Saints Jameis Winston to N.O (merged - officially signed) (1 Viewer)

[DaSaints1967]

True. Brees threw an INT every 34 passes in SD. Winston has thrown an INT every 29 passes in TB.

Winston was constantly under pressure and was sacked 47 times last year. Pressure on a QB can make them do questionable things.

 

[SAINTSFAN]

Winston was constantly under pressure and was sacked 47 times last year. Pressure on a QB can make them do questionable things.

Yeah, Winston's INT rate is not that far off of Drew's when he was with SD, And last year, he took a lot of pressure and Arians was trying to push the ball down the field more. Before last year, his INT rate was every 33 passes.

 

[J.T.]

I like this move. Winston has some baggage, no doubt about it, but he just threw for over 5,000 yards and is coming in on a cheap deal to sit behind a future HOF QB on a one year deal. On top of that, he cost the team ZERO in draft capital and I think he's not a compensatory pick formula guy because he was cut. Not comparing his "character" to Teddy because Teddy is a special guy, but as a football player.....Winston has accomplished WAY more in the league than Teddy has done. Test cost the Saints a third round pick (they did get a sixth back) and will get the Saints back a third next year depending on the rest of free agency, Winston comes in for free in draft pick impact.

If Brees goes down, Winston has the ability to lead this team. I know he has issues and he needs to learn how to play in better control on the field, but I think this was a great move by all involved.

 

[Lustmord]

It's not official yet right?

 

[dutar76]

I'm not against this move. It's a 1 year deal. We need a QB for this season, similar to how we needed Teddy next year. Winston is by far the best QB sitting at home right now, in my opinion.

Do I like him? Not really.
Do I want him to be our future? Not really.

Folks can take this as a knock on Taysom if they want, but I'll say 3 things about that...

1. Our roster makes us a superbowl contender this year, but we actually have a challenger in our division now. We can't afford to lose games if Drew misses time and Taysom is also dinged or is not ready for whatever reason.

2. If Taysom really is our best option at QB going forward, then he should beat out any competition. This includes young veteran QBs that have shown they can throw fro lots of yards and TDs. (and INTs)

3. With no offseason program, we need a veteran QB who can come in and get up to speed quickly.


As for Winston... He's been a knucklehead since college. He's his own worst enemy on and off the field. A change of scenery could help him with that, along with being humbled by getting cut in his prime by the team that drafted him.

IF we have to actually use him as our QB this year, I think he'll be better than he was in Tampa and possibly better in our offense than Teddy was. Teddy is naturally "careful" with the football. Almost timid with it. Even so, Sean Payton held Teddy back on purpose and slowly loosened his leash. The result? Few mistakes but low production.

But Winston is naturally NOT "careful" with the football. If he has to play QB for us, I'd think that Sean puts a similar leash on him, BUT with Winston being a natural "shot-taker", we won't be yelling PULL THE TRIGGER!!! He'd likely make more mistakes than Teddy, but I think our offense would be more deadly as it seems to function a lot better when we have a guy willing to push the ball down the field.

 

[St. Widge]

So objectively speaking, there's no way Hill could beat out Jameis in an open QB battle. If Jameis matures this season under Drew and SP, then we have a top 5 QB for the next 5-10 years. Simply put - he is that good.

Drew will put him through a training regiment unlike anything he has ever seen. He will study more film than he has in HS, college, or TB combined. He will learn how to avoid those turnover by being prepared and knowing what tricks the defense is trying to play. Drew and SP are going to unlock all of his potential. I really like this.

And as a side note, shame on Bruce Arians. I get it, Jameis wasn't your guy. But, he never even gave him a chance and blamed everything on him. Yes, 30 ints in a season is awful. But so is no run game, no oline, and no defense. There were much more issues than just Jameis. He 100% scapegoated him, and I've actually been pretty suprised at Jameis's restraint in the aftermath - outside of his "replaced by Tom" comment.

I agree with all of this. And I'll add that I dont' think Bruce Arians offense has adjusted to the realities of the modern game. He rarely uses his TE's or RBs in the passing game and doesn't really seem to use read progressions that end with an easy throw to a RB. It's an aggressive offense that requires a great offensive line and requires the QB to constantly put the ball in risky places with perfect throws. And, the Bucs have never had the offensive line around Winston to do it. Obviously most of it is Winston not doing it right, but Arians offense and a bad offensive line doesn't help.

I mean, I know this is Wikipedia, but look at these quotes from Arians about how to play QB for him. This is exactly how Winston was taught to play and a big part of why he turns the ball over so much:

"Arians' coaching philosophy can be summed up with one phrase: “No risk it no biscuit, You can’t live scared.” His former quarterback in Arizona, Carson Palmer, says, “You play for him, you see he just has guts. He will let it rip let it fly no matter what.”[7] He first developed this philosophy when the old timers at the bar he worked at in college told him, "In life you must take risks." During games he will always give the quarterback at least two options based on how the defense lines up. "One option will give us a chance to make a first down and the other option will give us a chance to score a touchdown." All his quarterbacks must believe, “If I have the right match up and the opportunity is there to take a shot at the deep ball, take it. I don’t care if it’s a third and-and-three; if our best receiver is in single coverage and he’s running a deep post route, throw him the gosh darned ball.” [8]

One thing Arians cannot stand is when coaches play not to lose. He considers conservative coaching to be a cardinal sin. In his book, he writes, “That’s not my way brother. I’ll never be too afraid to throw it and take the heat if it’s incomplete. My job as an offensive coach is not to allow our defense to retake the field. Run out the clock and kneel down-that’s my job.”[8]"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bruce_Arians

Only two options? Throw for the first or throw the deep ball? Always take the deep throw in single coverage even if an easy first down is there? Payton is a risk taker, but he knows that is not how you run an offense. And it's not how you control a defense.

