Breaking! Saints fired Dennis Allen (4 Viewers)

[guidomerkinsrules]

Loomis probably felt there was an optimal financial, structural (league calendar, et al) time to fire DA

Gayle, players other coaches had a more immediate social, cultural, emotional timetable they were working with

both can be right from their POV - Loomis just got outvoted and is trying to signal to potential coaches that they'll have a cushion of time to effect change

 

[ELLIASJWILLIAMS]

Loomis probably felt there was an optimal financial, structural (league calendar, et al) time to fire DA

Gayle, players other coaches had a more immediate social, cultural, emotional timetable they were working with

both can be right from their POV - Loomis just got outvoted and is trying to signal to potential coaches that they'll have a cushion of time to effect change

This consolidates the information beautifully.

 

[Rouxble]

On NFL Radio this morning, they were discussing Loomis’ earlier comments about Allen not being able to overcome injuries, and they didn’t interpret it as Loomis being reluctant to fire Allen. They saw the comments as more of a criticism of Allen, that as head coach he is expected to find a way to win with what he has, and losing seven in a row (with the seventh to a 1-7 team) was enough for Loomis to see that Allen isn’t capable of doing that. Almost similar to the criticism we hear about Carr, he can be a good QB if everything else around him is going well, but he doesn’t look like a guy that can create a win.

I didn’t expect the midseason firing because it’s not something that Loomis appears to do as a regular practice, but I get it, especially with all of the other recent news that came out after the firing.

 

[St. Widge]

Loomis probably felt there was an optimal financial, structural (league calendar, et al) time to fire DA

Gayle, players other coaches had a more immediate social, cultural, emotional timetable they were working with

both can be right from their POV - Loomis just got outvoted and is trying to signal to potential coaches that they'll have a cushion of time to effect change

Yep. Loomis even mentioned in the NOF interview that he thinks one of the reasons this is an attractive job is because this is a "first class organization" with a good reputation around the league. I think he thinks part of that is that it's a team that tends not to fire coaches mid-season, gives them time to prove they deserve the job, and does whatever they can do financially to give the coach the team he wants.

 

[AARPSaint]

I’ve been on the “It’s a bad idea to fire coaches midseason” side-- but good grief, you can’t NOT fire a head coach after they lose to the worst team in the league after losing the six games before that.

 

[ELLIASJWILLIAMS]

Random,

Did anyone listen to the Carr interview? He mentioned how they ran more plays yesterday in practice than they've done since he's been here, and one of the complaints that came out per Underhill is that the guys weren't praciticing hard enough under Allen.

I do recall the Vilma/Brees days of saying that Friday's were an aboslute BATTLE during our SB run. Doesn't sound like the players were getting those types of looks in practice and that may be why some guys just looked unprepared at times.

I listened to a coach a few days ago and he was saying penalties like holding happen when a guy does something that you don't expect and so you're reaction is to execute a hold. That's preparation. I just continue to find it crazy how Rizzi has come in and made these changes that were staring Allen right in the fact and he refused to just do something different.

 

[guillermo]

I think there is a nugget in this article that is more important than if Loomis was part of the decision of Allen being fired.

I quote from the article on what Loomis says:

"And I think (the idea of catching up on the salary cap) is overblown, as I've said in the past"

That comment is reason enough for me to wish he gets fired. It is time to take a different approach.

Just think about this, Kansas City has multiple championships, the salary of Mahomes, Kelsey and Chris Jones. They still have the flexibility to bring DeAndre Hopkins.
The Vikings, Ravens and Bills are playing competitive football even as they take hard decisions to keep their cap healthy.

Every year, we are using the credit card to extend veterans that don't play according to their cap hit, just to fit the cap.

Please leave!

 

[Super]

It’s an attractive job because the NFL head coach is the pinnacle of all football coaching jobs. Any team.

 

[ELLIASJWILLIAMS]

I think there is a nugget in this article that is more important than if Loomis was part of the decision of Allen being fired.

I quote from the article on what Loomis says:

"And I think (the idea of catching up on the salary cap) is overblown, as I've said in the past"

That comment is reason enough for me to wish he gets fired. It is time to take a different approach.

Just think about this, Kansas City has multiple championships, the salary of Mahomes, Kelsey and Chris Jones. They still have the flexibility to bring DeAndre Hopkins.
The Vikings, Ravens and Bills are playing competitive football even as they take hard decisions to keep their cap healthy.

Every year, we are using the credit card to extend veterans that don't play according to their cap hit, just to fit the cap.

Please leave!

I think he was simply saying we have a better understanding of how "our" cap works than the average person does, and we're fine w/ that. I don't disagree w/ him in that assessment. It's handicapped them to this point yes, but outside of him saying something perceived as defiant, their actions over the last two years definitely suggest that they are cognizant of it, and not looking to add to the issue unless it helps them win.

2018 Loomis would have traded for Adams in Week 4.

 

[St. Widge]

I’ve been on the “It’s a bad idea to fire coaches midseason” side-- but good grief, you can’t NOT fire a head coach after they lose to the worst team in the league after losing the six games before that.

