Prefer type of coach? An offensive, A defensive, or a middle guy? (3 Viewers)

[StudioSaint]

New Haven and Rhode Island ??? There are HS programs better than that!!!!
SMH
OK go ahead and name me a successful HC that had no experience being a OC, DC or even a position coach in the NFL or even a D1 school. It's never been done in the modern NFL

Shifting the goal posts again from the NFL to the "modern NFL." You're objectively wrong and it's a waste of time to list names, because then you'll come up with more exclusions to exclude them.

The closest you could come is Levy but he was a HC in the CFL...

"But this and but that..." is why it's a waste of my time to list names for you. First you say name a coach with NFL or major college. Okay, Levy. "But he was a HC in the CFL..." You never mentioned anything about the CFL until someone pointed out that Levy makes your opinion not the absolute truth you keep defending it as being.

No matter what anyone says, you will come up with an excuse why Rizzi can't be a successful head coach. That's an irrational opinion, because no one can no the future and there's always a first time for everything.

No skin off my back though, because neither one of us have any say at all in the matter. The Saints are going to do whatever they want to do regardless of what you or I think about. I don't sweat the things I can't influence or control.

You mistakenly believe that just because something rarely happens or has never happened, then it can never happen. Human history is one long and wide tapestry of things happening for the first time.

By the end of the season Rizzi will have at least 8 games as a head coach. If he is successful during those 8 games, then that will be a better indicator of potential as a head coach than any genius OC or DC, who has never been a head coach in the NFL, will have to offer. What's going to be your "but" about Rizzi if he has a successful 8 game run as headcoach?

 

[St. Geezy]

I strongly prefer an offensive HC in today’s game. Not just for the offensive-centric game strategy and their more aggressive nature, but also because I think it’s good for continuity, never having to worry about the offensive brains of your team in the form of a coordinator leaving for a HC gig.

If a good offensive minded HC is not an option, I prefer the “Leader of Men” model like a Tomlin, Dan Campbell, or Rizzi over the DC head coach model.

 

[St. Geezy]

New Haven and Rhode Island ??? There are HS programs better than that!!!!
SMH
OK go ahead and name me a successful HC that had no experience being a OC, DC or even a position coach in the NFL or even a D1 school. It's never been done in the modern NFL. The closest you could come is Levy but he was a HC in the CFL before he was HC in KC , and he bombed in KC before Buffalo.
Just because you've been the boss of a successful mom n pop store does not mean you hire that guy to run Wal-Mart

Why are you acting like being a NFL position coach, even for one year, is some sort of huge resume-clincher qualifier over running a ST unit? That’s silly.

You’re arguing a point that seems sort of petty and inconsequential, and treating the title of ST Coordinator as if it makes a coach a total buffoon when it comes to the rest of the game, like they don’t know ball or something.

A good NFL ball coach is a good NFL ball coach. You don’t think Sean Payton can step right in and coach someone’s DB unit? You don’t think Andy Reid could go coach someone’s DL? You don’t think Sean McVay can have someone’s ST unit on-point, including teaching a kicker how to kick?

Just because coaches are known for or specializes in one thing doesn’t mean they don’t know other parts of the game. These men are all football SCHOLARS, including Rizzi, and perhaps more importantly to this topic, are quick-studies in general if they need to learn more finer points about a certain football topic or position.

There are better arguments you can find than this. So if Rizzi coaches a team’s tight ends for one single year, only NOW is he qualified to be a HC in your eyes?

“SMH”

 

[St. Geezy]

If you want to argue that a guy that’s never coached an offensive position group shouldn’t be your offensive coordinator, or likewise with defense, sure.

But coaching a specific position group shouldn’t be a qualifier for the HC job, unless of course you’re hiring a coordinator/playcaller type HC.

If you’re not hiring a play-caller type, then all I need to know is this…

- Do you know the finer points of basic football like virtually everyone coaching at this level?

- Can you motivate a team full of lifelong alpha males, turn them into subordinates that will listen to your every word and have them excited to do their jobs?

- Can you hire the right supporting cast and manage them well while demanding excellence?

- Do you command respect and hold people accountable when not performing?

This is the “Leader of Men” model, and you indeed can be successful with this type of HC, and they don’t need to have coached a position group for a year to check those boxes.