 

[St. Widge]

It's not official yet right?

Not yet, but word seems to be that they are just waiting until it would not affect getting future comp picks in the draft.

 

[St. Widge]

Of course not all accusations of rape are true and we should never automatically believe accusations. The thing is, Florida State had to settle a Title IX lawsuit with one of Winston's female accusers for $950,000; universities don't pay out that kind of money when there's nothing there. Florida State had handled the woman's case so badly that it had to commit to a five-year sexual assault awareness and prevention program. And then Winston paid the woman a settlement in a separate civil suit to prevent the case from going to court. And, of course, there is the Uber incident. And the crab legs incident. And the 30 picks last year with 7 pick-sixes (new NFL record) don't exactly speak to great decision making on the field either. Teddy Bridgewater was an incredible leaders with tremendous character. Jameis Winston not so much.

To be fair, that suit was based on how Florida State handled the accusations, not whether or not the accusations were true.

And yes, there is smoke around Winston and I'm not a big fan of him as a person. And that's only because I don't know that the accusations are true. If I knew they were, I would think he was a piece of garbage.

At the same point, there is no proof that any of it is true and I don't know the guy. But, I do trust that Payton, Loomis, Ireland and the leaders on the team like Davis, Jordan, Malcolm Jenkins, and Brees do know Winston. (And I'm also sure that the NFL and the Saints have had people investigate all the allegations.) So, if they think he is not that guy, or that he may have been, but he has grown up, then I'm okay giving him a one year deal to see how he fits. I mean, no matter what I might think of him personally, he would likely start for several NFL teams right now and that's a really nice think to have sitting on your bench behind your 42 year old HOF QB.

 

[Jesse Custer]

I don't buy the Arians hype. Everywhere he's gone, turnovers go up in the first year of his system. He's basically Rex "Sex Cannon" Grossman if he was a coach. I wonder how he's going to adapt his system to fit Brady.

 

[saintsmarchin]

I may be in the minority here....

but if Sean Payton can QB coach Kerry Collins to a Superbowl... whats to say he can't fix Jameis' issues?

 

[kizzy821]

Some players don't feel like Saints to me. Ricky Williams was never a Saint. Martin Gramatica was not a Saint. Neither was Brandon Browner, Kerry Collins or Adrian Peterson. They didn't belong in New Orleans and you could sense it from the beginning. That's how I'd feel about Jameis. He'd likely give us bad juju because he's dripping in that bad juju vibe.

 

[Igordão]

Not happy with this move in the least. Winston's been the laughing stock of the division since his arrival. Now all of a sudden, he's gonna be GOOD?!

Just don't see it.

God, I hope I'm wrong.

It's not that serious. The worse that can happen is he is not good and is cut.

 

[Bill]

Maybe a steady diet of W’s will help straighten this kid out.

It can't hurt.

 

[44slayer]

The idea is similar to Bridgewater. You have an aging QB, another qb you use all over the field, so you need a plus level 3rd qb. Bridgwater was a guy others wanted to follow. He didnt have the biggest arm. He wasnt going to win games by himself. He also wasnt going to lose games for you. He was a game manager when we just needed a game manager. But he was locker room gold.

WInston has the ability to win games, and lose games. Athletically, the gap between him and Bridgewater is vast. Winston is a prototypical QB physically. But he just cant get out of his own way. His leadership is questionable at best, maybe he will mature being in this culture.

With Bridgewater you had a middle of the road starter. You needed a defense to play well. You needed ST to contribute. Teddy wasnt going to put a team on his shoulders, but he wasnt going to be the reason you lost. With Winston, he can put a team on his shoulders, but you have just a big of a chance that he is the reason you lose. I think the upside of WInston in Paytons offense makes this a good move because the locker room is strong enough to keep him in line. This is a good move for both the Saints and Winston.

This is a very, very odd statistic from PFF:

Most turnover worthy plays in a single season since 2006 Jameis Winston (2019) - 40 Carson Palmer (2013) - 40 Andrew Luck (2012) - 40 All in their first season with Bruce Arians.

14 years. The 3 highest turnover seasons - all 40. From 3 different QBs playing in their first season under Bruce Arians. Tom Brady should be careful.


Another stat: Taysom Hill has 7 completions to Saints players. Jameis Winston has 10.

 

[timpoulos]

I am really shocked. Winston is a poor choice and not a good locker room fit. He is arrogant and uncoachable, This is a huge mistake

Oh really? What year did you play with him? And I think CSP knows him a little better than you do....... I hated Winston but he's a great backup