Grupe (1 Viewer)

[DSnfla]

If you're going to be Critical you should get the Facts Correct.

Grupe did not miss 2 FGs against the Jaguars. He missed his 1st attempt from 52 yards. He then made his next 3, from 23, 35, and 42 yards. He was 3 out of 4 on FG attempts against the Jaguars.

Grupe is 16 of 20 (80%) so far on the year on FG attempts. That's not great but it's far from terrible. It's a small sample size from a Rookie Kicker through his first 7 games.

Saints Legendary Kicker Morten Andersen had a career average of 77.6% with the Saints. Just last year, Will Lutz hit only 74.2% of his FG attempts for the Saints and has a career average of 84.6%, which is the Saints Highest All-Time.

A strong case can be made that 3 out of the 4 FG attempts Grupe has missed have directly lead to Saints 2 of the Saints 4 losses this year. He has missed at least 1 FG in 3 out of the 4 Saints losses this year. That's not good.

What's quickly forgotten though is that he made all of his FG attempts in the 3 wins the Saints have had this year. In the games against the Titans and the Panthers his kicks directly contributed to winning those games.

What is certain is that the Saints inability to score Touchdowns has lead to a heavy dependence on Grupe to score FGs. Through 6 games he had attempted the 4th most FGs (tied with 2 others) in the league. The lack of scoring Touchdowns is evidenced by Grupe only having 11 extra point attempts which. He has made all of them. Through 6 games he had attempted only 10 extra points which was tied with 2 others for 20th-22nd in the league. That number will be worse when week 7 has concluded.

Grupe Made Two 50+ Yard FGs against the Patriots, the first time in almost 20 years a Saints kicker made 2 from 50 yards or more in the same game. The most FGs made by a Saints kicker in a single season is 32, by Will Lutz, in what was his 3rd NFL season. Grupe through seven games in his Rookie Year is on pace to make 39 FGs, shattering the record by 7, which would be 25% more than the current record. Grupe is on pace through 7 games to have 48 Attempts this Season. The most attempts in a single season by a Saints Kicker is 41, in 1969, by Tom Dempsey, who connected on only 53.7% of those attempts.

It's easy to get down on the kicker when things don't go right. What must be accepted is that an NFL kicker is going to miss roughly 1 out of every 5 times on average. When they miss, it's Spotlighted. When they make, it's Expected. Two weeks ago Grupe was the NFC Special Teams Player Of The Week. For an NFL Kicker it's a short walk from the Penthouse to the Outhouse.

The Saints have Zero investment in Grupe as a Kicker. He was signed as an Undrafted Rookie Free Agent. He didn't cost the Saints anything by way of Draft Capital to acquire. He is on a Rookie Contract, costing the Saints the league minimum for a Kicker at $750,000 this year. By comparison, the Colts are paying their kicker Matt Gay over $9 Million Dollars this year, 12 Times More than what the Saints are paying Grupe.

Be patient with the young lad. The kicker is easy to spot when he misses. Blake Grupe is not anywhere close to the biggest problem the Saints have right now. That is a Fact!

Sorry, FG's are very situational BG missed a game-tying kick @ GB He's missed a short one (under 30) and a mid-range one ( under 49) In today's NFL 50 is the new 40 and he's 3 out of 5 from 50+. It's not just % it's the gravity of the kick. We should be trying out kickers

 

[Artifactual]

Sorry, FG's are very situational BG missed a game-tying kick @ GB He's missed a short one (under 30) and a mid-range one ( under 49) In today's NFL 50 is the new 40 and he's 3 out of 5 from 50+. It's not just % it's the gravity of the kick. We should be trying out kickers

BG was 3 out of 3 and converted his1 extra point attempt against the Titans in his 1st NFL game. He Made a 52 yarder. The Saints won the game 16-15. Grupe scored 10 of the Saints 16 points. It could be said that the gravity of his kicks won that game.

Grupe was perfect in week 2 against the Panthers where he made both of his FG attempts and both of his extra points. He scored 8 of the Saints 20 points in that game. His kicks directly contributed to winning that game.

In week 5 against the Patriots BG made both of his attempts, each one over 50 yards. It was the 1st time in 19 years that a Saints kicker made 2 FGs of 50+ yards in the same game. He was named NFC Special Teams Player Of The Week.

So far this season, 7 kickers have attempted 5 or more FGs. Only 2 kickers have made more than 3 of them. The other 5 kickers made 3 of their attempts from 50+ yards.

Grupe is on pace to shatter the Saints Single Season Franchise Record for the most FGs made.

Who do you suggest the Saints should bring in to tryout?

