UnitedHealth CEO shot (36 Viewers)

[Dago]

Experience. Not arrogance. There goes that pesky privilege thing again.

Pretty much what someone with unmitigated arrogance would say

 

[First Time Poster]

Are you kidding me. People didn't give a care about that man in his life. No one he knew really helped him. Now that he's dead they want to make money off him and promote an agenda. People like that are monsters.

Did you read what I quoted?

 

[Madmarsha]

No, I made an assumption using my intuition and reading your posts much like you made an assumption about me not being informed about the case. Whats the difference? Funny how that works.

And, let's be clear. Me saying you enjoy a privilege and perspective different from mine isn't a large leap to make. I don't need to spell out our differences. We both post enough here to know what they are. For instance, I'm a man. You aren't. I enjoy male privilege in this society. You don't. We need don't need each other's life story to know that.

Your examples of you entering an elevator and your brother's anguish over your sister dying are yours and do not override the experience of the people actually riding in that subway train that day.

If me and my privileges bother you, by the way, ignore me. We'll both exist just as we have been.

 

[First Time Poster]

Pretty much what someone with unmitigated arrogance would say

As would someone with unchecked privilege would respond with. We understand each other it seems.

 

[Dago]

As would someone with unchecked privilege would respond with. We understand each other it seems.

So your definition of unchecked privilege is anybody who disagrees about your ability to read minds and know every detail about people over an internet connection.

Got it.

 

[First Time Poster]

So your definition of unchecked privilege is anybody who disagrees about your ability to read minds and know every detail about people over an internet connection.

Got it.

I'm confused (I'm being facetious because obviously I'm not). I need to be able to read Marsha's mind or know every detail about her life, over the internet, to assume she has privilege and perspective different from me and state that definitively but she was able to assume and state I wasn't informed about the case, which stemmed from me disagreeing with her, without reading my mind or knowing ever detail about my life and somehow those two things are different.

Yall aren't beating these privilege allegations sir.

 

[Det. Brees]

He keeps throwing around the privilege card like he isn't privileged and that privileges are bad.

 

[Madmarsha]

So your definition of unchecked privilege is anybody who disagrees about your ability to read minds and know every detail about people over an internet connection.

Got it.

Not to mention that I didn't make it personal or use examples of my own lived -- or non-lived -- experiences to negate the testimonies of other people. By the way, I have never felt threatened in an elevator or when riding the subway. Does that give me privilege?

 

[First Time Poster]

He keeps throwing around the privilege card like he isn't privileged and that privileges are bad.

For instance, I'm a man. You aren't. I enjoy male privilege in this society. You don't. We need don't need each other's life story to know that.

I'm now more certain you didn't read what I quoted from you.

 

[Dago]

I'm confused (I'm being facetious because obviously I'm not). I need to be able to read Marsha's mind or know every detail about her life, over the internet, to assume she has privilege and perspective different from me and state that definitively but she was able to assume and state I wasn't informed about the case, which stemmed from me disagreeing with her, without reading my mind or knowing ever detail about my life and somehow those two things are different.

Yall aren't beating these privilege allegations sir.

Well now you are just being disingenuous. You obviously were not bringing up privilege just because her perspective is different than yours

And even then assuming that someone having a different perspective than you is solely due to greater privilege is just obtuse and asinine. Other things play into perspective such and intelligence, wisdom, and objectivity

 

[Det. Brees]

I'm now more certain you didn't read what I quoted from you.

This gets funnier each time you say this!

 

[First Time Poster]

Let me make this point clear before responding to anything else since I can see my reasoning is being misconstrued (probably purposefully).

We started here:

Looks like the problem was that he killed a rich white guy. Daniel Penny was a guest of honor at the Army/Navy game yesterday.

Now, I'm not going to speak for @Eeyore but the point I gleaned from that post was a commentary on persons reactions to and justifications persons make for these two men being killed. And that race heavily influences the polar opposite reactions.

My first post was a response to Det Brees saying:

But hay in today's climate everything is about race. That way problems can't be solved. And the wheels go round and round.

