Saints and Carr deal released $150M over 4 years $100M fully guaranteed (4 Viewers)

[Optimistic Ozzy]

100M guaranteed is not a 2yr deal given our cap. He’s our QB for 3-4yrs.

In reality, it's a 3 year deal.

 

[Optimistic Ozzy]

Carr gets paid and Loomis/Harley got to fully structure the contract from the ground up to benefit the Saints cap. Everyone wins because we don't have to suffer through Dalton 2, the Daltoning.

There can be only one.

 

[Optimistic Ozzy]

Looking to the draft and free agency, what scared me the most about this deal is that means the Saints are all in and will use money and picks to make a run hopefully happen. While the money and picks themselves do not scare me, the mortgaging of the future, trading picks from this year and next year scare the crap out of me. Hopefully Dennis and Pete prove me wrong but if this doesn't work it slows down a rebuild and gives what should be a new coach less and less to work with when he gets here.

Not sure where you're getting that?

 

[Complex Kid]

You blow it up, get as much value for your 30+ year old players and accumulate draft picks. Next, you absorb all of the dead cap this year while we run with QB’s that havent had the chance in the off chance we strike gold on the way to holding enough collateral to find our future QB in 2024.

Except we can't absorb all of the dead cap this year. It's been said over and over. Even if we cut and traded every single player on the team we would not be cap compliant by the new league year. We HAVE to restructure a few guys to get under the cap just to be in compliance.

 

[guillermo]

You blow it up, get as much value for your 30+ year old players and accumulate draft picks. Next, you absorb all of the dead cap this year while we run with QB’s that havent had the chance in the off chance we strike gold on the way to holding enough collateral to find our future QB in 2024.

No, medicine doesnt taste good but it gets you well.

You dont settle for a QB and head coach that have done nothing but rack up losses in a seller’s market.

Reality of the matter is, the way that contracts are structures, you can't blow the roster up. Many players are as expensive or maybe even more if they are cut than playing with us.

 

[bigdaddysaints]

Looking to the draft and free agency, what scared me the most about this deal is that means the Saints are all in and will use money and picks to make a run hopefully happen. While the money and picks themselves do not scare me, the mortgaging of the future, trading picks from this year and next year scare the crap out of me. Hopefully Dennis and Pete prove me wrong but if this doesn't work it slows down a rebuild and gives what should be a new coach less and less to work with when he gets here.

Our team doesn't need a rebuild. We can win with what we have. Personaly, our biggest weakness is Coaching.

 

[HouseCall]

Our team doesn't need a rebuild. We can win with what we have. Personaly, our biggest weakness is Coaching.

The only thing I worry about - more than coaching - is that we actually don’t know what the roster is going to look like once Loomis and Hartley finish getting them under the cap.

As of now, the restructures have given the team some relief - but we still have some free agents on the roster to pay and if they can’t work the numbers out, we might see some valuable players leave or released.

So a lot of things still have to play out.

I have faith, but the next few weeks are crucial.

 

[Chopper Man]

I dont get the blow it up crowd I really dont. The Saints will never blow it up because they are in it to win it every single season. They may let a piece go here and there and replace it with former draft picks like they have done so many times. The Saints reload and that's the way it should be . You sustain a winning culture like the Patriots did for so many years, like the Rams in the 2000s, like the 49ers in the 80's and 90's. You dont blow up a team that is a few pieces away from making a run.

 

[Dome50]

I can't stand when fans (and it's only fans) suggest we "blow it up" and purposefully tank in order to draft some quarterback that may or not even be available or may or may not even be good. Like, the 2019 Bengals (with Dalton at qb) didn't go into that season setting out to go 2-14 in order to draft Joe Burrow. That is insanity. No team would adopt some losing culture. Have teams, late in the season, maybe taken the foot off the gas when it appears they are in line for a top pick? Sure. But to act as if it is some strategy, going into a season, to tank or "blow it up" in order to get high draft picks is nuts.

 

[Dome50]

I dont get the blow it up crowd I really dont. The Saints will never blow it up because they are in it to win it every single season. They may let a piece go here and there and replace it with former draft picks like they have done so many times. The Saints reload and that's the way it should be . You sustain a winning culture like the Patriots did for so many years, like the Rams in the 2000s, like the 49ers in the 80's and 90's. You dont blow up a team that is a few pieces away from making a run.

Exactly...if I ever got the sense the Saints were purposefully setting up their team to not be competitive I would drop my season tickets in a heartbeat. Coaches know they have a limited shelf life...no coach is agreeing to "blow it up," no player wants to be part of a team that is conducting itself that way. This is their livelihood. No one is playing Madden here.