 

[MSUSousaphone]

As a 40 year old amateur soccer player, I don't understand how the kicking in the NFL hasn't evolved to a point where guys are more accurate (yes, I know this sounds like the Ninja meme). I play with too many amateur guys who can nail coke cans from 50 yards away. Yes, a football is different, but when you're talking about a billion dollar scouting industry finding the best of the best and paying them millions to train daily with state of the art equipment......I just figured we would be at a point where guys were near automatic by now. Like there would be 20 to 25 guests by now.

My only conceivable take is that the environment of the NFL breaks kickers mentally to such an extent that it will take a whole culture change to fix the position.

 

[St. Pike]

I feel like this guy has been our offense. LOL. He’s young and per dollar spent he has contributed more to scoring than Carr. LOL.


….

 

[Scorpius the Allfather]

Apples to oranges my guy.
Better analogy:
Try a high wire 1,000 ft off the ground to 10 ft off the ground. One is a matter of death and the other you can lick your wounds and walk away from

A fall from 10 feet could paralyze you, so no, you may not "walk" away from it.

 

[Scorpius the Allfather]

As a 40 year old amateur soccer player, I don't understand how the kicking in the NFL hasn't evolved to a point where guys are more accurate (yes, I know this sounds like the Ninja meme). I play with too many amateur guys who can nail coke cans from 50 yards away. Yes, a football is different, but when you're talking about a billion dollar scouting industry finding the best of the best and paying them millions to train daily with state of the art equipment......I just figured we would be at a point where guys were near automatic by now. Like there would be 20 to 25 guests by now.

My only conceivable take is that the environment of the NFL breaks kickers mentally to such an extent that it will take a whole culture change to fix the position.

I'm pretty sure the shape of the football is a big reason why. If you're off by a millimeter you're kick is no good. It's much easier to be accurate with a regular round ball instead of the oblong shaped football.

 

[St. Pike]

As a 40 year old amateur soccer player, I don't understand how the kicking in the NFL hasn't evolved to a point where guys are more accurate (yes, I know this sounds like the Ninja meme). I play with too many amateur guys who can nail coke cans from 50 yards away. Yes, a football is different, but when you're talking about a billion dollar scouting industry finding the best of the best and paying them millions to train daily with state of the art equipment......I just figured we would be at a point where guys were near automatic by now. Like there would be 20 to 25 guests by now.

My only conceivable take is that the environment of the NFL breaks kickers mentally to such an extent that it will take a whole culture change to fix the position.

There are a lot more components with a FG. You have the rushers, you have the hike and the placement, and the walk up to strike the ball. Plus, once the ball goes into the air you have wind conditions. Also, heat and humidity can play a factor. All this is not Ben considering the shape of the ball. When a kicker starts his move the ball is not even in place. In fact, the ball is generally only in place moments before the kick is done.

….

 

[DSnfla]

BG was 3 out of 3 and converted his1 extra point attempt against the Titans in his 1st NFL game. He Made a 52 yarder. The Saints won the game 16-15. Grupe scored 10 of the Saints 16 points. It could be said that the gravity of his kicks won that game.

Grupe was perfect in week 2 against the Panthers where he made both of his FG attempts and both of his extra points. He scored 8 of the Saints 20 points in that game. His kicks directly contributed to winning that game.

In week 5 against the Patriots BG made both of his attempts, each one over 50 yards. It was the 1st time in 19 years that a Saints kicker made 2 FGs of 50+ yards in the same game. He was named NFC Special Teams Player Of The Week.

So far this season, 7 kickers have attempted 5 or more FGs. Only 2 kickers have made more than 3 of them. The other 5 kickers made 3 of their attempts from 50+ yards.

Grupe is on pace to shatter the Saints Single Season Franchise Record for the most FGs made.

Who do you suggest the Saints should bring in to tryout?

Well I'm not a Pro-player scout for the NFL , but I'm sure there is someone on the Saints staff that is getting paid to really be up on all the up and coming kickers available. At the very least it would have been doing due diligence with this mini buy week to bring in a few guys. It's what a real HC would do. SP anyone ?

 

[Artifactual]

Well I'm not a Pro-player scout for the NFL , but I'm sure there is someone on the Saints staff that is getting paid to really be up on all the up and coming kickers available. At the very least it would have been doing due diligence with this mini buy week to bring in a few guys. It's what a real HC would do. SP anyone?

The answer was on page 4 in a post by Alan 12. See Below.

Something people want to ignore when trying to drag Grupe through the mud.
Even Lutz wasn't his rookie year and Grupe (so far) has still been better than he was in 2016.
Lutz didn't have a very glowing review either his Rookie Season.