Spoiler alert: yeah, as a black man, I think it's highly audacious for anyone, let alone someone white, to assert that everything is about race is a product of "today's climate" and the impetus for making everything about race is so problems can't be solved and that, not the racism, is what make the wheels "go round and round." Audacious was polite. Standing on business would be me saying it's problematic. I don't have the luxury or enjoy the privilege of debating the merits of privilege or the race card because, for me, everything is most certainly about race. Every day. It's inescapable for me. I don't get to pretend that it is some abstract thing being lobbed back and forth in the culture wars. The perspective has merit and anyone who speaks of race, as the above, lacks perspective and is living in their privilege (a post Marsha cosigned by the way). You disagree? Fine, debate the point. My post history shows I'm more than comfortable talking about race and privilege.

The next post I responded to was Marsha saying:

Also not to mention that the people who were in the train that day testified they felt physically threatened by Neely.

To reiterate, I don't find that talking point to be a compelling reason to justifying the killing of that man, ergo, differentiating the reaction to the separate cases. I provided a simple anecdote about why I feel that way. I'm perceived as a threat every day. With everything. Regardless of the situation. I'm harassed weekly using that standard. Everywhere. That isn't me invalidating anyone else's experience, it's me validating my own and why I'm uncomfortable with that being used as justification. Now, to @SWJJ credit, they disagreed and expressed why. They felt my experience being perceived as a threat wasn't the same as to what Jordan did. To paraphrase, he actually was threatening people by yelling and throwing things. To which I counterpointed with another anecdote, my brother doing those very things during a mental crisis. Again, expressing why I find that standard to be lacking. Notice how the privilege stuff didn't come up with SWJJ though.

Let's be clear on the next part though. This was my response to @Madmarsha

People feel physically threatened when I get on an elevator. While I'm dressed to the nines. God forbid I ever have a mental crisis.

To which she said:

So, you didn't listen to any reports about the actual testimony either. Got it.

So, from those three sentences she can state definitively that I didn't listen to actual testimony. Quite a leap without reading my mind or knowing me. She disagreed. Fine. Say why. But to boil it down to, hur dur you didn't read. Microaggression, keep it 100. But when I say:

No I did, I just don't walk through life with the same privilege and perspective you hold.

now I'm arrogant, disingenuous, invalidating. Respectfully, to Marsha @Dago and anyone else, yall are being some hypocrites. It's giving rock throwing and hiding your hand. Marsha, I don't need to block you. I don't need to run from debate, disagreements or differing perspectives. I enjoy being challenged on what I think. That's how I grow as a man. But challenge me. You don't get to accuse me of being unread on a topic and then cry white woman tears about being called privileged. If you are gonna dish it then take it beloved. I felt like yall were acting privileged, said so, the same way you felt like I didn't read sheet and said so. Don't switch up when the rabbit gets the gun. Keep that same energy.

Ironically, in a thread centered around healthcare, it's interesting how the unhoused man, who certainly was dealing with mental health issues, who was yelling he was hungry, thirsty and needed a job and who was throwing trash at people is held to a higher standard than some man who lived lavishly off of his company profiting from denials of claims, some denied claims that undoubtedly resulted in loss of life. Oh, but he was just "greedy." And yall are really struggling to see why race and privilege could be a factor in your perceptions of those situations? I really need yall to step outside your echo chambers and touch grass bro.

 

[Dago]

Let me make this point clear before responding to anything else since I can see my reasoning is being misconstrued (probably purposefully).

We started here:


Now, I'm not going to speak for @Eeyore but the point I gleaned from that post was a commentary on persons reactions to and justifications persons make for these two men being killed. And that race heavily influences the polar opposite reactions.

My first post was a response to Det Brees saying:

But hay in today's climate everything is about race. That way problems can't be solved. And the wheels go round and round.