Agreed. I don't like firing coaches mid-season but the DA situation seemed bad enough that you had to do it now. And with all the stuff now coming out about lack of mandatory warm-ups, putting Miller on IR when he is healthy a week later, defensive players complaining about lack of aggression, and Rizzi immediately replacing Grantham with Young as the DL coach, it's clear they could not go forward with DA. Change had to be made now and who knows how many other issues will come to light or we may never find out about.

I think in the end Loomis finally realized that after talking to Benson, Lauscha, and hearing the feedback the players gave to Benson. Loomis should have been the one finding these things out, but I think he was just dead set on not firing a coach mid-season.

 

[sfidc3]

Yep. Loomis even mentioned in the NOF interview that he thinks one of the reasons this is an attractive job is because this is a "first class organization" with a good reputation around the league. I think he thinks part of that is that it's a team that tends not to fire coaches mid-season, gives them time to prove they deserve the job, and does whatever they can do financially to give the coach the team he wants.

I understand this philosophy and it all sounds great.....but in reality?

Whilst giving the coach everything they want and the team continues to spiral, what exactly do you gain by keeping them on the entire season?

I don't think the HC prospects out there are saying "OMG the Saints firing DA (after nearly 3 years of.....nothingness) midseason was just horrible, they should have waited until the end of the season, I'll never coach there!!!!!"

It's more situational, and this rigid type of operating, with no consideration for the damage to the team, fanbase, etc is a recipe for disaster.....

What happens in these cases is a complete and total disregard for the fans, the folks that support the team, there are 2 sides to this equation and IMO this side rarely gets mentioned......Another thank you to Gayle for doing the right thing....Loomis should not be making decisions going forward IMO.....

 

[St. Widge]

It’s an attractive job because the NFL head coach is the pinnacle of all football coaching jobs. Any team.

Yes, but what tends to separate them more than anything, other than having a franchise QB, is whether the team has a good ownership group and front office that gives the coach the money he needs to build his staff and get the players he wants. I mean, even despite having Burrow, the situation with the Bengals isn't as attractive as it should be because their ownership is cheap and won't spend money to build the team and coaching staff around Burrow.

 

[St. Widge]

I understand this philosophy and it all sounds great.....but in reality?

Whilst giving the coach everything they want and the team continues to spiral, what exactly do you gain by keeping them on the entire season?

I don't think the HC prospects out there are saying "OMG the Saints firing DA (after nearly 3 years of.....nothingness) midseason was just horrible, they should have waited until the end of the season, I'll never coach there!!!!!"

It's more situational, and this rigid type of operating, with no consideration for the damage to the team, fanbase, etc is a recipe for disaster.....

What happens in these cases is a complete and total disregard for the fans, the folks that support the team, there are 2 sides to this equation and IMO this side rarely gets mentioned......Another thank you to Gayle for doing the right thing....Loomis should not be making decisions going forward IMO.....

I don't disagree, as I said above, I don't like firing coaches mid-season but the DA situation seemed bad enough that you had to do it now. I'm just saying that is likely how Loomis saw it. But I disagree with him on that and I think in the end even Loomis knew it had to be done now. He just didn't like doing it and put it off until the pressure from ownership, the players, and the fans got to be too much.

 

[Rexman100]

remember these people know that winning cures everything. Thats all they live and breathe to do. When DA lost to Carolina, there was no saving him. He's out. They still had a trump card in Rizzi that they were preparing to play if/when DA failed. Had the Saints crushed Carolina and looked like week 2, then DA stays another week. (because a win is a win) Had he won but only by 3 points, then IMO, hes still fired. Because they feel that Rizzi could be something. Rizzis first move was reorganizing the locker room, does this seem like a guy only planning on staying a short time? No, he feels he has a legit chance to turn this thing around. Will he? i dunno. But the "organizational" move was when do we pull the plug on DA. It wasnt some tyrant taking over making the move. This move gives us our best chance at winning, period. (ML also has a plug, but they are there yet with pulling it, imo)

 

[St. Geezy]

I think there is a nugget in this article that is more important than if Loomis was part of the decision of Allen being fired.

I quote from the article on what Loomis says:

"And I think (the idea of catching up on the salary cap) is overblown, as I've said in the past"

That comment is reason enough for me to wish he gets fired. It is time to take a different approach.

Just think about this, Kansas City has multiple championships, the salary of Mahomes, Kelsey and Chris Jones. They still have the flexibility to bring DeAndre Hopkins.
The Vikings, Ravens and Bills are playing competitive football even as they take hard decisions to keep their cap healthy.

Every year, we are using the credit card to extend veterans that don't play according to their cap hit, just to fit the cap.

Please leave!

It IS overblown. It’s a long term accounting project, not a hard cap.

If we wanted Hopkins, we could have gotten Hopkins.

People are only critical of it because they get anxious seeing negatives on singular future years and don’t know what the team’s internal numbers look like.

There are endless mechanisms available to borrow from future years, you can be over the cap in those future years free of charge, and those future years never run out.

Our roster is garbage mainly because our drafts have been garbage, and also injuries.