Is Kellen Moore not impressed with Rattler? (3 Viewers)

[MikeyF]

This explains why our young QBs looked like they did under Allen...
Hindsight is always 20/20 but it isn't hard to see why Allen failed as a HC...

Saints’ Kellen Moore wants no uncertainty about his QB

Kellen Moore discusses the desire to have a definitive backup quarterback (whether that's Haener, Rattler or other) for the Saints prior to starting the season.

www.louisianasports.net

 

[Sailorsaint]

Actually, I hope we wait and go after Nuss next year. Carr/Rattler this year, no moving up in the draft/maybe back, use draft capital next year to move up. Get depth in the trenches this year, a second or third round RB this year (like Skattebo or Jones Jr).

 

[SweetT]

There was a graph posted for starting quarterbacks that had data for quarterback rating vs WR separation and catch rate. Rattler’s receivers had by far the absolute worst separation and catch rate than any QB in the league. Rattler was throwing to absolute bums when he had his shot. Not gonna judge him on that. Dude was throwing to practice squad caliber WRs.

There’s something to be said about Rattler. Dude let his poise throughout. He always took the field like a boss. My only concern is that he won’t get a fighting chance at a starting spot eventually

 

[SweetT]

Actually, I hope we wait and go after Nuss next year. Carr/Rattler this year, no moving up in the draft/maybe back, use draft capital next year to move up. Get depth in the trenches this year, a second or third round RB this year (like Skattebo or Jones Jr).

People are sleeping on Nuss. He did some things this past year that proves to me that he will be a guy at the next level. Saw this dude hit like 7-8 different receivers in games. That’s crazy

 

[DavidM]

People are sleeping on Nuss. He did some things this past year that proves to me that he will be a guy at the next level. Saw this dude hit like 7-8 different receivers in games. That’s crazy

I second this. Don’t take a QB in the 1st just to do it. Stay the course and let the draft come to you. I will officially go on record and say that Dart will be a bust. Not just any bust, but a huge one.

You might end up being right about both players but I'm genuinely curious to understand what you're seeing in them to arrive at such different predictions.

Granted, Dart has played a lot more football, but he has a higher completion percentage, better TD% and INT%, and is more athletic, adding a legitimate running ability to his game.

Nussmeier could possibly take a big step in his development this season (I hope he does) but I'm just not sure how anybody could be really optimistic about him and also really down on Dart (you're not the only one).

Like I said, you might be right - just trying to understand the big differences people are seeing between the two players.

 

[DavidM]

There’s something to be said about Rattler. Dude let his poise throughout. He always took the field like a boss. My only concern is that he won’t get a fighting chance at a starting spot eventually

I came away with the same impression of Rattler. I thought he showed poise as he got reps and seemed to play with a short memory when things didn't go well. I think a likely and understandable issue for a new coaching staff is that he hasn't done enough yet to put himself in that kind of consideration for a starting spot, so they have to explore options to improve at the position. I do hope he gets a legitimate chance to compete, though, because the ultimate goal is to find the best guy to lead the offense, no matter how and when they ended up on the roster.

 

[SigFreudianSlip]

I think all the QB's will play better under Moore, so I agree. I'm not writing any of them off or crowning any of them, but I do think they will all play better under Moore.

Zero confidence in Rattler or Haener being the guy (have been wrong on Haener and never believed in Rattler) but I agree with this wholeheartedly. Think Kellen will get the most out of all QB’s.

 

[SweetT]

You might end up being right about both players but I'm genuinely curious to understand what you're seeing in them to arrive at such different predictions.

Granted, Dart has played a lot more football, but he has a higher completion percentage, better TD% and INT%, and is more athletic, adding a legitimate running ability to his game.

Nussmeier could possibly take a big step in his development this season (I hope he does) but I'm just not sure how anybody could be really optimistic about him and also really down on Dart (you're not the only one).

Like I said, you might be right - just trying to understand the big differences people are seeing between the two players.

Dart played in an RPO system. Sure he didn’t have that one singular bellcow RB, but he had 5 RBs, with at least 40 carries, who had rushing averages of 4, 4.7, 5, 5.1, and 5.2 yards per carry.
It opened up a lot of what Kiffen wanted to do with his offense and allowed Dart to shine at Ole Miss. That’s just 2024. They also had a prettt good rushing attack in 2023.

Nuss (in his first year as starter) played in an offense who had major issues running the ball. Sloan called play action only 22.8% of the time bc of the craptastic run game. LSU threw the ball 60% of the time (6th nationally) and Nuss was 7th among QBs in drop backs. LSU also only rushed on 1st down 42% of the time for 131st nationally. There was zero balance. The only time they had balance was when they finally took the leash off Durham. Plus they only called a screen 12% of the time. It’s like Nuss was strapped by the ineptitude of how the offense was ran bc of what they had in the backfield

Essentially, Dart has had the luxury of having a balanced attack that is spreading out opposing defenses. While Nuss is having to sling it endlessly, with almost no threat of a run game.
Personally, I feel like Nuss is learning his NFL craft at a higher rate than Dart bc of his team’s shortcomings. Just my opinion though

 

[DavidM]

Dart played in an RPO system. Sure he didn’t have that one singular bellcow RB, but he had 5 RBs, with at least 40 carries, who had rushing averages of 4, 4.7, 5, 5.1, and 5.2 yards per carry.
It opened up a lot of what Kiffen wanted to do with his offense and allowed Dart to shine at Ole Miss. That’s just 2024. They also had a prettt good rushing attack in 2023.