Spoiler alert: yeah, as a black man, I think it's highly audacious for anyone, let alone someone white, to assert that everything is about race is a product of "today's climate" and the impetus for making everything about race is so problems can't be solved and that, not the racism, is what make the wheels "go round and round." Audacious was polite. Standing on business would be me saying it's problematic. I don't have the luxury or enjoy the privilege of debating the merits of privilege or the race card because, for me, everything is most certainly about race. Every day. It's inescapable for me. I don't get to pretend that it is some abstract thing being lobbed back and forth in the culture wars. The perspective has merit and anyone who speaks of race, as the above, lacks perspective and is living in their privilege (a post Marsha cosigned by the way). You disagree? Fine, debate the point. My post history shows I'm more than comfortable talking about race and privilege.

The next post I responded to was Marsha saying:

Also not to mention that the people who were in the train that day testified they felt physically threatened by Neely.

To reiterate, I don't find that talking point to be a compelling reason to justifying the killing of that man, ergo, differentiating the reaction to the separate cases. I provided a simple anecdote about why I feel that way. I'm perceived as a threat every day. With everything. Regardless of the situation. I'm harassed weekly using that standard. Everywhere. That isn't me invalidating anyone else's experience, it's me validating my own and why I'm uncomfortable with that being used as justification. Now, to @SWJJ credit, they disagreed and expressed why. They felt my experience being perceived as a threat wasn't the same as to what Jordan did. To paraphrase, he actually was threatening people by yelling and throwing things. To which I counterpointed with another anecdote, my brother doing those very things during a mental crisis. Again, expressing why I find that standard to be lacking. Notice how the privilege stuff didn't come up with SWJJ though.

Let's be clear on the next part though. This was my response to @Madmarsha

People feel physically threatened when I get on an elevator. While I'm dressed to the nines. God forbid I ever have a mental crisis.

To which she said:

So, you didn't listen to any reports about the actual testimony either. Got it.

So, from those three sentences she can state definitively that I didn't listen to actual testimony. Quite a leap without reading my mind or knowing me. She disagreed. Fine. Say why. But to boil it down to, hur dur you didn't read. Microaggression, keep it 100. But when I say:

No I did, I just don't walk through life with the same privilege and perspective you hold.

now I'm arrogant, disingenuous, invalidating. Respectfully, to Marsha @Dago and anyone else, yall are being some hypocrites. It's giving rock throwing and hiding your hand. Marsha, I don't need to block you. I don't need to run from debate, disagreements or differing perspectives. I enjoy being challenged on what I think. That's how I grow as a man. But challenge me. You don't get to accuse me of being unread on a topic and then cry white woman tears about being called privileged. If you are gonna dish it then take it beloved. I felt like yall were acting privileged, said so, the same way you felt like I didn't read sheet and said so. Don't switch up when the rabbit gets the gun. Keep that same energy.

Ironically, in a thread centered around healthcare, it's interesting how the unhoused man, who certainly was dealing with mental health issues, who was yelling he was hungry, thirsty and needed a job and who was throwing trash at people is held to a higher standard than some man who lived lavishly off of his company profiting from denials of claims, some denied claims that undoubtedly resulted in loss of life. Oh, but he was just "greedy." And yall are really struggling to see why race and privilege could be a factor in your perceptions of those situations? I really need yall to step outside your echo chambers and touch grass bro.

That's a whole lot of typing to not address what I was saying.

Dismissing somebody's opinion by assuming something about them that you can't possibly know is absolutely arrogant and obtuse. It is not based on principle, facts, logic, or objectivity. It is, however, intellectually lazy

 

[First Time Poster]

That's a whole lot of typing to not address what I was saying.

Dismissing somebody's opinion by assuming something about them that you can't possibly know is absolutely arrogant and obtuse. It is not based on principle, facts, logic, or objectivity. It is, however, intellectually lazy

I understand. You think Marsha was arrogant, obtuse and intellectually lazy when she dismissed my opinion because her claim that I didn't read the testimony was not based on principle, facts, logic or objectivity. I really see your point. Hope that helps.

 

[Mr. Sparkle]

LOL yall might want to start another thread on race and privilege and Daniel Penny.

This is the Crazy 1%er Health Care Murderer thread