added weapon or two I think you see way more of the latter Carr than the earlier or even slightly better.