Breaking! Saints fired Dennis Allen (3 Viewers)

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Rexman100 said:
if we were 0-9 id agree. But we won 2 games in dominating style. Did the players tell DA, hey, you can have the locker room back, but only for two games, then you're done!
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Nope, winning cures everything.....it's when things get tough (injuries, losing, etc) that good winning cultures find a way, and flimsy, poorly coached teams fall apart.....

Even with this team completely healthy under DA I believe we still lose most of the close games and against the better teams.....not because the players aren't capable but because the leadership/decision making is so putrid.....

Last year was a sterling example of that IMO....
 
ELLIASJWILLIAMS said:
Not as much, I think he's echoing what Loomis said. The change is good, guys have pep in their step, you can see a difference from the players, but we have to see does that stick ie...does it lead to winning. Assuming they do would be naive, so his response fits what I'd expect someone to say in that scenario. It's a we'll see thought process.

Yet, you know at this point, thinking hasn't helped anyone. I'm just hopping it FEELS different from everyone.
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It can feel different very easily. All it would take is for Rizzi to gather his troops in the newly organized locker room and say. Something like, "hey all, i dont give a EFF about what happened before, this is MY MOFO TEAM NOW, NOW WHOS WITH ME? At first they may say, what whos this freaking guy?. But if they are competitors at heart they'll want to believe him. Rizzi could follow with something like, "ILL TELL YOU WHO THIS FREAKING GUY IS, THE GUY THATS GOING TO TURN THIS MOFO AROUND, IS WHO, I SAID, NOW WHOS WITH ME!! A true competitor would say, I love this guy, now lets effing go. Boom culture changed.
 
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BreesusSaves said:
To my understanding, under Loomis, the only coach/assistant fired mid-season was Rob Ryan. Every hire that was fired was done 4-5 days after Black Monday. That's just how he does things.
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I would bet Payton drove Rob Ryan out. That was decided season before when he brought Allen back here.
 
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ELLIASJWILLIAMS said:
I smirked at this. Just for raw logic purposes, typically firing a coach mid-season is a form of giving up or almost throwing your hands up. I don't think he wanted to send that signal, and I think there's proof of that because he'd just said they likely wouldn't be sellers. He and Allen during the offseason reiterated a lot, they aren't interested in trading guys who can help them win. So firing Allen mid-season was a subtle admission they don't think they can still win, and sending that message to the players can go either way.
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I smirked at @Big_L 's analogy, too. It was apt. And I agree that firing a coach in the middle of the season is not only not ideal but rarely turns out to be a good thing. But what if you hadn't fired that coach that you SHOULD have fired in the middle of LAST season at the appropriate time, I.E., at the end of last season. That, I think is the problem because most fans thought that's when it would happen.

I think that's when Mickey started losing us (the fans). Cos he was getting onboard with "keep doin' what yer doin'. Then he doubled down with "looking beyond the results" and it felt like a virtual flip off without the actual middle finger. And then people started turning on Gayle. After 7 straight losses, she finally did what should have been done in the off season.
 
Mr. Sparkle said:
Once the Payton/Brees Era teams started rolling the folks who run the Saints used to tell people they were the "NFC Patriots" (back when that was a very flattering comparison). They clearly hold themselves in very high regard and believe the Saints are among the League's premier teams like the Steelers, Giants, 49ers, Cowboys.

For a few years there, they might have been right, but I'm not sure they rest of the league has felt that way in some time. From the results on the field to the NFLPA surveys, the story seems to be the opposite.

As my old boss would say, if you could buy Loomis for what he's worth and sell him for what he thinks he's worth, you'd make a lot of money.

They need some new blood in there - in the same way Rizzi is shaking up the on field product with things like stretching (LOL), they need a cold-eye review of the entire football operation. I think they might find out they are operating a 2010 team in 2024.
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I don't disagree. I was just explaining how I think Loomis looks at it. I do think we need new blood at GM and certainly in scouting. And, FWIW, Loomis didn't totally shoot down the idea of the front office being restructured when Triplett asked about it in the article.

I don't think this organization is in the same league as the Steelers, Giants, 49ers, or Cheifs. And certainly not historically in the same league as the Cowboys, but they likely do have a better reputation than team like the Bengals, Browns, Chargers, and Raiders who have bad or just cheap ownership. I actually thought that other than the head coach and strangely food services the Saints ranked pretty high in the NFLPA survey rankings? But maybe I'm wrong.

But we don't have a big market or prestidge to offer potential coaches or front office people so you have to try to play to the advantages you have. A reputation for being a patient front office willing to spend to build and team and a staff is arguably one of those. Another, as much as it pisses some fans off is that we don't have a rabid sports media like a coach or GM would face in New York or Philly.
 
sfidc3 said:
Nope, winning cures everything.....it's when things get tough (injuries, losing, etc) that good winning cultures find a way, and flimsy, poorly coached teams fall apart.....

Even with this team completely healthy under DA I believe we still lose most of the close games and against the better teams.....not because the players aren't capable but because the leadership/decision making is so putrid.....

Last year was a sterling example of that IMO....
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We're trying to describe in words, feelings. So its difficult. But I agree with you. DA didnt connect enough with his team. They didnt love him intensily, i mean intensilty. The more like, liked him, and understood him. Harbaugh wins the lockerroom in one passionate speech. Of course, afterwards, the hard work has to be done. But the team doesnt care, because they are preparing for war under their new General. SD has the best D in the NFL in a matter of months. Guys love playing for Harbaugh. (I wont say that Gruden does the same thing, because ppl dont like him) I just dont have that feeling about DA, his after win lockerroom speeches were...meh.
 
Madmarsha said:
I smirked at @Big_L 's analogy, too. It was apt. And I agree that firing a coach in the middle of the season is not only not ideal but rarely turns out to be a good thing. But what if you hadn't fired that coach that you SHOULD have fired in the middle of LAST season at the appropriate time, I.E., at the end of last season. That, I think is the problem because most fans thought that's when it would happen.

I think that's when Mickey started losing us (the fans). Cos he was getting onboard with "keep doin' what yer doin'. Then he doubled down with "looking beyond the results" and it felt like a virtual flip off without the actual middle finger. And then people started turning on Gayle. After 7 straight losses, she finally did what should have been done in the off season.
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Agreed. Mickey should of relieved DA of his coaching duties at the end of last season and maybe had him do something else to save face, like some kind of promotion where he doesn't really do anything. However he didn't and his hand was pretty much forced. No doubt this mid season firings hardly ever work, but it had to be done. It was way past time.
 
They didn't want to fire someone mid year because it reflects poorly on the organization in how they treat coaches and show patience.

It's not surprising that we're learning about his handling of the locker room and injuries and his approach to practices. I think you can expect to see more leaky stories about what DA did poorly so that it helps save face on the decision.
 
Bourbon said:
They didn't want to fire someone mid year because it reflects poorly on the organization in how they treat coaches and show patience.

It's not surprising that we're learning about his handling of the locker room and injuries and his approach to practices. I think you can expect to see more leaky stories about what DA did poorly so that it helps save face on the decision.
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That may be true, but it's not like most of this is being leaked in secret. Rizzi is telling us straight up.
 
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