Now, how good you can be at those things is what gets vetted out during the interview process; not everyone can be good at these things, so this is what you work at to find out when interviewing and speaking to references and such. But as far as initial qualifications, being a position coach for a year for a “Leader of Men” type shouldn’t be on it.

There are lifelong position coaches that will never even be considered for a coordinator or HC positions, ever. Position coach lifers…this isn’t some super-gifted qualifier that it is being made out to be.

 

[mdharper]

Aggressive.

Doesn't matter the pedigree. Football is a game of channeled emotion. You have to maintain intensity to be great. Chopping wood doesn't get it done.

 

[BayouSAINTJoe]

I'd prefer someone with an offensive system that they own...reason being if you don't own the system as a HC you're succeptible to poaching then having to re-invent your offense under a new coordinator as your reward for having success.

I also want someone who can genuinely relate to the players...doesn't necessarilly have to be an alpha, but someone who the players respect and dont mock like us fans did. Finding out that they were mocking the wood chopping references was hilariously heartbreaking. Another "must have" ...a HC that holds ALL players to the same standard and doesn't throw player A under the bus to protect player B.

There was no leadership at the top and the play suffered as a result.

 

[MikeyF]

I prefer a person who knows how to motivate his team to win games & championships!

 

[saintsmarchin]

If rizzi breaks off a 6 to i game win streak his first year.. I don't see how we would have anyone else.

 

[Snakehead]

New Haven and Rhode Island ??? There are HS programs better than that!!!!
SMH
OK go ahead and name me a successful HC that had no experience being a OC, DC or even a position coach in the NFL or even a D1 school. It's never been done in the modern NFL. The closest you could come is Levy but he was a HC in the CFL before he was HC in KC , and he bombed in KC before Buffalo.
Just because you've been the boss of a successful mom n pop store does not mean you hire that guy to run Wal-Mart

There's not many examples, but they have already been pointed out to you. These former DCs and former OCs keep getting fired left and right while one of the last ST guys to get a shot has stuck for nearly 2 decades. You don't like Rizzi for some unknown reason or don't think he should get the job even though he's earning it, check.

 

[Optimistic Ozzy]

Raheem Morris is about as bad record wise as Dennis Allen.

Losing 38-6 to an average Broncos team ain’t it.

Another reason I say we DO have a chance at winning the division. Slim, but it's there.

 

[3ParStillDriver]

I don't think its long until Joe Brady is a head coach. If he doesn't get a head coach job this year coming offseason, as long as he keeps up the performance next season he's sure to get one after that.

Joe Brady is known to be pretty fiery. The issue, is as of right now you can't just bring in a new HC and keep most of the current staff around. You'll have to replace Rizzi and his jizzies too.

That may not hold well with the players. It seems the players like Rizzi a lot. We could have yet again, another Raiders debacle on our hands this offseason. Just like the Raiders players demanded to keep Peirce, we could see the same for Saints players and Rizzi.

Turns out, hiring a Raiders head coach, and getting a Raiders QB, really did turn us into the Raiders in more ways then we anticipated, and getting rid of the Raiders head coach may not be enough to distinguish the saints away from the raiders path.

Maybe we should go a different route then the Raiders?

 

[sfidc3]

I'm definitely not saying its post-season or bust for Rizzi. ( I think we have enough stock to show this team's current potential) The challenges will be there. There are playoff team matchups remaining against teams that need wins. That is the ultimate test. Winning a game against an expected playoff team that cant really afford a loss. LAR, GB, WSH & TB are those games. TB is a must win. go 2-1 or 3-0 against those other teams, win the easier matchups and its not that crazy of an idea. We just need Atlanta to be Atlanta.

I hear you, I just think it's unrealistic to believe our secondary (unless the pass rush really, really improves quickly) will hold up against LAR, GB and WSH.....we may get one win out of those 3, maybe, IMO.....the TB WR group much like ours has been decimated by injury.....

There have been successful head coaches who had very similar resumes to Rizzi's.


Right back at you brother.


You're changing your criteria to defend your opinion, instead of re-evaluating your opinion. That's one of many reasons I'm delighted that you have zero say in how the Saints are run.