He also missed 4 FG in his first 7 games (11/15, 73.3%) and even went 4/7 (57.1%) in his first 2 games where we lost both by a combined 4 points because he had one FG blocked and returned for a TD where we lost 16-13 to the Giants.
Good thing Payton didn't cut him then because y'all wouldn't have anyone to be upset about trading away in favor of Grupe right now.

Payton hasn't cut Lutz yet, as the Saints HC, or now as the Broncos HC. Lutz missed a FG and an extra point in the Broncos 1st game this season and they lost by one point, 17-16 to their division rivals, the Raiders. Had Lutz made his kicks in that game they would have won and would now have a 3-4 record instead of 2-5, and would be in contention for a Wildcard Playoff Spot.

 

[DSnfla]

The answer was on page 4 in a post by Alan 12. See Below.


Payton hasn't cut Lutz yet, as the Saints HC, or now as the Broncos HC. Lutz missed a FG and an extra point in the Broncos 1st game this season and they lost by one point, 17-16 to their division rivals, the Raiders. Had Lutz made his kicks in that game they would have won and would now have a 3-4 record instead of 2-5, and would be in contention for a Wildcard Playoff Spot.

LOL SP has a history with Lutz. And after those misses, he has not missed.
BG is a young rookie kicker. He did well in pre-season and in the 1st two games but when you miss a game tieing kick and miss from under 40 confidence is not that high

 

[LordBane]

The answer was on page 4 in a post by Alan 12. See Below.


Payton hasn't cut Lutz yet, as the Saints HC, or now as the Broncos HC. Lutz missed a FG and an extra point in the Broncos 1st game this season and they lost by one point, 17-16 to their division rivals, the Raiders. Had Lutz made his kicks in that game they would have won and would now have a 3-4 record instead of 2-5, and would be in contention for a Wildcard Playoff Spot.

He is 12-13... He missed a 56 yard field goal... I'd take that tbh..

 

[Artifactual]

He is 12-13... He missed a 56 yard field goal... I'd take that tbh..

If Grupe had missed a FG and an extra point in the same game that the Saints lost by 1 point would you say the same thing?

 

[LordBane]

If Grupe had missed a FG and an extra point in the same game that the Saints lost by 1 point would you say the same thing?

Absolutely... A 56-yard field goal is a long field goal... KIckers miss kicks.. he has two over 50 and made all his kicks since the first game. Grupe missed a kick that cost us the game against the Packers. The problem is you left out a lot of facts about Lutz who is frankly playing superior to Grupe. Now, you can get into the economics of the choice, and that has a lot of merit. If you say Lutz is not kicking as well as Grupe this year, I'd tell you to look up confirmation bias. Luts was playing on a new field, with a new long snapper and holder in that first game. He is having the better year....

 

[Artifactual]

Absolutely... A 56-yard field goal is a long field goal... KIckers miss kicks.. he has two over 50 and made all his kicks since the first game. Grupe missed a kick that cost us the game against the Packers. The problem is you left out a lot of facts about Lutz who is frankly playing superior to Grupe. Now, you can get into the economics of the choice, and that has a lot of merit. If you say Lutz is not kicking as well as Grupe this year, I'd tell you to look up confirmation bias. Luts was playing on a new field, with a new long snapper and holder in that first game. He is having the better year....

I didn't say Grupe was kicking better than Lutz this year. What I said was If you're being fair, in comparing the two, Grupe is a Rookie, and Lutz missed kicks his Rookie year that cost the Saints games. You have ignored acknowledging that truth. Everything is also new to Grupe, holder, snapper, field, team, coaches, and kicking for the 1st time in the NFL. You also failed admit that Lutz cost Denver game 1, not just by missing a 56 yard FG, but by missing an extra point in a 1 point loss.

I don't think it's fair to compare Grupe to Lutz yet. Lutz is in his 8th year. Grupe will be playing in his 8th game this Sunday. Sean Payton stuck with Lutz throughout his career, during good times and bad times.

What I am saying is people have been quick to start threads saying cut Grupe and post the same type stuff while ignoring he was the difference maker in the Saints first 2 wins this year. He missed kicks in the last two games. That's not good.

Let's hold up on the knee jerk reactions and see how he does moving forward. That's what SP would do, right?

 

[Complex Kid]

For $750,000 he had better do it quick. Your only job in the world is to kick a damn ball through a 10 foot high, 18 1/2 foot post.

Yes for just above the minimum salary he better figure it out fast! Or another guy at the same salary will come in!!!