Loomis on WWL 11/28 (3 Viewers)

[Saintslfc13]

Deshuan Watson
Derek Carr
Dennis Allen X2
Pete Carmicahel X2
Fleeced on Olave. CGJ trades
Bad drafts
Bad contract extensions (Jordan, Davis, Ruiz, Johnson)

Need I go on?

I wasn't high on Watson but a lot of fans were very much on board and despite his off-field issues, the consensus around the league was that on the field he was a young QB that proved he could play at high level for a Texans franchise that's never really got off the ground and some would call dysfunctional. His play for the Browns (another largely dysfunctional franchise if we're being honest) hasn't been too great from what I've seen but at the time he was seen as the best available QB and we were in the conversation for him. I don't really hold that against Loomis.

Derek Carr is on Loomis because he hired DA and let DA go get his guy so that's fair to assign some blame to him for that, he did build an out after 2 years into the contract though. Unfortunately for most of us 11 games have been enough.

Hiring Dennis Allen after Payton decided to "retire" was a bad decision in hindsight but I don't think Mickey or Gayle really expected Sean to walk away and by that point Loomis decided continuity was the way to go after an injury plagued previous year. We followed that up with another injury plagued year that gave DA a mulligan, rightly or wrongly (and it sure looks wrongly at the moment).

Carmichael I agree should've been let go the second he said he didn't really want the job (and perhaps the whole continuity idea should've been scrapped at that moment but by then the other candidates were probably off the table). That one I will give you. On the other side of that though, he's allowing his coach to choose his staff. Most coaches want to have that power in an organization. The problem with that comes when the coach refuses to acknowledge the problem and fire his friends, something we saw with Sean for the first half or so of his time here. Sean eventually realized that if he wanted to turn the corner he had to hire someone more qualified to run the defense and let them handle the hiring on that side of the ball, while he focuses on what he does best. Unfortunately for DA and us, I don't think he has that in him. He seems to want to be liked too much. Payton's got friends obviously, but I don't think he really cares if too many people like him, at least not from a coaching/boss standpoint. So sure we can blame Loomis for not going over DAs head, but there's every chance that narrative gets spun into "Mickey Loomis is the kind of GM that doesn't let his coaches stand on their own choices". That's not necessarily a very attractive trait for a GM to have.

I don't really think we got fleeced on either trade in hindsight. Olave's a great young receiver and with a better QB/OC would likely be lighting it up more often than he already does. He's got some things to work on with focus sure but other than that the only thing he really lacks is size. The CGJ trade looked bad last season but after a great year with the Eagles they too decided to let him walk and he only got a prove it deal with Detroit then got hurt. That tells me that he's got a bad reputation around the league for whatever reason.

If the good drafts are on Ireland, I'm going to say the bad drafts are on Ireland. I'm sure DA has plenty of input there too because that's what we did with Payton, and they've always talked about continuity.

I don't mind the Saints showing a bit of loyalty to a long time player like Cam Jordan, or a fan favorite and team leader like Demario Davis though I understand not everyone feels that way. The other two are fair enough but for me Ruiz has been one of our better lineman this year (not saying much I realize that). Johnson has been under-utlized like the rest of the TEs in the passing game, but sure if Loomis knew that was the plan then it was a bad decision.

 

[EvilMike]

Down the Line Loomis. We'll be in cap hell for years and losing games thanks to his decisions.

 

[Bayouboy]

Very disappointing. Loomis could have said some truths without throwing coaches under the bus. One has to hope and pray he doesn't really believe everything he said.

 

[silverbullet]

I wasn't high on Watson but a lot of fans were very much on board and despite his off-field issues, the consensus around the league was that on the field he was a young QB that proved he could play at high level for a Texans franchise that's never really got off the ground and some would call dysfunctional. His play for the Browns (another largely dysfunctional franchise if we're being honest) hasn't been too great from what I've seen but at the time he was seen as the best available QB and we were in the conversation for him. I don't really hold that against Loomis.

Derek Carr is on Loomis because he hired DA and let DA go get his guy so that's fair to assign some blame to him for that, he did build an out after 2 years into the contract though. Unfortunately for most of us 11 games have been enough.

Hiring Dennis Allen after Payton decided to "retire" was a bad decision in hindsight but I don't think Mickey or Gayle really expected Sean to walk away and by that point Loomis decided continuity was the way to go after an injury plagued previous year. We followed that up with another injury plagued year that gave DA a mulligan, rightly or wrongly (and it sure looks wrongly at the moment).

Carmichael I agree should've been let go the second he said he didn't really want the job (and perhaps the whole continuity idea should've been scrapped at that moment but by then the other candidates were probably off the table). That one I will give you. On the other side of that though, he's allowing his coach to choose his staff. Most coaches want to have that power in an organization. The problem with that comes when the coach refuses to acknowledge the problem and fire his friends, something we saw with Sean for the first half or so of his time here. Sean eventually realized that if he wanted to turn the corner he had to hire someone more qualified to run the defense and let them handle the hiring on that side of the ball, while he focuses on what he does best. Unfortunately for DA and us, I don't think he has that in him. He seems to want to be liked too much. Payton's got friends obviously, but I don't think he really cares if too many people like him, at least not from a coaching/boss standpoint. So sure we can blame Loomis for not going over DAs head, but there's every chance that narrative gets spun into "Mickey Loomis is the kind of GM that doesn't let his coaches stand on their own choices". That's not necessarily a very attractive trait for a GM to have.

I don't really think we got fleeced on either trade in hindsight. Olave's a great young receiver and with a better QB/OC would likely be lighting it up more often than he already does. He's got some things to work on with focus sure but other than that the only thing he really lacks is size. The CGJ trade looked bad last season but after a great year with the Eagles they too decided to let him walk and he only got a prove it deal with Detroit then got hurt. That tells me that he's got a bad reputation around the league for whatever reason.

