Jameis upside is Unfathomable (3 Viewers)

[Will Survive]

...a lot of the conversation here mirrors the kind of hopeful speculation I've seen in Tampa each year from 2015 when he was drafted thru 2020 when he was let go.

Because alot of the speculators here now, were doing the same speculating in TB from 2015 - 2020?

 

[Belfast Saint]

I would argue that Winston's upside is both fathomable and limited, rather than unfathomable and unlimited. Suggesting the latter is just hyperbole. What can be achieved as a QB is pretty well defined and falls within a documented range.

I've never been a huge fan of Winston (played for FSU, played for the Bucs, did stupid stuff, etc). But as he's a Saint now that stance has softened. He may have been a bit of an idiot, but he's our idiot now, and it feels like he may not be an idiot, or at least less of an idiot, than before.

Let me be clear, I don't really have a horse in this QB competition race. I'm glad at least it's been made a competition because that requires both to be at their absolute best, which is good for us.

If Winston does win the competition, I think we could have a very capable and talented QB on our hands. He's been prolific at times, though sloppy. What we need is less sloppy at the cost of some of the prolific. Winston seems to intimate that he understands that, but it's hard to suppress your nature which for him is to go for it, be impressive, be seen as the difference maker. That's where I hope he's matured enough to reign in those instincts.

 

[60minutes]

It is Jameis’s job to lose.

 

[Belfast Saint]

It is Jameis’s job to lose.

One would have to imagine so. Definitely has the inside track based on experience and skins on the wall.

 

[Semper]

Should the Saints cut Granderson then? Read up on why he was late to training camp in 2019. In contrast Winston was convicted of no crimes. Just curious.

Personally I think yes. I don't need a team of real Saints. However sexual assault is one of those things where I draw the line.

 

[Semper]

Also unfathomable? Everything I see this I think of the movie Megamind where space dad says that, and then says, "without fathom." LOL

 

[EGLSShin]

Seems like Hill was motivated enough to be 3-1 as a starter, and should have won the Philly game had the defense been able to stop the Eagles run game. Both Hurts and Sanders ran for over a 100 yards against us. That's what lost us that game.

JW, even with his incredible 5000 yard season, was 28-42 as a starter. His best year, he was 9-7. He obviously can "sling the rock", but can he win???

We will see.

The year they went 9-7 was 2016, Tampa had the rank 15th defense that year. JW had 28TD's, 18int's 4090 yards and like 60.8% comp. He threw the football 567 times that season. All the other years, their defense was ranked near the bottom. Young QB, trying to be a hero and carrying the load, forcing throws and making errant decisions because their defense couldn't stop anyone. In the infamous 30 INT season, Jameis threw the ball 626 times and Tampa had the 29th ranked Defense.

To compare to Brees in our worst seasons.

2007 we went 9-7. Brees 28TD's, 18 INT, 4423 yards, 67.5% comp. We threw the football 652 times that season.
2008 we went 8-8. Brees 34TD's, 17 INT, 5069 yards, 65.0% comp. We threw the football 635 times that season.
2012 we went 9-7. Brees 43TD's, 19 INT, 5177 yards, 63.0% comp. We threw the football 670 times that season.
2014 we went 9-7. Brees 33TD's, 17 INT, 4952 yards, 69.2% comp. We threw the football 659 times that season.
2015 we went 7-9. Brees 32TD's, 11INT, 4870 yards, 68.3% comp. We threw the football 627 times that season.
2016 we went 7-9 Brees 37TD's, 15INT, 5208 yards, 70.0% comp. We threw the football 673 times that season.

Brees was so good he was able to compete in those years with horrible defenses that couldn't stop anyone. Now the years we were exceptional with Brees.

2006 we went 10-6. We threw the football 554 times that season.
2009, we went 13-3. We threw the football 513 times that season.
2010, we went 11-5. We threw the football 658 times that season.
2011, we went 13-3, This was an anomaly year sort of like 2010. We threw the football 657 times that year.
2017. We went 11-5. We threw the football 536 times that season.
2018. We went 13-3. We threw the football 489 times that season.

Didn't include 2019/2020 due to Brees missing games. As you can see, the years we were bad, we threw the football too much. In the years we were good, We were way more balanced and played slightly better defense in some years and much better defense in other years.

With the next QB, we're in big trouble if they have to throw the football 600+ times and if the defense is not at least top 10-15. As you can see, under Payton, our best seasons are when we play good to mid tier defense and are balanced on offense. If Jameis has to throw the ball 600+ times, it's gonna get ugly.

 

[limeyjohn]

All l know is that this is set to be one of the most fascinating pre-seasons l can remember

 

[los226]

Plain and simple.... Winston needs to improve on his decision making and the only way for anyone to know if he’s improved is to see him play in meaningful games where the pressure is real. And honestly the only way to improve is to have real game reps. So IMO there is nothing that he’s done with the Saints to improve that aspect. But I’m on the train of wanting Winston to succeed and be our next franchise QB because of his arm talent and draft pedigree.

 

[Jesse Custer]

I see people throw out "journeyman QB" without any idea of what that term actually means.

 

[Judge_Smails]

Personally I think yes. I don't need a team of real Saints. However sexual assault is one of those things where I draw the line.

I respect your consistency.

 

[dtc]

This is the NFL, not some flag rec league. If Jameis was clearly good enough, that "pinky promise," you'll start from Payton to Taysom would be out so fast your head would spin. Payton isn't going to lose the team by playing the inferior player at any position.

You want to know how a coach loses a team?

When the players stop trusting him, a coach loses the team.

You know how you make players stop trusting you as coach?

 

[Paul]

don't tell me what i can/can't fathom
i can fathom a lot

Please stop using words that force me to use a dictionary.

 

[xaeniac]

Just brutal. After hours isn’t pretty either

You want to know how a coach loses a team?

When the players stop trusting him, a coach loses the team.

You know how you make players stop trusting you as coach?

By losing?

 

[ThrowbackSaintXXL]

I'm sorry but that's such nonsense. The vast majority of his "detractors" - those of us who are Saints fans - hope to God we're wrong.

Then I guess it's a silent majority. The jury's back for a vocal minority