He's impossible to have a rational/reasonable discussion with, he is all over the place and when you point out that he is dead wrong or a hypocrite he moves the goalposts again.....

 

[RJS]

I don't think its long until Joe Brady is a head coach. If he doesn't get a head coach job this year coming offseason, as long as he keeps up the performance next season he's sure to get one after that.

Joe Brady is known to be pretty fiery. The issue, is as of right now you can't just bring in a new HC and keep most of the current staff around. You'll have to replace Rizzi and his jizzies too.

That may not hold well with the players. It seems the players like Rizzi a lot. We could have yet again, another Raiders debacle on our hands this offseason. Just like the Raiders players demanded to keep Peirce, we could see the same for Saints players and Rizzi.

Turns out, hiring a Raiders head coach, and getting a Raiders QB, really did turn us into the Raiders in more ways then we anticipated, and getting rid of the Raiders head coach may not be enough to distinguish the saints away from the raiders path.

Maybe we should go a different route then the Raiders?

I think the better Raiders comparison would be Rich Bisaccia taking over as the interim following Gruden. He had a winning (7-5) record and got the Raiders into the playoffs. Even though the players loved the guy, he was moved out in favor of the Josh McDaniel experience.

That blew up spectacularly and the Raiders hired interim Antonio Pierce. Maybe their situation would be better if they would have stuck with Bisaccia?

 

[DSnfla]

Shifting the goal posts again from the NFL to the "modern NFL." You're objectively wrong and it's a waste of time to list names, because then you'll come up with more exclusions to exclude them.


"But this and but that..." is why it's a waste of my time to list names for you. First you say name a coach with NFL or major college. Okay, Levy. "But he was a HC in the CFL..." You never mentioned anything about the CFL until someone pointed out that Levy makes your opinion not the absolute truth you keep defending it as being.

No matter what anyone says, you will come up with an excuse why Rizzi can't be a successful head coach. That's an irrational opinion, because no one can no the future and there's always a first time for everything.

No skin off my back though, because neither one of us have any say at all in the matter. The Saints are going to do whatever they want to do regardless of what you or I think about. I don't sweat the things I can't influence or control.

You mistakenly believe that just because something rarely happens or has never happened, then it can never happen. Human history is one long and wide tapestry of things happening for the first time.

By the end of the season Rizzi will have at least 8 games as a head coach. If he is successful during those 8 games, then that will be a better indicator of potential as a head coach than any genius OC or DC, who has never been a head coach in the NFL, will have to offer. What's going to be your "but" about Rizzi if he has a successful 8 game run as headcoach?

OK then just take off the modern if that is what you need. You still have yet to name ANY names. Also forget that Levy was a HC in the CFL . He bombed as the HC at KC, his 1st HC job in the NFL
LOL when things have NEVER happened or rarely ever happened they are called EXTREME LONGSHOTS. And you want to trust the hire of an EXTREME LONGSHOT to The Saints. SMH
I never said Rizi should under no circumstances should be considered. I just see many red flags due to his lack of experience on the offensive or defensive side of the ball at a high level of competition.
Also g and look at the interim HC that have had the interim taken off and see how they have done, Antonio Pierce ring a bell ?

And I'm still waiting for names, What successful HC in the NFL has never been an OC or DC or even a position coach in the NFL or even a major college? Go ahead I'll wait

 

[St. Geezy]

OK then just take off the modern if that is what you need. You still have yet to name ANY names. Also forget that Levy was a HC in the CFL . He bombed as the HC at KC, his 1st HC job in the NFL
LOL when things have NEVER happened or rarely ever happened they are called EXTREME LONGSHOTS. And you want to trust the hire of an EXTREME LONGSHOT to The Saints. SMH
I never said Rizi should under no circumstances should be considered. I just see many red flags due to his lack of experience on the offensive or defensive side of the ball at a high level of competition.
Also g and look at the interim HC that have had the interim taken off and see how they have done, Antonio Pierce ring a bell ?

And I'm still waiting for names, What successful HC in the NFL has never been an OC or DC or even a position coach in the NFL or even a major college? Go ahead I'll wait

So John Harbaugh’s one single year as a DB coach of the Eagles was the ultimate clincher? Without that one year, you don’t think he’s qualified?