Nuss (in his first year as starter) played in an offense who had major issues running the ball. Sloan called play action only 22.8% of the time bc of the craptastic run game. LSU threw the ball 60% of the time (6th nationally) and Nuss was 7th among QBs in drop backs. LSU also only rushed on 1st down 42% of the time for 131st nationally. There was zero balance. The only time they had balance was when they finally took the leash off Durham. Plus they only called a screen 12% of the time. It’s like Nuss was strapped by the ineptitude of how the offense was ran bc of what they had in the backfield

Essentially, Dart has had the luxury of having a balanced attack that is spreading out opposing defenses. While Nuss is having to sling it endlessly, with almost no threat of a run game.
Personally, I feel like Nuss is learning his NFL craft at a higher rate than Dart bc of his team’s shortcomings. Just my opinion though

Fair take. 3Par has also made some informative comments about the Ole Miss offense and related concerns about transitioning from that to the NFL.

So sure, the Saints would have to make a determination that it's not a barrier to Dart playing in the NFL.

Of the two, I've watched a lot more of Nussmeier and from a perception standpoint, I feel about him the way I do Ewers; both seem to be great teammates and can do all the expected things within the system, but really don't consistently show a level of dynamic ability that distinguishes them from their peers. Nussmeier has another season to grow and he might get over that hump, but most games, he looks like just another college QB to me. Solid at that level but hasn't shown enough to justify the early NFL hype, IMO. When people talk about him potentially being a 1st rounder next year, I'm assuming that's based on a belief that he's expected to improve a great deal with another year of experience. That's nothing to bank on right now.

 

[SweetT]

Fair take. 3Par has also made some informative comments about the Ole Miss offense and related concerns about transitioning from that to the NFL.

So sure, the Saints would have to make a determination that it's not a barrier to Dart playing in the NFL.

Of the two, I've watched a lot more of Nussmeier and from a perception standpoint, I feel about him the way I do Ewers; both seem to be great teammates and can do all the expected things within the system, but really don't consistently show a level of dynamic ability that distinguishes them from their peers. Nussmeier has another season to grow and he might get over that hump, but most games, he looks like just another college QB to me. Solid at that level but hasn't shown enough to justify the early NFL hype, IMO. When people talk about him potentially being a 1st rounder next year, I'm assuming that's based on a belief that he's expected to improve a great deal with another year of experience. That's nothing to bank on right now.

Dart is intriguing, for me, bc of his mobility. I love a guy who can run. I don’t really care for these RPO guys. Nuss was only in his first year as a starter and I’ve seen him make way better reads that Dart has in his entire collegiate career. That’s just me though. Trust me, I’m trying real hard to like Dart, but there is something that is telling me that he will not be that guy at the NFL level, unless he’s put in the best system. Which we have no idea how our future system will work. There’s nothing to go by, in terms of results yet

 

[Walter White]

That happens when you have an offense built totally around you and your skillset. Quiet as kept, Mariota looked awesome in that offense as well, but I digress. Rattler is getting killed by the optics of last season but I guarantee you that JD5 would look nothing like he did as a Saint. I'm not saying Rattler is better than Daniels but we have to stop trying to compare them (or any other quarterback's) like their situations were apples to apples.

That's easy to say but at the end of the day you still have to go out there and produce. JD5 would looked great anywhere maybe not as great as he did in Washington but he did things as a rookie that we haven't seen.

 

[sfidc3]

That's easy to say but at the end of the day you still have to go out there and produce. JD5 would looked great anywhere maybe not as great as he did in Washington but he did things as a rookie that we haven't seen.

Put him on a team with a good offensive line and you are very likely going to the SB.....The Eagles would have been undefeated with him at QB IMO.....

 

[jahsoul357]

That's easy to say but at the end of the day you still have to go out there and produce. JD5 would looked great anywhere maybe not as great as he did in Washington but he did things as a rookie that we haven't seen.

Looking at skillset, he probably wouldn't have looked good with us, the Bears, Jags, Browns, Patriots, and more. He still had to go out and produce but coaching, scheme, and situation made it much easier. A lot of us are really ignoring that Kingsbury's offense strengths and JD5's skillset were a match made in heavy.

Put him on a team with a good offensive line and you are very likely going to the SB.....The Eagles would have been undefeated with him at QB IMO.....

We are really dismissing the fact that Jalen Hurts has been to 2 Super Bowls and outplayed the so called "best QB in the league" twice because of how we feel about JD5? I can't and won't do that...lol. The Eagles offense is built around Hurts, the same way the Commanders offense is built around JD5. They won what they were supposed to and lost what they did and neither team would trade one for the other. The kicker about the Eagles going undefeated is they both basically lost to the same teams...lol

 

[St. Widge]

People are sleeping on Nuss. He did some things this past year that proves to me that he will be a guy at the next level. Saw this dude hit like 7-8 different receivers in games. That’s crazy

He also did many things that suggest that he will not be the guy at the next level. Do you remember how terrible he was against Ole Miss until the last year until about 6 minutes left in the game? And he was not good in about half the other games last year. I continue to say that he has talent but he is far too inconsistent at this point to be counted on as some sort of franchise savior. Dude only completed 64% of his passes last year and it's only that high because of his completion percentage against the cupcakes on the schedule. He even threw 12 interceptions to 29 TDs last year which is pretty bad for a college QB.

He looked good for most of the game against Wisconsin but even in that game his inconsistency showed up later. He might get there, but he has a long way to go before he should even be looked at as a first round pick.