If the good drafts are on Ireland, I'm going to say the bad drafts are on Ireland. I'm sure DA has plenty of input there too because that's what we did with Payton, and they've always talked about continuity.

I don't mind the Saints showing a bit of loyalty to a long time player like Cam Jordan, or a fan favorite and team leader like Demario Davis though I understand not everyone feels that way. The other two are fair enough but for me Ruiz has been one of our better lineman this year (not saying much I realize that). Johnson has been under-utlized like the rest of the TEs in the passing game, but sure if Loomis knew that was the plan then it was a bad decision.

Fans aren't that smart usually and any fan that wanted Watson at his price is especially lacking in intelligence. So that's no excuse for a GM. You can't hire a sex offender as the leader of your team and then give him a crazy contract.

No hindsight with Allen. He should have never been hired and any non-biased rational unemotional GM could have seen that. His defenses have been overrated for years and ALWAYS choke. His history with the Raiders and meh personality were even starker warnings. This was very predictable. This is not hindsight from me. I said this from the beginning.

We've gotten fleeced on almost every trade we make. Davenport, Penning, Olave, CGJ. None were good trades.

You simply can't screw your cap with guaranteed money to guys in their mid 30s like that. Make it incentive laden or something, but those contracts are albatrosses.

It was the epitome of delusion to think you could contend without Payton and Brees. One or the other, maybe. Without both? Ridiculous. That was the time to stock assets and picks and find the next franchise QB. Not kick the can down the road with an all-time worse coach and then allow that dude to sign a very mediocre losing QB to a huge deal.

Bottom line, is Mickey destroyed any chance of this team being competitive for at least 3-4 years. The longer he keeps Allen the longer it will take to clean up. But knowing him, he'll trade up in the first again this year and we'll be right back here next November.

 

[Rexman100]

I did not hear the interview. I have no interest in listening. Loomis says nothing of value in public. My concern is that I do not know how much of value he has said behind closed doors in several years.

To say the Saints have the right people in place is crazy. What if Loomis has simply said this: We still have a good chance to win our division. We have high expectations. At times this season, we have not played well enough, and our expectations have not been met. We still have a number of games left. Let's see what happens, and after the season, we will review the job performance of everyone in this organization, including myself, to see what we did wrong, what we can do better, how we can play more consistently, and what we need to do going forward to achieve the high goals we have. Can we achieve what we set out to achieve? Yes. Am I satisfied with our play thus far? That is a different question, and obviously we need to play--and I expect us to play--much better than we have.

But the real problem is the general manager giving the interview. He was given total control, and he is bringing back the pre-Jim Mora days. And his refusal to acknowledge that his win-now approach, his selection of Dennis Allen as head coach, his selection of Derek Carr as quarterback, and his continued acceptance of Carmichael as offensive coordinator were blunders is irreparably damaging the franchise.

Really? So you expect ML to admit to the public, right this minute, that he made a mistake with Da and Carr and PC, while they sit at 5-6? Do you think that would somehow motivate them to play better, when your boss literally calls you a blunder on the radio? the word salad before that, is what ML says. So I don’t see where you’re going with that.

 

[gumbotron]

Mickey : yeah,look..yeah ,look,look ,yeah ,yeah ,look...

 

[saintsfan6767]

I think this is just Loomis instilling confidence into the staff for the time being until their results leaves him no choice but to move on from them in the offseason.

Coaches are on a week to week basis at this point. I don’t see Loomis sticking to the we have the answers in the building theme after a loss to the Lions and more losses after.

IMO carr needs to be released and so does dennis allen and pete carmichael

 

[NS_Saint]

I'm honestly shocked at how many fans are taking every word that ML says at face value. Look at the context of the situation. He's the GM and his team is, due to absurd circumstances, still very much in the hunt to win the division and make the playoffs. What do you want him to say? Do you go throughout your adult life everyday taking everything people tell you literally? Read between the lines.

 

[BikesBurgersBeer]

Loomis is not going to come out and say he doesn't have confidence in someone while they are on the payroll.

Until Allen is fired Loomis will support the coaching staff. He's not setting Allen up to fail, he's giving Allen every chance to succeed while not throwing him under the bus.

That's good management. It's the kind of workplace environment people want to be at.

When we move on from Carmicheal, Allen, Loomis won't throw them under then either.

I'm happy this organization doesn't operate with that kind of dysfunction at the top.

 

[SpeckKillerII]

He is gaslighting us.

He’s insulting everyone’s intelligence!!!!!

 

[RJ in Lafayette]

By his statements, Loomis is (a) delusional, (b) truly incompetent, or (c) totally mendacious. Take your pick. I vote (b), though there is some mendacity at play because no one, not even Loomis, can be so blind and clueless to believe what Loomis said. Support for Allen is cover for Loomis. Allen was his choice. Regardless of your selection, Loomis should be dismissed--or in Benson world, reassigned-- the day after the season ends. The odds of that happening are 1 in 20.

Every year Loomis sets this organization back. He is ultimate reason for this organization's current struggles and bleak immediate future.

Going forward, we do not have the right head coach, we do not have the right quarterback, we have a horrible salary cap picture, we extended contracts to aging players, and we have one of the oldest teams in the league. And in my opinion, for the reasons just listed, we do not have the right general manager.The future looks great, doesn't it.

And some of you keep saying we have all this great young talent. Name them. About two weeks ago, I started a thread asking people to name who were the blue-chip (top five at his position) and red-chip (top 10 at his position) on this team. Few could name many players under 30. Think Loomis is a great GM--name them.