Ukraine

[efil4stnias]

https://www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/ukraine-ceasefire-russia-us-talks-saudi-arabia/

Great so one half has agreed.

 

[rail]

Strong - arming a smaller country fighting for its very existence (and setting them up to be invaded again 10 years down the line) feels so good. What an achievement this will be.

 

[DCSaints_Fan]

Russia's move now

My guess they will come back with a demand like withdrawal of Ukranian troops from the four oblasts they've claimed before they even agree to the 30-day ceasefire. And probably for Zelensky to resign, a major optics win for them.

Then we'll have to see how far the Trump admin is willing to bend over.

There have been some "sticks" against Russia, but very weak ones. They don't care about further sanctions at this point.

Short of entering the conflict directly, which would never happen, the only other card we would have would be to increase aid. But given the rhetoric coming from the Trump admin, how likely is that.

 

[Sailorsaint]

https://www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/ukraine-ceasefire-russia-us-talks-saudi-arabia/

I'm thinking russia will demand the US stop all funding and intel sharing with Ukraine as their stipulation for a ceasefire. The US will agree but not the Ukrainians. The US will then blame the failure on Ukraine.

 

[efil4stnias]

Then we'll have to see how far the Trump admin is willing to bend over.

Dude, they have already bent over, de-pantsed and are just awaiting penetration

Question is if Ukraine will sign off on whatever Russian requirements are to agree to ceasefire.

 

[bigdaddysaints]

Russia's move now

My guess they will come back with a demand like withdrawal of Ukranian troops from the four oblasts they've claimed before they even agree to the 30-day ceasefire. And probably for Zelensky to resign, a major optics win for them.

Then we'll have to see how far the Trump admin is willing to bend over.

There have been some "sticks" against Russia, but very weak ones. They don't care about further sanctions at this point.

Short of entering the conflict directly, which would never happen, the only other card we would have would be to increase aid. But given the rhetoric coming from the Trump admin, how likely is that.

Rubio already said that Ukraine would have to give up its territory if UK wants peace. This admin is already going into this with bowing to Russia.

 

[bclemms]

Hopefully the Russians balk and leave the USA looking as pathetic as we are. If they agree then Ukraine should use that 30 days to work with Europe.

 

[bigdaddysaints]

Hopefully the Russians balk and leave the USA looking as pathetic as we are. If they agree then Ukraine should use that 30 days to work with Europe.

but we all know that IF a ceasefire is agreed upon, Russia will still break it, and along with this admin, will blame Ukraine..

 

[Brandon13]

I'm thinking russia will demand the US stop all funding and intel sharing with Ukraine as their stipulation for a ceasefire. The US will agree but not the Ukrainians. The US will then blame the failure on Ukraine.

Sounds about right, unfortunately.

 

[DCSaints_Fan]

Rubio already said that Ukraine would have to give up its territory if UK wants peace. This admin is already going into this with bowing to Russia.

I'm not sure what you mean by "giving up territory", I don't hear anything about formal recognition of Russian conquests or withdrawal of UAF forces from anywhere. I don't consider agreeing to not military contest RuAF occupies to be "giving up territory". But that will come up in negotiations if Russia accepts.

 

[efil4stnias]

I'm not sure what you mean by "giving up territory", I don't hear anything about formal recognition of Russian conquests or withdrawal of UAF forces from anywhere. I don't consider agreeing to not military contest RuAF occupies to be "giving up territory". But that will come up in negotiations if Russia accepts.

In June 2024, Putin insisted Ukraine must withdraw from the four partially occupied regions — Donetsk, Luhansk, Kherson, and Zaporizhzhia — as a precondition for negotiations.

Putin unwilling to compromise on Ukraine, sets maximalist demands, Bloomberg reports

Russian President Vladimir Putin has deliberately set "maximalist" demands on land, peacekeepers, and Ukraine's neutrality, knowing they will likely be unacceptable to Kyiv and European nations, undisclosed officials told Bloomberg.

kyivindependent.com

"Precondition for negotiations" - meaning they wont even come to the talks if that hasnt already been agreed on.

 

[bigdaddysaints]

I'm not sure what you mean by "giving up territory", I don't hear anything about formal recognition of Russian conquests or withdrawal of UAF forces from anywhere. I don't consider agreeing to not military contest RuAF occupies to be "giving up territory". But that will come up in negotiations if Russia accepts.

Not for the ceasefire, but to end the war.
Russia will not voluntarily end this war without Ukraine ceedeing newly taken territory to them. if they do, it will be considered a loss to Russia.
Rubio said give up territory siezed by Russia since 2014, but did not elaborate specefically before 2022. this war isn't being fought over pre 2014 borders. Putin has wanted all of Ukraine since he has taken power, that is no secret.

 

[bigdaddysaints]

In June 2024, Putin insisted Ukraine must withdraw from the four partially occupied regions — Donetsk, Luhansk, Kherson, and Zaporizhzhia — as a precondition for negotiations.

Putin unwilling to compromise on Ukraine, sets maximalist demands, Bloomberg reports

Russian President Vladimir Putin has deliberately set "maximalist" demands on land, peacekeepers, and Ukraine's neutrality, knowing they will likely be unacceptable to Kyiv and European nations, undisclosed officials told Bloomberg.

kyivindependent.com

"Precondition for negotiations" - meaning they wont even come to the talks if that hasnt already been agreed on.

and If Ukraine pulls out, Putin will continue his assult on Ukraine, and they lose ALL their barganing power..

 

[faceman]

Not for the ceasefire, but to end the war.
Russia will not voluntarily end this war without Ukraine ceedeing newly taken territory to them. if they do, it will be considered a loss to Russia.
Rubio said give up territory siezed by Russia since 2014, but did not elaborate specefically before 2022. this war isn't being fought over pre 2014 borders. Putin has wanted all of Ukraine since he has taken power, that is no secret.

Putin wants more than Ukraine. He wants the return of the USSR.