 

[bclemms]

I dont get the blow it up crowd I really dont. The Saints will never blow it up because they are in it to win it every single season. They may let a piece go here and there and replace it with former draft picks like they have done so many times. The Saints reload and that's the way it should be . You sustain a winning culture like the Patriots did for so many years, like the Rams in the 2000s, like the 49ers in the 80's and 90's. You dont blow up a team that is a few pieces away from making a run.

Then why don't we get those few pieces? Oh yeah, we can't afford.

Every single team you listed had a Hall of Fame QB that won MVP's. Do you think Derek Carr is that guy?

 

[HouseCall]

I dont get the blow it up crowd I really dont. The Saints will never blow it up because they are in it to win it every single season. They may let a piece go here and there and replace it with former draft picks like they have done so many times. The Saints reload and that's the way it should be . You sustain a winning culture like the Patriots did for so many years, like the Rams in the 2000s, like the 49ers in the 80's and 90's. You dont blow up a team that is a few pieces away from making a run.

I think the “blow it up” mentality stems from the fact that, outside of Kansas City, who got Mahommes following a playoff season, it’s hard to be a contender without a franchise QB and it’s hard to field a contending team unless you drafted that QB high and lots of other high value players that you then can build a roster around while they play out their rookie deals.

The problem is that those bad years that you need to get high value draft picks are absolutely miserable and even if you stink and draft high, it doesn’t mean you hit on your picks.

I’m 46 and I don’t know how many Saints season I have left - none of us do.

So I’ve learned to take each season as its very own standalone entity. I’ll let the front office worry about the long term sustainability. For me - I’m all about 2023 and right now the Saints front office seems to be doing what they can to make 2023 a competitive season. That makes me happy.

They can blow it all up when I’m dead or feeble.

 

[Mojomajik9]

How long have teams like the Bengals, Bill, Chiefs, and Eagles effectively wandered in the wilderness? The first three we are actually talking decades. The Jim Kelly era. I was 12. Do you guys honestly think that’s a winning strategy? You want 3 decades of futility and praying maybe you’ll draft a QB who isn’t a total bust? But hey you got cap space. But no one wants to play for your sorry *** any more because you stink and are going no where.

For every Joe Burrow or Pat Mahomes you have 10 Tim Couches or Ryan Leafs. You blow it up and you blow up the culture as well. You’re a loser and you’re going to stay a loser for quite sometime. No thanks. I lived through the Ditka years.

“But Carr isn’t winning us a Super Bowl” whatever. Eli Manning has two rings not because he was a football god but because his team got into the playoffs, played good defense and got some luck. Drew Brees, a football god, has one ring and only made it to the big dance once. That’s the breaks. I feel we can get into the playoffs with Carr and our defense. Past that who knows, but damn at least the team has positioned itself to compete and potentially win. I’ll take that to waiting until I’m 65 to be good again.

 

[nakadish]

Then why don't we get those few pieces? Oh yeah, we can't afford.

Every single team you listed had a Hall of Fame QB that won MVP's. Do you think Derek Carr is that guy?

Outside of MT and Kamara, Payton left the cupboard pretty bare on the offensive side of the ball. DA "is" getting those pieces. Olave and Shaheed last year. Carr this year, and they will likely pick up more in the draft. The Saints are going to be a lot better this year than some are giving them credit for.

 

[HouseCall]

How long have teams like the Bengals, Bill, Chiefs, and Eagles effectively wandered in the wilderness? The first three we are actually talking decades. The Jim Kelly era. I was 12. Do you guys honestly think that’s a winning strategy? You want 3 decades of futility and praying maybe you’ll draft a QB who isn’t a total bust? But hey you got cap space. But no one wants to play for your sorry *** any more because you stink and are going no where.

For every Joe Burrow or Pat Mahomes you have 10 Tim Couches or Ryan Leafs. You blow it up and you blow up the culture as well. You’re a loser and you’re going to stay a loser for quite sometime. No thanks. I lived through the Ditka years.

“But Carr isn’t winning us a Super Bowl” whatever. Eli Manning has two rings not because he was a football god but because his team got into the playoffs, played good defense and got some luck. Drew Brees, a football god, has one ring and only made it to the big dance once. That’s the breaks. I feel we can get into the playoffs with Carr and our defense. Past that who knows, but damn at least the team has positioned itself to compete and potentially win. I’ll take that to waiting until I’m 65 to be good again.

I couldn’t agree more.

Also it’s important to point out that the season ending injury to Burrow in his rookie year actually accelerated their growth in that it meant they stunk the rest of the season and were able to get Chase - someone who Burrow had insane chemistry with already.

That’s how uncertain all of it is.

As you mentioned - some of these teams are terrible or nauseatingly average for decades.

While I don’t love that we are always in cap hell, as I said before - I’ll let Loomis and Hartley work that out. I want to watch competitive football and make the playoffs.